Well, now we’re going to have to parse some hairs. There was never a final date established with the original agreement, so calling it a 6 year lease is stretching. If he had continued for another year, would that have made it a 7 year lease? If he had moved out after 14 months, would that have been a 14 month lease? The agreement appears to be a month-to-month lease with a standing agreement that each will give the other appropriate notice if that is to change, so it is default to accept the lease will continue. That sounds like a valid lease. Of course, that also makes it harder for RADTENN to fight eviction, as he got appropriate notice. Without a lawyer to try to get some sort of injunction based upon discrimination or something, he’s pretty much SOL on staying, and needs to be gone by the end of June. But there is probably grounds for HUD to hit her up for discrimination and fine her, and perhaps there are grounds for compensation to RADTENN.
Irishman, first let me say you have done a great job keeping the weeds weeded out of this garden and have keep the focus on valid facts.
My update:
Anytime a lanlord accepts my rent payment for the next month rent it keeps my month to month going and has for six years now this June. Everyone remember I have always said my rent has always been paid.
I have not discussed any threads concerning how, when, where, why I have paid my rent, because I have only received a notice to end my month to month.
No Unlawful Detainer (or Eviction) process has been started yet. If I stay past the move out date June 30, 2011 then she can file the UD on July 1, 2011. At that time and only then will I know if she will state the reason to end my month to month is failure to pay rent and how much I owe her. Remeber, I have always stated my rent has been paid on time since living here.
Notice to Move Out: From what a lawyer told me today I have not been serve the proper notice to move out. Heres why: The landlady mailed me a letter stating I have to move out. That’s legal, but she has to post the same on my door. She has not done this (Post and Mail). Had she mailed me a certified letter requiring my signature that would have been a proper way to serve me notice.
Her giving me a notice of 90 days is voided out at this time.
Will I stay longer than June 30, 2011? That depends on a couple of things happening.
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If the landlady receives the housing discrimination complaint and submits her answer in the allowed 10 day period, this will start the-
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Medation: I have the control of how the complaint is settled. And I could possibly use this legally to negoiation for maybe some free rent then move out. Every valid charge HUD charges the respondent is a $11,000.00 fine for first time offenders and the complaint is settled before a Federal Law judge, the Respondent, and myself. I can stop this process at anytime. If I do then I can request to settle it in a Federal Civil Law Court. next
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Once the complaint goes to court I am represented by a federal prosecutor before a judge and jury. The $11,000.00 per charge is now not a factor. Why? Because the jury will now decide how much the respondent owes me for any damages plus punitive damages. I have kept my medical conditions out of this thread. It is possible the punitive damages could be determential to the landlady.
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Someone posted it was their experince landlords treat people with disabllities very nice. I agree with this statement. Most do because they know what is going to happen if they don’t. Anyone can research housing discrimination complaints and find out out over 2 million complaints are filed every year with HUD. Some complaints go to file 13. Some complaints (majority) are settled with mediation. Only 4 complaints last year went to trail. Huge fines where awarded by each jury.
I said this before many landlords (such as mine) do not know that tenants have rights and their actions towards there tenants are unbelieveable as to what extremes they will go to.
Glad you spoke to counsel!
New Update
Yesterday, June 8, 2011 I spoke with Hud. Hud wanted to know about any updates since we last talked because HUD said the letter is waiting for the final sign off then it will be mailed and I should receive it next week.
I told HUD about my May 31, 2011 phone conversation with the landlord. I told HUD the landlord orally gave me a new reason why I had to be moved out by June 30, 2011. That reason is “The landlord wants to move back into the house.” The first question HUD asked me was, “Did the landlord tell your roommate he also had to move out by June 30, 2011?” My answer was no.
Then HUD asked me did the landlord state any dates or time frame which she would be moving back into the house? My answer was no. The HUD intake specialist told me he is added this to the list. He explained a landlord can give tenants a valid notice and state the landlord or family member wants to move into the house. However, He said given the pretext of what the landlord has already been doing it is not a valid reason. Plus he say’s she is treating me differently than the other roommate.
