# Parents: Your six year old accidently submerges the babysitter's cell phone. **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 17, 2007, 8:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422 "2007-05-17T08:33:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 11:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/121 "2007-05-22T11:30:37Z")
[QUOTE=Dangerosa] I would suggest you guys not come over to my house. Because I will move your purse and your shoes and your jacket. If you leave your cell phone on my table, I will move it if I need to. I touch your stuff in my house. I’ve never heard anything so ridiculous that I shouldn’t touch stuff in my own house that you leave lying around. [/QUOTE] Do you at least do so with an explanation and token request for permission, like, “I’m going to put your purse up on the top of the buffet so the kids don’t get into it, mmm’kay?” Because it does sound awfully rude to just take people’s things and move them, no matter what your good intentions. And are you saying that at \*eight \*and \*nine \*your kids still have no concept that touching other people’s stuff without permission is just not done? :eek: I’m wondering if the chorus of “Mine! Mine!” isn’t because they just feel really insecure about their stuff. Maybe if you taught both of them not to grab the other’s things, they wouldn’t need to defend them verbally so much. ---
**Author:** ![manx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/65b543/32.png) [@manx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manx)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/122 "2007-05-22T11:33:37Z")
[QUOTE=Dangerosa] I would suggest you guys not come over to my house. Because I will move your purse and your shoes and your jacket. If you leave your cell phone on my table, I will move it if I need to. I touch your stuff in my house. I’ve never heard anything so ridiculous that I shouldn’t touch stuff in my own house that you leave lying around. [/QUOTE] Move it where? Because if I dump my stuff in the middle of the floor, or on the table just before you serve dinner, than by all means move my stuff to somewhere more convenient; I’m being either clueless or rude in my behavior. But if I come over, hang up my coat and leave my bag under it, you’d _ask_, surely, or at least inform me, of you were going to move them around. Because I may be in your house, but my stuff is still, well, \*my \*stuff. And any school-age child should know not to touch what’s not theirs. On preview; exactly what **WhyNot** said. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 12:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/123 "2007-05-22T12:07:34Z")
> [@](#): > > We don’t have enough strangers coming into the house to bother to have any guest stuff rules Why does this not surprise me? ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/124 "2007-05-22T12:20:05Z")
[QUOTE=WhyNot] Do you at least do so with an explanation and token request for permission, like, “I’m going to put your purse up on the top of the buffet so the kids don’t get into it, mmm’kay?” Because it does sound awfully rude to just take people’s things and move them, no matter what your good intentions. And are you saying that at \*eight \*and \*nine \*your kids still have no concept that touching other people’s stuff without permission is just not done? :eek: I’m wondering if the chorus of “Mine! Mine!” isn’t because they just feel really insecure about their stuff. Maybe if you taught both of them not to grab the other’s things, they wouldn’t need to defend them verbally so much. [/QUOTE] We don’t generally have other people’s stuff in our house. They really haven’t been exposed to the idea. The idea that they have been exposed to is “if its in the house and its cool, yes, you are free to explore it.” With exceptions like household cleaners. Other people’s houses, yes. Out in public, yes. (Though my son is highly tactile and wants to touch and smell everything - his impluse is to run his hands over everything - he’s gotten better at almost nine, but at six taking him to an art museum was a form of torture for me.) In our house we have good friends come over. They don’t tend to come with personal stuff they leave lying around. And grandparents and aunts and uncles, who bring stuff that the kids are supposed to touch. Their friends, who are under the “share rule” - if they bring it in its shared for the duration of the stay. They understand “don’t dig through someone else’s purse.” But no, I wouldn’t trust them not to touch a shiny cell phone you left on the table in their house. In their world, interesting things show up all the time with no explaination of whose they are - and unless its been explictly identified as something they shouldn’t touch, they touch. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/125 "2007-05-22T12:21:13Z")
[QUOTE=Rilchiam] Why does this not surprise me? [/QUOTE] Do you have a lot of strangers come into your house? We try not to invite people over we don’t know well. ---
