# Pact with the Devil - How To? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 14, 2010, 11:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919 "2010-01-14T11:47:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![dhkendall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a9adbd/32.png) [@dhkendall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dhkendall)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/21 "2010-01-14T17:36:45Z")
> [@Radegast](#): > > Wouldn’t it seem that given the number of people in the world, a fairly large number, just taking a very small portion of the world’s population, would be living the high life, raping pillaging burning, etc., with Satan’s protection and assistance? Well, therer is the LRA in the DR Congo that gets away with that stuff repeatedly, due to the civil war situation in that country, so, yes, perhaps someone has figured it out. > [@Mangetout](#): > > Facebook, I expect. Or does the devil still use Myspace? Myspace for sure. That’s the only explanation of the site layout and why people still use it. ---
**Author:** ![panman\_1960](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/919ad9/32.png) [@panman\_1960](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panman_1960)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/22 "2010-01-14T17:58:47Z")
> [@Radegast](#): > > Wouldn’t it seem that given the number of people in the world, a fairly large number, just taking a very small portion of the world’s population, would be living the high life, raping pillaging burning, etc., with Satan’s protection and assistance? You mean they’re _NOT_? I just saw the bonus plans for the bailout banks, maybe you could ask one of the corporate shmucks at B of A! later, Tom. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/23 "2010-01-14T18:05:28Z")
> [@Sinaptics](#): > > Not a guitar, a fiddle. And not Mississippi, Georgia. Not a fiddle, a guitar. Mississippi, not Georgia. Robert Johnson, not Charlie Daniels or “Johnny”. > **[Robert Johnson](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Johnson_(musician))** > > Robert Leroy Johnson (May 8, 1911 – August 16, 1938) was an American blues musician and songwriter. His singing, guitar playing and songwriting on his landmark 1936 and 1937 recordings have influenced later generations of musicians. Although his recording career spanned only seven months, he is recognized as a master of the blues, particularly the Delta blues style, and as one of the most influential musicians of the 20th century. The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame describes him as perhaps "the fir... ---
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/24 "2010-01-14T18:05:53Z")
> [@Radegast](#): > > I know several people personally who would be fighting to be first in line to open a vein and sign the Evil One’s contract, were they given the opportunity. Yeah, well, that’s the thing. You have open your vein enough for a decent blood flow, but not so much that you end up in Hell before you’ve made your deal. ---
**Author:** ![Radegast](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c4cdca/32.png) [@Radegast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Radegast)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/25 "2010-01-14T18:10:42Z")
All joking aside, part of this post comes from my wondering if people like Robertson have given any thought to the implications. If it were as easy as some people think, or even possible, for that matter, things would be a whole lot weirder on Earth than they are already. ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/26 "2010-01-14T18:19:36Z")
This is something that’s always bothered me about deals with the devil. What does the devil get out of the deal? Seems to me all he gets is a soul that he had a very slim chance of not getting in the natural course of things. Someone who is willing to make a deal with the devil is probably not a very good or pious person. Since the devil gets so little out of this deal, why would he be willing to make it? ---
**Author:** ![Daithi\_Lacha](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/daithi_lacha/32/5430_2.png) [@Daithi\_Lacha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Daithi_Lacha)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/27 "2010-01-14T18:26:01Z")
> [@Anne\_Neville](#): > > This is something that’s always bothered me about deals with the devil. What does the devil get out of the deal? Seems to me all he gets is a soul that he had a very slim chance of not getting in the natural course of things. Someone who is willing to make a deal with the devil is probably not a very good or pious person. Since the devil gets so little out of this deal, why would he be willing to make it? No room for repentance at “the end.” You’re his, lock stock and barrel. Also, frankly, the Devil is a sucker for bargaining. I’ve even seen him try to haggle at yard sales. Of course, he was in the form of a cranky old lady. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Radegast](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c4cdca/32.png) [@Radegast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Radegast)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/28 "2010-01-14T18:31:12Z")
The whole repentance thing has always bothered me. The main reason I like Don Giovanni is that they are entreating him to repent and be saved as he’s being dragged into Hell at the end of the opera, but he keeps saying no. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/29 "2010-01-14T18:32:08Z")
> [@Anne\_Neville](#): > > This is something that’s always bothered me about deals with the devil. What does the devil get out of the deal? Seems to me all he gets is a soul that he had a very slim chance of not getting in the natural course of things. Someone who is willing to make a deal with the devil is probably not a very good or pious person. Since the devil gets so little out of this deal, why would he be willing to make it? In theory, I suppose a prior contract could possibly be used in an attempt to negate a deathbed conversion to “saved” status in some sort of hearing concerning final disposition of an alleged soul. I think Ol’ Scratch has a considerable advantage in such litigation. Where’s God gonna get a lawyer? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/30 "2010-01-14T18:33:31Z")
> [@Daithi\_Lacha](#): > > No room for repentance at “the end.” You’re his, lock stock and barrel. That’s not what happens in some versions of the story, though. In Goethe’s Faust, Faust gets saved at the end, as does [Pan Twardowski](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pan_Twardowski) (sort of) in the Polish version. If you could repent of anything else, why not of having made a deal with the devil? In Marlowe’s _Doctor Faustus_, an angel encourages Faustus to do just that, after he made the deal with the devil. ---
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/31 "2010-01-14T18:54:08Z")