HUD said be watching your mailbox for the letter because it can come anytime but most likely next week.
HUD took the time to help me understand what to about paying my rent on July 1, 2011. He wants me to write a check and mail it to her. If she cashes the check my rent is paid. Should she claim I did not pay rent HUD will track now the check and this will be evidence she accepted my rent.
However, if she returns the check to me this is proof she refuses to rent to me. HUD said the letter will state these discrimination complaints will be settled in a federal court if the respondent does come to an agreement with me.
HUD explained to me almost always the respondent (landlord) contacts a lawyer about the letter they just received and then the lawyer highly recommends for them to settle it complainat out of court. HUD does such a through investigation the majority of lawyers do not wish to fight HUD.
HUD wanted to know how I was getting along with my roommate? I told HUD daily he is asking why is your belongings not packed up yet? When are you going to do this and that? I explained I have asked my roommate to remain neutral concerning this situation because it is between the landlord and myself. I told HUD I feel like I am being harassed daily. Then for the very first time HUD asked me for the roommate’s last name. I gave it to him and now my roommate is part of the complaint.
I am preparing for the worst but hoping for the best. I am looking for a place to move to. I am boxing up and packing everything. It’s just not happening as fast as my roommate thinks it should be happening. This is probably the landlord is contacting my roommate concerning updates and progress I am making to be out of the house by June 30, 2011.
Remember I post eariler I have not been properly serve a valid notice to move out. In reality the landlord has to start over if she wants me out. HUD explained should she follow through with an eviction punitive damages could easily be a six figure. Hell, maybe this will be my new home-First Time Home Owner.
For now I just set back and wait for the letter and see what hits the fan…and then most importantly what sticks.
This is the danger people run into when they are small time land lords and try to do evictions. While I can’t know for sure I wouldn’t be surprised if this is the only home this woman rents, a lot of land lords like that have very strange ideas about the tenants living in “their” house.
I put “their” in quotation marks because I’m emphasizing that many novice land lords feel that their personal ownership of the property means they can treat it just like they would their own private home they live in. Unfortunately for them there are many state and local regulations that govern the landlord-tenant relationship, and once a rental agreement has been established (either in the form of a long term lease, verbal agreement, month-to-month agreement or etc) they can’t throw you out without a series of very specific legal actions. Your tenancy is a valid property interest and she cannot deprive you of it without due process of the law.
In many places, even if her notice to you had been entirely proper she still cannot force you out of the residence even after move out day. She still needs to get writ of possession and then the sheriff or appropriate authority can force you out, but until a court has actually issued such a writ you cannot be compelled by force to leave the property.
Just as a quick example, in my state even if it is 100% clear the lease has ended we are required to send a notice telling them they have need to vacate the property immediately and that in 30 days time we will begin a court case to evict them. The 30 days is unfortunate from our perspective in such a case but it mostly exists because the courts I believe have no interest in expending time and energy on a rental dispute if the tenant vacates within 30 days. After that a court date will be set (it is quicker than for most things) and we show the lease is properly ended and the judge agrees with us, at that point the tenant has 10 days to appeal the decision of the judge. Nothing can happen during that period. After that 10 days has expired sans appeal, a writ of possession can be enforced by the sheriff’s office–who has 30 days to enforce the writ or technically then the sheriff would be in contempt. The sheriff’s deputy who is on scene is there only to stop any violence and to arrest the tenant if they refuse to peacefully leave. We have to have our workers remove the tenant’s property, and cannot intentionally damage it in doing so.
That being said, and recognizing you are probably receiving very good guidance from HUD, there are some things to keep in mind in order to protect yourself. Firstly, the laws regarding land lord tenant relationships are essentially creatures of statute and must be followed absolutely to the letter. If you have described her notice and the regulations of such notice accurately then you are probably correct that she has not given you proper notice and that come June 30th you are not required to vacate. Additionally even if you were served proper notice you technically could remain as a squatter until the proper writ was issued to have you removed (as outlined above.)