**Author:** ![sugar\_and\_spice](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e8c25b/32.png) [@sugar\_and\_spice](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sugar_and_spice)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/126 "2007-05-22T14:47:18Z")
[QUOTE=Dangerosa] Do you have a lot of strangers come into your house? We try not to invite people over we don’t know well. [/QUOTE] Wow, that’s not how it was in my family. My father had colleagues over every few months, usually a guys stops in for a book and they chat for half an hour, and all these men were strangers to me. My mother also let in the plumber, the contractor, the carpet saleswoman, etc. I don’t remember any confusion as to why the contractor didn’t want to share his toys with me, I knew these people were not part of our family and that their stuff wasn’t our stuff. I didn’t really have babysitters that I remember, by 6 my brother could watch me, and when his friends came over I knew that I’d get the crap beat out of me if I just took their stuff. We didn’t have any family in the city I grew up in, I guess we had to interact with the rest of the world. ---
**Author:** ![Sarahfeena](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarahfeena/32/519_2.png) [@Sarahfeena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarahfeena)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/127 "2007-05-22T16:45:48Z")
[QUOTE=Dangerosa] In our house we have good friends come over. They don’t tend to come with personal stuff they leave lying around. And grandparents and aunts and uncles, who bring stuff that the kids are supposed to touch. Their friends, who are under the “share rule” - if they bring it in its shared for the duration of the stay. They understand “don’t dig through someone else’s purse.” But no, I wouldn’t trust them not to touch a shiny cell phone you left on the table in their house. In their world, interesting things show up all the time with no explaination of whose they are - and unless its been explictly identified as something they shouldn’t touch, they touch. [/QUOTE] I find this very strange…I get that kids touch stuff sometimes that they shouldn’t, but don’t you think it would be a good lesson to learn that some things belong to other people, and they should ask before they touch? My sister tends to keep her cell phone with her, and she comes over a lot. If she leaves it on a table, and my 3-year-old picks it up, I say to her “that’s your aunt’s cell phone, please give it back to her.” Then I suggest to my sister that we put it somewhere that the kid can’t reach it. It just seems like a good life lesson for all concerned, you know? ---
**Author:** ![fessie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c37758/32.png) [@fessie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fessie)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/128 "2007-05-22T17:01:24Z")
That’s kind of what I was thinking. I’m not neutral here - I tend to admire **Dangerosa** rather extravagantly, she’s said so many wise and witty things. My kids are just now getting old enough that I tell them not to touch things simply because they are not theirs, whether in our house or not. Now, I do “confiscate” handbags, and have ever since the great Effexor incident (my Mom should NEVER have emptied her purse on our kitchen floor, I can’t imagine WHAT she was thinking). Everyone who visits knows purses and meds go up high, and cameras and computers need to be put in the spare bedroom (which the kids do not frequent). But still, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect kids to keep their hands off of things simply because they’re not theirs. I much prefer that they leave a lot of MY stuff alone. Maybe there’s something I’m not getting here? ---
**Author:** ![Sarahfeena](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarahfeena/32/519_2.png) [@Sarahfeena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarahfeena)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/129 "2007-05-22T17:04:05Z")
[QUOTE=fessie] Maybe there’s something I’m not getting here? [/QUOTE] That’s what I’m wondering, too. ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/130 "2007-05-22T19:02:48Z")
[QUOTE=Dangerosa] I would suggest you guys not come over to my house. Because I will move your purse and your shoes and your jacket. If you leave your cell phone on my table, I will move it if I need to. I touch your stuff in my house. I’ve never heard anything so ridiculous that I shouldn’t touch stuff in my own house that you leave lying around. [/QUOTE] If you break something that you’re moving without permission, do you offer to replace it? ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/131 "2007-05-22T19:29:50Z")
