# Palestinians torture son; force him to falsely implicate his widowed mother of 7 **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 26, 2002, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565 "2002-08-26T03:35:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 5:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/21 "2002-08-26T05:01:55Z")
**milroyj**. Get out your dictionary. You gonna need it. Start with **toady**. Then move on to **sycophant**. Then try **stooge**. You’re trying to defend the indefensible. He can’t be worth it, unless he’s you. In and of himself, he might not be a worthless piece of flotsam. But his posts are truly stoopid. He outdid himself this time. Aren’t you capable of distinguishing between posts which are calling December a stupid fuck and posts which are supporting the Palestinians? Are you that fucking stupid? You, of course, don’t have to answer that question and remove all doubt. But I’ll wager you will. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/22 "2002-08-26T05:03:44Z")
Why is it so difficult for some to understand that people can ‘support’ a particular side in a conflict without condoning the actions of that side? War is abhorent, and IMHO NOBODY likes or approves of any of the violent methods employed by either of the players. An atrocity is an atrocity, no matter which side perpetrates it. Just like \*\*andros \*\* said. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![istara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e79b87/32.png) [@istara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/istara)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/23 "2002-08-26T05:51:56Z")
::rubs hands with glee:: Oo - another juicy rate hate thread from **december**! What I love about all these threads is the feeling of solidarity they create among all of us moderate neutrals, moderate pro-Israelis and moderate pro-Palestinians. It reminds me of that legendary story of Allied and German troops playing footballs on Christmas Day. **december** - you’re doing a great job bringing us all together. Keep it up! ---
**Author:** ![John\_Corrado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a88e4f/32.png) [@John\_Corrado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Corrado)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/24 "2002-08-26T06:03:52Z")
At some point, **december** will realize the camp he has placed himself within. The next time he spouts that the Palestinian cause must be without merit or morality because of the extremists that claim to be supporters of it, someone will go: “Right on! Now, of course, you must also agree that the United States military is without merit or morality because of the actions of extremists like Lt. Calley, Lt. Kerrey, and numerous others during the Vietnam War.” And while he ponders that, he will have someone else say, “Yes, join us, and declare your hatred for all things American as well- for well you know the horrors perpetrated on Africans during the slave trade, their incarceration as ‘property’, and the hundred and fifty years of Jim Crow and bigotry that followed; and as all of the perpetrators were Americans, you must agree that to be an American is without honor.” And before he can respond, there will be more and more, all reminding him of the horror and terror wraught by the extremists of various causes, and he will be reminded that all anti-abortionists are willing murderers of doctors; that all Republicans are happy members of the KKK; that all right-wingers joyously supported McVeigh’s bombing; that all Jews are terrorists as Begin and the Irgun gang were, that all Americans are terrorists as the Tea Partiers and the tar-and-featherers were. And I hope he is happy there, in the crowd he belongs with. For I stopped paying attention to him long ago, and care not what he has to say or think. I prefer the company of those who judge by the main, not the extreme; those who accept that fault can lie with more than one party; those who are willing to admit that their side is not without blame and must also make amends. And it’s always good to see **andros** around. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/25 "2002-08-26T06:08:43Z")
> [@](#): > > At some point, december will realize the camp he has placed himself within. John. You dreamer, you. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![reprise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ea666f/32.png) [@reprise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/reprise)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/26 "2002-08-26T06:12:17Z")
_applauds_ **John Corrado** ---
**Author:** ![Gozu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gozu/32/6615_2.png) [@Gozu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gozu)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/27 "2002-08-26T06:12:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by december \* > \*\*There are some who have a preference in favor of the Palestinians over the Israelis. There are some of you who believe Sharon is just as bad as Arafat. This [Associated Press story](http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-1970165,00.html) is reproduced for your benefit. . \*\* I realize now that palestinians are bad and israelis are good. Thank you for enlightening me December. You truly deserve praises and flowers. And the courage of sticking to your opinions in a hostile board full of ignorant blind scum is uncomparable. Long live Sharon, the saint in shining armor, defender of the pure of heart, slayer of the wicked, guardian of eternal justice!! Death to Arafat, the wicked demon, destroyer of hope, leader of the dark legions, spokesman of evil. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Corrado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a88e4f/32.png) [@John\_Corrado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Corrado)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/28 "2002-08-26T06:13:15Z")
**samclem** - We all have a right to our fantasies. Mine just involve certain people suddenly stating, “Wait- I just realized I’m an asshole!” ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/29 "2002-08-26T06:27:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by istara \* > \*\*::rubs hands with glee:: > > Oo - another juicy rate hate thread from **december**! > > What I love about all these threads is the feeling of solidarity they create among all of us moderate neutrals, moderate pro-Israelis and moderate pro-Palestinians. It reminds me of that legendary story of Allied and German troops playing footballs on Christmas Day. > > **december** - you’re doing a great job bringing us all together. Keep it up! \*\* I hardly think you qualify as a 'moderate; on this topic. ---
**Author:** ![istara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e79b87/32.png) [@istara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/istara)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/30 "2002-08-26T06:31:31Z")
Really?! Cites? ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 7:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/31 "2002-08-26T07:15:48Z")