That is the legal situation. The factual situation is I am aware of many situations in which land lords who think it is time to move a tenant out will take it upon themselves to forcefully remove tenant’s property or other such things. They may even seize the property and attempt to auction it off, change the locks, etc. In my area and probably in most areas, you cannot legally do that just because the notice has expired–that stuff cannot happen until you have gone to court. In your case you have not even been served proper notice. However, that does not mean that your land lord, who from what I can tell is a very novice land lord, may not believe she would be in the right to throw all your stuff away and lock you out. If she is believed to be in a relationship with your roommate she may even have him help her in this.
I do not know if you intend to be moved out by the end of the notice date–legally you are not required to do so (assuming you have accurately described to us the legal situation, of course); however if you intend to stay after that date I advise you to take some practical measures to prevent your stuff being thrown out and etc. On the other hand if they were to do these things you would most likely be able to pursue significant damages against her in court, but you probably have things you’d much rather not be damaged or thrown away in any case. Additionally you want to be ready for any situations such as the roommate and land lord threatening you with violence if you don’t leave, etc. I don’t know you or them so I don’t know how realistic that is, but I’m talking now about practical situations not about the law, if any of these things happen it will be good for your legal case against the land lord but in the short term you could end up in a fist fight, having to spend an unexpected time in hotels and etc–things you probably would like to avoid.
Thank you RADTENN for taking the time to give us that clear and detailed update (I see you are quickly learning the culture of this message board 
). Best of luck to you, and let us know what happens next.
June 1, 2011 Update
Landlord learning the proper way to notify tenant to move out.
Just about 1 hour ago my roommate and I sat down and talked. The landlord had informed my roommate recently she is serving each of us a 60 day notice to move out. The roommate says one of his friends will be coming by the house to serve the notice.
According to the landlord she must give a us both a 60 day notice to move. The roommate did not state what the reason will be but I’m logically guessing she will state she will be moving into the house.
Now check this out! The roommate said the landlord must serve each of us a 60 day notice. He say’s even though the landlord is serving him a 60 day notice he does not have to be moved out by whatever the date is on the 60 day notice. I did not say anything to him concerning my thoughts about what he just told me.
But doesn’t this sound like the roommate and landlord are conspiring together to get me out of the house? Why even serve my roommate a 60 day notice if he doesn’t have to legally honor the move out date?
What would happen once the 60 day time frame expired and both roommates are still in the house? Will the landlord serve each tenant with eviction papers? Would not this be another issue of possible retaliation or discrimination towards me if she does not serve my roommate also with eviction papers? I believe the HUD specialist will want to know if I’m served the 60 day notice. Then I’m sure everyone whose read this thread and about me being serve a 60 day notice will definitely want to know who was served eviction papers on day 61: it better be both.
The landlord told the roommate how everything she’s done since day one has been wrong. Landlord say’s everything I have received is voided and has no bearing on this new 60 day notice. Man she just has no ideal how wrong she is.
I know where I will be on day 61, I’ll be awaking from a good nights sleep waiting to be served eviction papers. What will the roomate receive or not receive on that same day?
Not to be blunt, but why? Your life there is going to be fairly stressful and anxiety filled dealing with this, and you have adequate time to find a new place to live. If it’s the principle of the thing, fine, but is it worth it at the cost to your quality of life?
I’ve been wondering this as well. Why would anyone want to be where they are not wanted? My house sat empty for two years while I had it on the market. It finally sold. I had offers from people who would have rented it, but I couldn’t see dealing with potential headaches like this.
I agree with the others that you should focus on finding a new place to live. If HUD finds in your favor, then maybe you’ll get a couple months rent back. But the primary focus should be on getting yourself healthy and finding a new place to stay.
Good luck to you.
