# PASSIONS: Why is this election so different? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 5, 2008, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148 "2008-09-05T07:38:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/41 "2008-09-05T19:00:49Z")
Because Bush was the most polarizing President ever who terrified everyone and ruined the GOP. So the GOP is holding on by a thread and the Dems can’t stand the idea of Bush getting to vet his own successor. ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/42 "2008-09-05T19:01:29Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > It’s nothing like that today – though the same divisions of that time linger on and are represented in the present candidates and the movements backing them. Yes, it’s kind of funny. Most (not all) are using the same rhetoric, fighting the same battles even though they’re for the most part over. They’ve brought up their kids to fight them too. That’s something that sets aside both McCain and Obama from other politicians. McCain was, er, otherwise occupied during the worst of that shitstorm, and Obama was raised elsewhere. ---
**Author:** ![burundi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3ec8ea/32.png) [@burundi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burundi)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/43 "2008-09-05T19:33:29Z")
For me, it feels different because for the first time in my life, there’s someone I want to vote for instead of just someone I want to vote against. > [@WhyNot](#): > > This time, I feel like I’d be personally affected. I feel like I’ve \*been \*personally affected by this past presidency (I feel the pinch at the gas pump, I feel the inconvenience at airports, I feel disgust at my kid’s school jumping through NCLB hoops instead of just teaching already, I feel the increase in hostility in my culturally diverse neighborhood, I feel the terror of home ownership NOT being a good investment for the first time in my life…), and I feel like I personally will continue to be affected by the decisions made by the next presidency. I agree with this, too. I think that many, many Americans across the political spectrum have the feeling like we as a country are, frankly, fucked. The issues feel more real and not in a good way. And so there’s a huge desire to get un-fucked and a lot of differences of opinions about how to do that. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/44 "2008-09-05T19:34:01Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Think this one through. Look at the long term. Do you really want an incoming Republican administration in 2017 to prosecute Obama for something? **Hell, yes,** if he actually does anything criminal! Or even anything **arguably** criminal; he’ll get his day in court like anybody else. And that’s thinking in the long term. **Every** president should be conscious every day of living with that risk, simply because the president is not above the law. ---
**Author:** ![A\_shameful\_cracka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ebca7d/32.png) [@A\_shameful\_cracka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_shameful_cracka)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/45 "2008-09-05T19:50:36Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > A friend of ours was pulled up to light recently - and some moron in the car next to hers was flashing rude signs drawn on an envelope because she had an Obama sticker on her car. This was at ten at night, and she was alone in the car. Very intimidating for a woman, and there’s no excuse for it at all. And when we discussed it, we agreed that passions were so high right now that none of us would be surprised if it had gone the other way - per **Sampiro** above. My wife wants to put an Obama/Biden sign in our front yard - she’s not even that strong a supporter of Obama, she just likes to put signs in the yard, whether they are supporting church festivals, PTA fundraisers, or whatever. I’ve been trying to discourage her, just because of how rabid some of the anti-Obama people are. I know the vast majority of Republicans are reasonable people, and I know there are crazies on both sides, but some people seem so threatened by and angry about Obama specifically and “Liberals” in general that I honestly fear for my family’s safety if we publicize our support for him. ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/46 "2008-09-05T20:01:57Z")
> [@Oy](#): > > Your kind of cynicism, **marshmallow** , I believe is one of the reasons things don’t get done. It’s very easy to just dismiss all politics as saying “They’re all the same. Fuck 'em.” and walk away, plus you get to look worldly wise and sophisticated while you’re doing it. It doesn’t help anyone, but it’s easy and it scores you “cool” points. Hope you enjoy them. Lots of things get done. Maybe we don’t particularly care for them but it’s not possible to deny the constant flurry of activity. But I’m not that cynical. I believe in the power of people to resist and change power structures which seek to control and constrain them. I may not find it _likely_, as it would take an unrealistic series of events depending on how much change we’re talking about, but it’s within the realm of the imaginable and there are numerous historical precedents, including some successful (if limited in scope) examples in our own country’s past. Cynics are people who say politics is voting and voting for their guy will make everything right as rain, particularly when the benefactors of all these votes actively fight against nearly everything these people supposedly desire. If you want to see some real cynics go visit Daily Kos or Digby. **Maeglin** : You originally stated I appeared to be shocked by Obama’s support (or the subjective quality of it). I can’t comment on how I seemed but it was an incorrect inference and I don’t see how you thought that. I’m sorry if my use of the word model instead of world view or my opinion on the link between Obama’s charisma and his starry eyed supporters annoyed you. I don’t mean to put on airs. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/47 "2008-09-05T20:06:06Z")
