# Parents Opt to Keep Conjoined Twins Together **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [April 26, 2014, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012 "2014-04-26T02:10:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/1 "2014-04-26T02:10:13Z")
A couple in Indiana, Pa. says they’ve opted not to separate their newborn conjoined twins because surgery would put both their lives at serious risk. The brothers were born 14 days ago and they share a heart and liver. Doctors say Garrett and Andrew Stancombe are healthy but the complex surgery might cause one – or both – to die. > **[Parents in Pennsylvania opt to keep conjoined twins together](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/parents-in-pennsylvania-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/)** > > The brothers share a heart and liver and doctors say surgery would be incredibly risky I think living as a conjoined twin would be a horrible way to live. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/2 "2014-04-26T02:15:39Z")
[The Hensel twins](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abigail_and_Brittany_Hensel) made a pretty good go of it. ---
**Author:** ![tapu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/49beb7/32.png) [@tapu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tapu)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/3 "2014-04-26T02:27:52Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > A couple in Indiana, Pa. says they’ve opted not to separate their newborn conjoined twins because surgery would put both their lives at serious risk. > > The brothers were born 14 days ago and they share a heart and liver. Doctors say Garrett and Andrew Stancombe are healthy but the complex surgery might cause one – or both – to die. > [Parents in Pennsylvania opt to keep conjoined twins together - CBS News](http://www.cbsnews.com/news/parents-in-pennsylvania-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/) > > I think living as a conjoined twin would be a horrible way to live. You might want to read up on it. And yes, try to see the video of the Hensel girls, made when they were in high school. To find out a little about how conjoined–and separated–twins feel about the choice made for them, I’d suggest “One of Us.” Amazon has it in pb. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/4 "2014-04-26T03:39:22Z")
The original [Hilton Sisters](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daisy_and_violet_hilton) managed to make it work. (Their issues stemmed more from being exploited by their guardians, rather than being conjoined) In fact, they were in the cult classic, _Freaks_. ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/5 "2014-04-26T04:03:57Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > I think living as a conjoined twin would be a horrible way to live. I think living with the knowledge that your twin died so that you could live would be a horrible way to live. Or living with the knowledge that you killed both of your kids trying to separate them. Also horrible. Or dying. Bad choice too. ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/6 "2014-04-26T04:11:51Z")
There isn’t a good choice for the parents. The surgery would put them both at risk. And the odds that these kids will live for a very long time don’t seem so good either. If that’s their choice, then it seems the parents have opted to enjoy their sons for the time they will have them. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/7 "2014-04-26T11:36:45Z")
> [@Baker](#): > > And the odds that these kids will live for a very long time don’t seem so good either. Yes and no - while most conjoined twins die very young some pairs have gone on to live long and healthy lives, like Chang and Eng Bunker and Lonnie and Donnie Galyon. So if they get through the next few years with few or no problems they stand a decent chance of living something like a normal lifespan. Hey, weren’t there more posts in this thread yesterday? I seem to remember making one that isn’t here anymore… Maybe the thread was surgically separated? ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/8 "2014-04-26T12:52:55Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Yes and no - while most conjoined twins die very young some pairs have gone on to live long and healthy lives, like Chang and Eng Bunker and Lonnie and Donnie Galyon. So if they get through the next few years with few or no problems they stand a decent chance of living something like a normal lifespan. > > Hey, weren’t there more posts in this thread yesterday? I seem to remember making one that isn’t here anymore… > > Maybe the thread was surgically separated? I;d never heard of the Galyon twins, it’s remarkable they lived so long. But Chang and Eng Bunker were, by todays standards, probably easily seperable. They were two complete people joined only by a thick band of muscle or ligament under their ribcage. According to a biography I read of them they even did consider getting seperated just before they were to be married, but their fiancees, two sisters, urged them not to, deeming the risk too great. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/9 "2014-04-26T13:08:50Z")
sharing a heart is very tricky. i wonder if one would need to get a doner heart. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/10 "2014-04-26T13:40:13Z")
Well, yeah, if they want both to survive one would need a donor heart. I think in this case they probably made the right decision, but then, not my child and not my decision to make. I just think a reflexive SEPARATE! is not necessary in the best interests of the twins in all cases. Even if the Bunkers would be easily separated _today_, at the time they actually lived such surgery would have been extremely risky, so it’s still analogous to the Galyon situation - those two could theoretically be separated with today’s medical technology but they don’t want to take the chance. ---