If I was in his shoes I would want to make sure I could have a successful suit against the land lord for housing discrimination. I don’t know enough about discrimination laws to know whether he already has enough for that or not, or if voluntarily leaving would undermine his suit.
I wouldn’t want to live there indefinitely though, because this land lord is essentially a huge bitch that has treated the OP poorly. Every month he lives there is another month he is her customer, giving her money. I don’t patronize businesses that treat me like shit.
New Place to Live
Today I have found out where I will be moving. It is a apartment complex which rents by a lease or month to month. They have 5 openings as of today and the manager says any given month something is always available. Knowing I have somewhere to go takes away that stress.
This new 60 day notice the landlord is about serve the roommate and myself really has no effect on me. Here is why? HUD’s notice to the respondent (landlord) should be mailed out next week. Once the landlord has posession of the letter she should immiedately seek advice concerning what she should do or she should contact me to work this out. Only if her IQ is so low or that she just wants to prove she is right she’ll wait for the 60 days to expire. At this time on the 61 day is only how anyone will know for sure if she will start the eviction process. If she does start the eviction process will: reread my other comments within this thread to find out what might happen to her.
The reason now that I am not so stressed like I was in the begining is I have obtained legal advice from a lawyer and HUD has taught me how this housing discrimination works. So Knowledge is powerful and keeps me clam. At the begining of this thread I stated I have made the decision to move out.
So far, I have prepared for the worst and I am hoping for the best.
I live in a house with a huge yard. I really do not want to trade a house for an apartment to live in. Therefore, it has always been my thought to reach an agreement with the landlord and still live in the same house which I lived in now for 6 years. Part of that agreement is to free the landlord from any settlement awarded by the court by her giving me some free rent. Or she may want to pay me some cash and I move out.
However, I do want to be here on day 61 of that 60 day notice because, if she files the eviction papers on me and not my roommate, I will notify HUD about it. I will also inform HUD I wish to have these charges settled in a court. I am going to seek the maximum puntive damages a jury will award me.
HUD has the authority to act on housing discrimination if housing discrimination has been committed or is about to be committed. I have kept HUD updated on everything I know about what the landlord is doing.
I have a place to move to.
My next move totally depends on the actions the landlord decides is in her best interest.
After that Checkmate.
Once she gets the letter from HUD, and is privy to the discrimination accusation, she’d be a fool to send a letter of eviction to you and not your roommate. But I suppose she’s already shown that she’s not the brightest bulb in the strand.
I’m glad things are improving and you’ve found a reasonable place to move.
Based on everything you’ve posted it certainly sounds like your landlord isn’t very bright, and also isn’t a very nice person. Evicting someone because of an injury/disability is low - if it’s an injury/disability they received serving their country it’s even lower. Shame on her.
However, it does sound like it might be best to find another place to live - you’ve got the one apartment lined up - maybe in the next 60 days (or whatever) you can continue to look for a place with a yard, or an apartment or townhouse on the ground floor with a bit of green space - I certainly understand the appeal of having a bit of grass nearby.
Regarding the HUD settlement - while it’s entirely possible that you will receive a large award from a jury, if your landlord doesn’t have the $$ to pay you, you won’t get very far. I’m (totally, completely) unsure if this type of judgement could be included in a bankruptcy - if it could your landlord may elect to go that route and you may not be able to collect anything. OTOH, perhaps she would have to sell the rental property you’re currently in and you would be able to receive some of those funds - I don’t know at all; however, if the time comes make sure to talk to a lawyer to help you, but maybe don’t be spending your settlement cheque quite yet.
Anyhow - I’m glad things are looking up for you - I hope everything works out.
As an aside, it sounds like your roomie is a bit of a douche bag too if he’s sneaking around with the landlord trying to get you out. Maybe keep your eye on him a little bit too.
HUD did a property search concerning what the landlord owns. The landlord owns this house and another house both paid for. Really and truly I do not want to go to court but I will if she does try to evict me. Especially since she has admitted twice now that what she has already did was wrong. Then to still procede she has to be punished.