I felt like 2004 was more important, and I was mightily pissed that Bush won yet again, in spite of all reason. I just could not believe that the American people would kick themselves in the collective balls like that. Of course, now that this point has been driven home, it won’t be such a shock this time 😃 But seriously… I’ve voted Democrat as long as I remember, and I feel that regardless of what happens in November, we’ve already won in some ways. We forced the Republicans to pick an unpopular moderate maverick instead of another tired right-wing establishment insider. We forced them to pick a female VP (unqualified), 24 years after the Dems did the same, just so they could also say they were on the right side of history. As for McCain individually, I dislike his platform and I hope he doesn’t win in November, but I will not feel that a travesty has occurred like in previous elections that went Republican. I just hope the old man can avoid keeling over while in office because… well, you know. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/48 "2008-09-05T20:10:34Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > **Hell, yes,** if he actually does anything criminal! Or even anything **arguably** criminal; he’ll get his day in court like anybody else. And that’s thinking in the long term. **Every** president should be conscious every day of living with that risk, simply because the president is not above the law. You’re missing the point: a lot of Democrats **want** to prosecute him. That’s wrong. If he’s done wrong then they should, with regret, _have to_ prosecute him. The first attitude is a great danger to democracy. ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/49 "2008-09-05T20:10:59Z")
> [@A\_shameful\_cracka](#): > > My wife wants to put an Obama/Biden sign in our front yard - she’s not even that strong a supporter of Obama, she just likes to put signs in the yard, whether they are supporting church festivals, PTA fundraisers, or whatever. I’ve been trying to discourage her, just because of how rabid some of the anti-Obama people are. I know the vast majority of Republicans are reasonable people, and I know there are crazies on both sides, but some people seem so threatened by and angry about Obama specifically and “Liberals” in general that I honestly fear for my family’s safety if we publicize our support for him. What region do you live in? I live in CT, got yard signs all over my front lawn…and one large 4x5 plywood sign with vinyl Obama 08’ on both sides. I dont worry about our safety at all, a guy down the street has the same set-up however for McCain/Palin - I don’t care. That’s what makes this country great. I’m sure people drive by my house every day saying, _"f_cking librul, he wants to give the country over to the hippies"_. Heck I’m sure people drive by my neighbors house saying, "fcking conservative..wants to keep this country going down the sh_tter"\*. Rarely have I seen anything escalate anywhere near a political hate crime. ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/50 "2008-09-05T20:16:42Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > You’re missing the point: a lot of Democrats **want** to prosecute him. That’s wrong. If he’s done wrong then they should, with regret, _have to_ prosecute him. The first attitude is a great danger to democracy. We wouldn’t want to prosecute him unless he had done wrong. We would be happy to see his back, but we wouldn’t be talking about bringing charges. In any case, as I said earlier, I don’t think there’s anything we can legally charge Bush for, even though morally he’s responsible for all of it. Cheney made sure that he was the cut-out, and he knew he was doing it, from what I’ve gathered. He made sure that if the chickens came home to roost, the buck would stop with him, to mix my metaphors. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/51 "2008-09-05T20:17:42Z")
> [@A\_shameful\_cracka](#): > > My wife wants to put an Obama/Biden sign in our front yard - she’s not even that strong a supporter of Obama, she just likes to put signs in the yard, whether they are supporting church festivals, PTA fundraisers, or whatever. I’ve been trying to discourage her, just because of how rabid some of the anti-Obama people are. I know the vast majority of Republicans are reasonable people, and I know there are crazies on both sides, but some people seem so threatened by and angry about Obama specifically and “Liberals” in general that I honestly fear for my family’s safety if we publicize our support for him. See, and I don’t put up a yard sign because there’s just no point - I live in Chicago! There’s just no mathematical way that my state _isn’t_ going to go with Obama no matter what I do or do not do. I actually feel a little hamstrung by that - I’d love to help his campaign in some meaningful way, but here? There’s just no point. ---