[QUOTE=fessie] That’s kind of what I was thinking. I’m not neutral here - I tend to admire **Dangerosa** rather extravagantly, she’s said so many wise and witty things. My kids are just now getting old enough that I tell them not to touch things simply because they are not theirs, whether in our house or not. Now, I do “confiscate” handbags, and have ever since the great Effexor incident (my Mom should NEVER have emptied her purse on our kitchen floor, I can’t imagine WHAT she was thinking). Everyone who visits knows purses and meds go up high, and cameras and computers need to be put in the spare bedroom (which the kids do not frequent). But still, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect kids to keep their hands off of things simply because they’re not theirs. I much prefer that they leave a lot of MY stuff alone. Maybe there’s something I’m not getting here? [/QUOTE] I suspect what you are not getting is that I think the sitter was stupid to leave a cellphone sitting around in a bathroom with a full tub close enough for a person of any age to reach the cellphone. If its close enough to reach, its close enough to get knocked in. From experience, cells and water don’t mix (neither, by the way do cells and cans of paint - there is a reason my phone is insured - I’m not the brightest bulb on the Christmas tree myself when it comes to cell phone care and have knocked my cellphone out of my holster in to all manner of substances - some which its survived, some which it hasn’t). And now the sitter expects me to pay for her stupidity in setting the cell phone there. To me, this is part of the risk you undertake carrying a cellphone - you’ll bump it off your waist in the Target parking lot while you are loading up diapers and get run over by your car - they are disposable electronics - and if they aren’t, should be insured. Don’t want the risk, don’t carry the phone. (I should mention I’ve been carrying a cell or pager for…twenty five years now - so I’ve had plenty of opportunities to drive over them, flush them, lose them, and drop them in paint. My previous one fell out of my holster on an airplane in April). My kids occationally take their gameboys to school. We’ve told them that if the Gameboy goes to school and gets broken or stolen, its their problem. Yeah, no one should steal their gameboy. And yeah, their friends should play with it in such a way not to break it. But they are choosing to expose their gameboy to a high risk environment. Ever since my daughter temporarily lost hers and it became obvious that Mom and Dad weren’t going to replace it (nor were we going to throw a fit in the direction of the little girl who had it last but didn’t remember what she’d done with it), they don’t take gameboys to school. (It showed up in a pocket of my daughter’s backpack - the little girl who borrowed it stuck it there). ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/132 "2007-05-22T19:46:59Z")
[QUOTE=Yookeroo] If you break something that you’re moving without permission, do you offer to replace it? [/QUOTE] What are you asking me to take responsibility for? What are you bringing into my house that you care about, that is breakable, and that you are going to leave lying around? I’m not committing to caring for your Ming vase, unless I say “hey, why don’t you bring over that Ming vase.” If you bring a casserole dish over for a potluck, and I knock it to the ground and it shatters, yes, I’ll say “oh, my, I’m so sorry, let me replace that.” ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/133 "2007-05-22T21:54:32Z")
[QUOTE=Thudlow Boink] Does that mean your own phone (cell or otherwise) remains off whenever you’re home with your own children? [/QUOTE] Yes. I also cooked on the stove, answered the door and phone, spanked the kids when they needed it, and ran around nude. The babysitter didn’t (I hope) do any of those things. > [@mhendo](#): > > Well, if you believe those two scenarios are directly comparable, i suppose there’s little i can do to convince you otherwise. But it doesn’t reflect well on your sense of perspective. I’m a mother. I used to hire sitters. My own daughters now babysit. I think if anyone lacks perspective, it’s you. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/134 "2007-05-22T22:35:36Z")
[QUOTE=PunditLisa] I’m a mother. I used to hire sitters. My own daughters now babysit. I think if anyone lacks perspective, it’s you. [/QUOTE] And all that experience still hasn’t made clear to you how looking after children in a home is different from serving behind a counter at Wendy’s? ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/135 "2007-05-23T00:26:10Z")
[QUOTE=Dangerosa] What are you asking me to take responsibility for? What are you bringing into my house that you care about, that is breakable, and that you are going to leave lying around? I’m not committing to caring for your Ming vase, unless I say “hey, why don’t you bring over that Ming vase.” [/QUOTE] Nobody is asking you to care for it. People are asking you to not touch their stuff without permission, and to prevent your kids from doing so also. If you break something that you had no business touching then you pay for it. It’s as simple as that. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/136 "2007-05-23T03:28:59Z")