I think saying, “I’ll make a deal and then repent later” negates the later repentance. Or at least makes it more difficult. There’s actually a similar idea in the Talmud: “A person who says, ‘I will sin and be forgiven on Yom Kippur’, is not forgiven on Yom Kippur”. ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/32 "2010-01-14T19:00:30Z")
> [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](#): > > I think saying, “I’ll make a deal and then repent later” negates the later repentance. Or at least makes it more difficult. > > There’s actually a similar idea in the Talmud: “A person who says, ‘I will sin and be forgiven on Yom Kippur’, is not forgiven on Yom Kippur”. Saying you’ll make a deal and then repent later isn’t the same thing as making the deal in good faith (so to speak) and later deciding that you really regret it and want to repent of it. Guido da Montefeltro tried to do something and repent of it at the same time in Dante’s _Inferno_. Didn’t work. The Devil is too good a logician to fall for that one. ---
**Author:** ![Skylark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@Skylark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skylark)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/33 "2010-01-16T03:23:50Z")
Should you ever try to break the contract, expect it to go to trial. However, there is precedent. _ **Scratch v. Stone** _, decided in favor of the defendant. This was later cited as the sole precedent for the later _**United States ex rel. Gerald Mayo v. Satan and His Staff 54 F.R.D. 282 (1971)**_. [Text of the case](http://kevinunderhill.typepad.com/Documents/Mayo_v_Satan.pdf) (PDF). It was ultimately thrown out on a technicality. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/34 "2010-01-16T04:00:48Z")
> [@Skylark](#): > > Should you ever try to break the contract, expect it to go to trial. However, there is precedent. > > _ **Scratch v. Stone** _, decided in favor of the defendant. This was later cited as the sole precedent for the later _**United States ex rel. Gerald Mayo v. Satan and His Staff 54 F.R.D. 282 (1971)**_. [Text of the case](http://kevinunderhill.typepad.com/Documents/Mayo_v_Satan.pdf) (PDF). It was ultimately thrown out on a technicality. We read that case in my Civil Procedure class. \* We note that the plaintiff has failed to include with his complaint the required form of instructions for the United States Marshal for directions as to service of process.\* To which I quipped, “All he had to do was tell a U.S. Marshall to go to Hell”. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Green\_Bean](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_bean/32/1760_2.png) [@Green\_Bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Bean)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/35 "2010-01-16T05:15:08Z")
I thought you were supposed to bring a black cat bone to the crossroads with you. I’ve been carrying this damn bone around for years. Have I been misinformed? ---
**Author:** ![Terraplane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/74df32/32.png) [@Terraplane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terraplane)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 9:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/36 "2010-01-16T09:18:42Z")
“You take your guitar and you go to where the road crosses that way, where a crossroads is. Get there, be sure to get there just a little 'fore 12 that night so you know you’ll be there. You have your guitar and be playing a piece there by yourself. A big black man will walk up there and take your guitar and he’ll tune it. And then he’ll play a piece and hand it back to you.” After that, you just fuckin’ rock n roll, man. I’ve always wondered about this myself. Making a deal with the devil is more binding than murdering somebody as far as your mortal soul goes? Seems like a bit much. I’d always figured honest repentance was the cure for pretty much any sin, at least as far as Christianity goes. Sure, Satan’s probably got all the lawyers on his side but you’d think with a sympathetic Judge you might get off on a technicality. ---
**Author:** ![R.P.McMurphy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7993a0/32.png) [@R.P.McMurphy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/R.P.McMurphy)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/37 "2010-01-16T15:07:32Z")
Ask Pat Robertson. He knows all about it because he is the Devil. ---
**Author:** ![Silverstreak\_Wonder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Silverstreak\_Wonder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silverstreak_Wonder)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/38 "2010-01-16T22:53:05Z")
One enters the legal profession in this country, there you are taught and tested on that nothing is right or wrong, to lie for money, and that it is all a game. Defense attorneys are those with the highest link to the devil, but so are their law school teachers and on down. There is a secondary smaller market in making and dealing addictive drugs, and that includes legal ones. People in these fields know they are doing evil and want to continue, which is a good definition of having a pact with the devil. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/39 "2010-01-16T23:06:16Z")
> [@Silverstreak\_Wonder](#): > > One enters the legal profession in this country, there you are taught and tested on that nothing is right or wrong, to lie for money, and that it is all a game. Defense attorneys are those with the highest link to the devil, but so are their law school teachers and on down. > > There is a secondary smaller market in making and dealing addictive drugs, and that includes legal ones. > > People in these fields know they are doing evil and want to continue, which is a good definition of having a pact with the devil. Let me assure you and **silenus** that as a public defender, I couldn’t be any happier with the deal Satan and I have struck, especially when I get to hear bullshit like this. Endless riches, fame and fortune, all the glory and honor of an epic warrior king, that’s what I asked Him for, and that’s what He’s bestowed upon me. ---
**Author:** ![Silverstreak\_Wonder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Silverstreak\_Wonder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silverstreak_Wonder)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2010, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919/40 "2010-01-16T23:34:50Z")
Jimmy, Oh yes he will, agreed. But get back to me in 100 years on your opinion then, I have a feeling you will find it was not worth it. But you are sure in a pact, yes. I’d find I could not do it now even for high pay because the thought of helping some molester or rapist go free who has a record ought to have some queasyness, since he might get your own kids or girl next, I always wondered how they deal with that knowledge that they helped create that next victim? (even if you don’t know them, but suppose you did? Would they ever be sorry they got him off? Or did law school have an answer for that too?) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pact-with-the-devil-how-to/524919.md?page=3)