If (and only If) a jury was to award punitive damages in a high dollar amount the prosecutor or a lawyer will help me collect the award. Your right I cannot count the money before anything is awarded.
I would be happy to get some free rent, save my money and find a small house with a small yard. I also, have 2 cats and the apartment where I might move will allow me to have my cats. I am very attached to my cats.
As far as my roommate, I no longer trust him. I do not share anything I know legally or what HUD has told me. In the begining I thought he was still my friend. However, After several attempts requesting him to remain neutral of this situation he has choosen to help the landlord.
Can you guys believe he gave names and addresses to the landlord to serve us both the 60 day notice? These addresses are friends of his. Where is his pair of balls to tell the landlord hire someone to serve me? Why also, would he be so willing to make sure the landlord served him properly on the first attempt? Guess that might make one to think it is really not a “true legal notice to him to actually have to move out.”
I have been lucky because someone refered me to this lawyer and he has agreed to answer any questions I have legally about whats going on without charging me. No in person meetings are allowed but when he is available he talks with me by phone. This has been such a huge helpful resource for me.
Everyone on the street where I live are also supporting me all the way. The roommate has told a few of them whats going on based on the landlord and his conversations. This will be very helpful should he and the landlord try to deny some of the things said.
I might have to be in the hospital the last week of June. If so to protect my belongings at the house and to prevent the locks being changed or anything else unlawful from happening I will be giving my closest friend a limited power attorney to allow him to have a key to the house and permission to enter the hous during my hospitalization. I will be contacting the lawyer to find out if a written notice must be given to my roommate and/or landlord.
You know they have a law stating it is unlawful for a landlord to lock a tenant out of his rental unit. To have such a law that means landlords have actually done this before. How stupid are some of these landlords?
Um, I’m pretty sure the landlord had both already.
I think this is evidence of what I said back on 1 June that the roommate asked the landlord to evict RADTENN.
From this turn of events, and something else that was said earlier, I’m getting the impression that the landlady and the roommate are romantically involved. Is this the case?
Then I could see why the landlady would think she could notify one tenant and not the other - she’s moving in to live with the roomy. Except that doesn’t fly legally.
Since the roommate is siding with the landlady, it does lend some credence to the idea the roommate wants RADTENN gone.
The roommate and landlord are not involved in any type of relationship.
The roommate has always said he does not wish for me to move out.
The roommate and I have been great friends until this all started after I was discharged from the hospital.
The roommate was told by the landlord to make sure I was making progres on moving out. He kept her informed.
The landlord wants to serve me the 60 day notice with a friend the roommate knows who lives in this area. She’s to cheap to hire to someone to do it.
As far as wanting me evicted this is strictly the landlords ideal. My roommate had nothing to do with that desicion.
The roommate for some reason feels he is obligated to do as the landlord tells or asks him. Has he started moving his stuff out yet? Has he found a place to live yet? You need to do this. You need to do that. This is why I stated I no longer trust because he is being her puppet. Since this situation involves him in no way what’s so ever I have asked him to remain neutral: Quite keeping her updating to the minute what I’m doing.
The roommate and landlord are not involved in any type of relationship.
The roommate has always said he does not wish for me to move out.
The roommate and I have been great friends until this all started after I was discharged from the hospital.
The roommate was told by the landlord to make sure I was making progres on moving out. He kept her informed.
The landlord wants to serve me the 60 day notice with a friend the roommate knows who lives in this area. She’s to cheap to hire to someone to do it.
As far as wanting me evicted this is strictly the landlords ideal. My roommate had nothing to do with that desicion.
The roommate for some reason feels he is obligated to do as the landlord tells or asks him. Has he started moving his stuff out yet? Has he found a place to live yet? You need to do this. You need to do that. This is why I stated I no longer trust because he is being her puppet. Since this situation involves him in no way what’s so ever I have asked him to remain neutral: Quite keeping her updating to the minute what I’m doing. Maybe he feels he might be evicted if he quites giving her information about me.