**Author:** ![JKilez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e5b9ba/32.png) [@JKilez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKilez)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/11 "2014-04-26T14:47:43Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Well, yeah, if they want both to survive one would need a donor heart. How would that work? The heart has to be hooked to a host of other things in the body to function correctly, does it not? If the heart is not there, I cannot imagine that the supporting plumbing is there either. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/12 "2014-04-26T16:14:13Z")
Impossible to know without a really extensive medical examination of the two kids involved as each set of conjoined twins is different. I suspect one reason that so many of them die at birth or shortly after is because things aren’t “hooked up” correctly to begin with. The ones that do well, like the Hensels, were lucky enough that the essential bits all had a viable connection to begin with. So, there may be instances where a transplant could be done. In other instances it can’t be done. One of the more moving, although very sad, accounts of conjoined twins was written by C. Everett Koop, former surgeon general of the US. He was involved in a case of conjoined twins where they absolutely would not survive if still linked together, both would certainly die, and in fact they were going downhill pretty fast. Unfortunately, only one could be saved. He went into an operating room with two infant patients and basically had to sever one from vital organs in order to save the other. He carried the dead baby out to the parents, so they could hold their son one last time, then went back to finishing the surgery on the surviving boy for several hours, basically reworking the wrongly hooked up bits. I believe in that case the surviving twin went on to a healthy life but I am _so_ glad I have never had to confront a situation like that. These are not easy or routine cases. ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/13 "2014-04-26T19:18:11Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > He went into an operating room with two infant patients and basically had to sever one from vital organs in order to save the other. He carried the dead baby out to the parents, so they could hold their son one last time, i can’t begin to imagine the pain of the parents and of the doctor too. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/14 "2014-04-26T21:43:18Z")
I read that the odds of these twins both surviving if separated is between 5 and 25%, so the parents’ decision seems entirely rational to me. (unless things deteriorate to the point that keeping them together would be more likely to kill them) ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/15 "2014-04-26T22:20:14Z")
> [@Baker](#): > > i can’t begin to imagine the pain of the parents and of the doctor too. Heck with it, I tear up just remembering reading about years after the event. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/16 "2014-04-26T22:25:49Z")
> [@Baker](#): > > There isn’t a good choice for the parents. The surgery would put them both at risk. > > And the odds that these kids will live for a very long time don’t seem so good either. > > If that’s their choice, then it seems the parents have opted to enjoy their sons for the time they will have them. I was going to pretty much say the same thing. Conjoined twins that share a heart cannot be separated, and usually don’t live very long. I remember reading about some girls who lived a relatively normal life until shortly before their death…at the age of 7. ☹ The Hensels have separate hearts, and doctors think this is why they’ve lived as long as they have, also in otherwise good health. ---
**Author:** ![Springtime\_for\_Spacers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Springtime\_for\_Spacers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Springtime_for_Spacers)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/17 "2014-04-26T22:29:38Z")
A particularly heartbreaking case was that of Gracie and Rosie Attard from Gozo. They were initially known in the press as [Jodie and Mary](http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2002/feb/05/sarahboseley). > [@](#): > > Mary, the smaller and weaker twin, was fatally compromised. Her lungs and heart were not properly formed and her brain was primitive, although capable of sustaining life. Jodie the healthier of the two was essentially keeping her sister alive, but her body could not take the strain and both were dying. Their doctors proposed separation, even though this gave Mary no chance of life, but the parents initially disagreed. The case was then decided by the law with this ruling. > [@](#): > > …they came down in favour of Jodie’s right to life. “Mary has always been fated for early death,” said the senior judge, Lord Justice Ward. "Though Mary has the right to life she has little right to be alive. > > "She is alive only because, to put it bluntly but nonetheless accurately, she sucks the lifeblood of Jodie and her parasitic living will soon be the cause of Jodie ceasing to live. > > "Jodie is entitled to protest that Mary is killing her. The best interests of the twins is to give the chance of life to the child whose actual bodily condition is capable of accepting the chance to her advantage even if that has to be at the cost of the sacrifice of a life. > > “I am left in no doubt at all that the scales come down heavily in Jodie’s favour.” There’s no doubt that this was an agonising decision for all concerned irrc the parents were satisfied for the case to be taken out of their hands and settled by the law. And the [outcome](http://www.thefreelibrary.com/We+don't+know+how+to+tell+Gracie+her+sister+died+so+she+could+live%3B...-a0166174616) for Jodie/Gracie was good. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/18 "2014-04-26T22:30:42Z")
We hear lots more about female conjoined twins than male. I’ve read that males have more complications than girls, and many die shortly after birth. Anyone know about that? ---
**Author:** ![picunurse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7bcc69/32.png) [@picunurse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/picunurse)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/19 "2014-04-26T22:45:57Z")
> [@rocking\_chair](#): > > sharing a heart is very tricky. i wonder if one would need to get a doner heart. Yes. A liver can be split, but even if the heart has 8 chambers, the muscle isn’t thick enough to split. The musculature of the left ventricle has to be thick and uninjured to withstand the high pressures it’s under. Donor hearts for infants are hard to find. ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2014, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012/20 "2014-04-26T23:09:16Z")
This is an article, from 2007, about how a young girl has handled being a seperated conjoined twin. She is Eilish Holton, from Ireland, born in 1995, and seperated at the age of three from her sister, who died of cardiac arrest. Her parents said they wouldn’t have had the surgery if they’d expected either of the girls would die, although Katie, the deceased twin, did. > **[Life after Katie](https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/life-after-katie/26108190.html)** > > Eilish Holton is Ireland's only surviving separated Siamese twin. Last week, as controversy raged over the future of the world's newest set of conjoined twins, born in a Manchester hospital three weeks ago, she was blowing out the candles on her... [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-opt-to-keep-conjoined-twins-together/687012.md?page=2)