Hrmmm… After reviewing your non-Pit posts, I will have to take you off my ‘Radicals’ list. You did have a few pretty kooky anti-Sharon statements, but I’ll let those slide. Also, I think you may hold the record for the use of the word ‘bigot’ (and bigoted) here. That puts you some list or other, I bet. I tend to label first, ask questions later, when in online groups. Did the same to Sparc and a few others, then read some of their other stuff. All of the above is a very round-about way of apologizing, so to make it clear: I do not think that you are not moderate in regards to the middle east, and sorry for stating that you were. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc348/32.png) [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Flying_Dutchman)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 7:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/32 "2002-08-26T07:19:38Z")
**December** , obviously one should avoid being the bearer of bad news. ---
**Author:** ![istara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e79b87/32.png) [@istara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/istara)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 8:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/33 "2002-08-26T08:13:07Z")
**Brutus** - no probs. Given my geographical location - and the fact that I do admittedly spend more time arguing for understanding of the Palestinian cause than the Israeli cause, it might have seemed to some that I am not moderate. I do in fact for the record support the existence of both Palestine and Israel. I do abhor suicide bombings - particularly of innocent civilians. I abhor **all** killing on **both** sides. I abhor Sharon and his policies, and don’t feel particularly any more favourable to Arafat, if at all. Hope this clears up my position to some extent. I do think I understand why some Palestinians suicide bomb, and I do think I understand some of the extremer Israeli military tactics. That doesn’t make what either side does right in my opinion though. Re Muslims/Islam: I am fairly anti-organised-religion generally and there are many things even in moderate Islam I personally don’t agree with (as there are in moderate Christianity for that matter). I do speak out though to defend the vast majority of moderate muslims who are very often wrongly labelled fundamentalists and terrorists here and elsewhere. I partly do this because before coming to this area and properly getting to know muslims of all backgrounds and racial origins, I realise that I was wrongly holding many of the same prejudices. ---
**Author:** ![TwistofFate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TwistofFate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwistofFate)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 9:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/34 "2002-08-26T09:43:18Z")
You know december, I would have a lot less problem with you if you had have used “Al Asqua” instead of “Palestinian” in the title. If I started a thread saying “Americans torture and crucify young gay man” what would happen? Why cant you just ascribe the disgusting act you mention in the OP to the group actually responsible, and not the entire Palestinian people? ---
**Author:** ![London\_Calling](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@London\_Calling](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/London_Calling)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 10:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/35 "2002-08-26T10:25:44Z")
In the past two weeks we’ve had, amongst others, the following thread titles: \*\*Resolved: Israel’s settlements are not an important cause of Middle East tensions. \*\*– At the very best misleading (by using a mooting term in the title of a GD) **"Killing Israelis is OK; calling the killers names is an atrocity," says the Guardian** – Fabricated **Colonel Gadaffi to head United Nations Commission on Human Rights** – A lie \*\*Palestinians torture son; force him to falsely implicate his widowed mother of 7 \*\*- At best inaccurate and misleading. **december** – I don’t want you gone from this board but you really do seem intent on spreading ignorance. IMHO, this really can’t, or shouldn’t, go on for very much longer. I’m sorry but you’re turning yourself into a freak show. ---
**Author:** ![Efrem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d78d45/32.png) [@Efrem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Efrem)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 10:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/36 "2002-08-26T10:47:34Z")
I have to admit, as soon as I saw the thread title I was authoring the flaming reply already in my mind. However, upon opening the thread I seem to have been beat to the (proverbial) punch. Drat. Although, seeing **milroyj** being shot down for blindly defending **december** was an unexpected bonus, and made skimming through the OP well worth it. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 10:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/37 "2002-08-26T10:58:23Z")
On a related show : [American authorities terrorise young Egyptian man, get a false confession out of him and hold him in jail incommunicado](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=132498). december, you may now start bashing America. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/38 "2002-08-26T11:32:58Z")
**December** and **Milroyj** , what on Earth do you think you’re acomplishing here? Do you think that highlighting the abuses of the Palestinian Authority has any relation to the merits of the Palestinian peoples’ grievances against Israel. I’m definitely pro-Israel and not at all fond of the Palestinians, but that doesn’t mean that I must believe that the Palestinians are a monolithic block of evil while the Israelis aere morally stainless. You need to acknowledge the vices and virtues of your enemies and your allies, if only to demonstrate that you are not, in fact, a morally blind spouter of propaganda. And yes, Sharon is as bad as Arafat, but again, the moral failings of these two men have nothing to do with the merits of the causes they support. John Ashcroft’s totalitarian excesses do not make every American automatically complicit in his crimes. ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/39 "2002-08-26T11:44:39Z")
> [@](#): > > If I started a thread saying “Americans torture and crucify young gay man” what would happen? Thank you, I was going to go there and you saved me the trouble. ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2002, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565/40 "2002-08-26T11:48:17Z")
**CHRISTMAS REQUESTS MOVE TO JANUARY 25** _“CANNOT LIVE WITH DAMAGED REPUTATION ANY LONGER”_, SAYS DISGRUNTLED CHRISTIAN HOLIDAY The poster **december** was unavailable for comment at the time this was printed. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/palestinians-torture-son-force-him-to-falsely-implicate-his-widowed-mother-of-7/125565.md?page=3)