[QUOTE=treis] Nobody is asking you to care for it. People are asking you to not touch their stuff without permission, and to prevent your kids from doing so also. If you break something that you had no business touching then you pay for it. It’s as simple as that. [/QUOTE] I’m asking you not to bring things into my house and leave them lying around. Why does your “don’t touch” trump my “don’t bring your crap into my house and leave it lying around?” Particularly when you are not a guest - you are someone I have hired and the crap is stuff not required to do the job. I have plenty of crap in my life to be responsible for - I find it a little overwhelming. I don’t need to be responsible for things you choose to bring into my house. There are things I’d like to have that I don’t have because I don’t want to take responsibility for them - either my own bad habits, or having the kids around, or I don’t want them junking up my house or I’ve chosen not to afford them. There are other things that I need or want that I take precautions with because of my own bad habits or having kids. I’ve already made those decisions - chosen not to have it or taken precautions to reduce the risk. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/137 "2007-05-23T04:13:01Z")
[QUOTE=Dangerosa] I’m asking you not to bring things into my house and leave them lying around. Why does your “don’t touch” trump my “don’t bring your crap into my house and leave it lying around?” Particularly when you are not a guest - you are someone I have hired and the crap is stuff not required to do the job. [/QUOTE] If you make clear your “my kids are allowed to touch your stuff” rule then that’s fine. It’s your house, and your rules. However, the default is that you don’t touch a person’s property without permission. That is the rule that the rest of us live by, and if you want different in your house you better make it clear. ---
**Author:** ![hawksgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ed655f/32.png) [@hawksgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hawksgirl)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/138 "2007-05-23T05:25:54Z")
[QUOTE=Dangerosa] I’m asking you not to bring things into my house and leave them lying around. Why does your “don’t touch” trump my “don’t bring your crap into my house and leave it lying around?” Particularly when you are not a guest - you are someone I have hired and the crap is stuff not required to do the job. I have plenty of crap in my life to be responsible for - I find it a little overwhelming. I don’t need to be responsible for things you choose to bring into my house. There are things I’d like to have that I don’t have because I don’t want to take responsibility for them - either my own bad habits, or having the kids around, or I don’t want them junking up my house or I’ve chosen not to afford them. There are other things that I need or want that I take precautions with because of my own bad habits or having kids. I’ve already made those decisions - chosen not to have it or taken precautions to reduce the risk. [/QUOTE] Is she allowed to bring her wallet? She won’t need money in your house. What about wearing a hat when she came in? She doesn’t need that while working so it can be destroyed? Where exactly is the line? ---
**Author:** ![sugar\_and\_spice](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e8c25b/32.png) [@sugar\_and\_spice](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sugar_and_spice)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/139 "2007-05-23T05:28:59Z")
[QUOTE=Dangerosa] I’m asking you not to bring things into my house and leave them lying around. Why does your “don’t touch” trump my “don’t bring your crap into my house and leave it lying around?” Particularly when you are not a guest - you are someone I have hired and the crap is stuff not required to do the job. [/QUOTE] Well, I kinda think that when you hire some to work for you, you should still treat them with respect, for example, not treating their common possessions as disposable “crap”. And I don’t think having kids is an excuse to do otherwise. Just my opinion, you obviously disagree. -sugar ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422/140 "2007-05-23T10:43:57Z")
[QUOTE=Dangerosa] Why does your “don’t touch” trump my “don’t bring your crap into my house and leave it lying around?” Particularly when you are not a guest - you are someone I have hired and the crap is stuff not required to do the job. [/QUOTE] So is any personal item left on your desk or in your office fair game to your coworkers? Or do you expect that their mommas taught them better than that? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/parents-your-six-year-old-accidently-submerges-the-babysitters-cell-phone/404422.md?page=8)