**Author:** ![Maeglin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@Maeglin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maeglin)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/52 "2008-09-05T20:25:50Z")
> [@marshmallow](#): > > **Maeglin** : You originally stated I appeared to be shocked by Obama’s support (or the subjective quality of it). I can’t comment on how I seemed but it was an incorrect inference and I don’t see how you thought that. I’m sorry if my use of the word model instead of world view or my opinion on the link between Obama’s charisma and his starry eyed supporters annoyed you. I don’t mean to put on airs. I still don’t think I have made myself clear. Your use of the word “model” is the window dressing, the symptom of the issue. If I inferred that you are “shocked”. well, sorry. You say that Obama’s candidacy is an obvious, standard ploy, yet the fact in evidence is that millions of people have bought in. The sky is obviously blue. If millions of people started believing otherwise, it would be safe to infer that I would be surprised. The problem is not your end position. Not believing Obama is capable of delivering the change he claims is not unreasonable at all. For what it’s worth, I do not feel the change will be delivered either. Obama will face the same sovereign dilemma problem as every other elected official, and I have no reason to believe he will solve it any differently. What is unreasonable is fabricating an ex post narrative to justify the scorn you heap on his campaign and his supporters, and further using it to argue _for_ your position. Your axiom is that large scale top-down change is extremely unlikely. I get that. I agree. But then you tell your ex post story that you believe should be obvious to everyone, that Obama is just a slick dick empty suit who magically appears when times are tough, ergo, he will not be able to deliver the change he promises. And because this scenario is so obvious and so compelling, you use it as a bludgeon. His slogan is “infantile”, and that he is just a “standard ploy”. What bothers me is neither your position nor even your airs, but the immense tautology that you use to ridicule Obama supporters. Your claim that this is a “standard ploy” is utterly self-serving since it both proceeds from and supports your beliefs. It is manifestly unfactual, yet by your tone and remarks, you would have us believe that it is. Obama supporters and Obama’s message can be ridiculed on their own merits. But at least bring your own axioms to the fight, not an unrational tautology. _That_ is what gets my goat. If you are going to presume to speak authoritatively, don’t leave your own beliefs unexamined. ---
**Author:** ![Sarahfeena](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarahfeena/32/519_2.png) [@Sarahfeena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarahfeena)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/53 "2008-09-05T20:28:25Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > See, and I don’t put up a yard sign because there’s just no point - I live in Chicago! There’s just no mathematical way that my state _isn’t_ going to go with Obama no matter what I do or do not do. I actually feel a little hamstrung by that - I’d love to help his campaign in some meaningful way, but here? There’s just no point. Yeah, not only will our state go to Obama, but 90% of my community will. There are Obama signs all over the place, but let’s face it, at that point, you’re not trying to convince anyone, you’re just making a statement. I still vote, of course, as there are always local elections that are meaningful, but my vote, not so much. It’s kind of funny, every election year, there are one or two Republicans in town who put up HUGE signs…literally, the size of a 2-car garage door. Drives the other residents wild, but if you layed out all the Obama signs, they would cover a football field, so I figure why not let them have their fun? ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/54 "2008-09-05T20:45:11Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > See, and I don’t put up a yard sign because there’s just no point - I live in Chicago! There’s just no mathematical way that my state _isn’t_ going to go with Obama no matter what I do or do not do. I actually feel a little hamstrung by that - I’d love to help his campaign in some meaningful way, but here? There’s just no point. You may very well be right, but do get out and vote if you are able. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![A\_shameful\_cracka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ebca7d/32.png) [@A\_shameful\_cracka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_shameful_cracka)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/55 "2008-09-05T21:02:00Z")
> [@Phlosphr](#): > > What region do you live in? I live in Dallas, TX. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/56 "2008-09-05T21:07:09Z")
> [@Phlosphr](#): > > You may very well be right, but do get out and vote if you are able. 😉 Oh, I will, just so I can tell my grandkids I voted in this literally historic election! 😃 Plus, of course, there’s all the local stuff to consider. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/57 "2008-09-05T21:19:54Z")
OP, may I respectfully ask, if you don’t mind, how old you are? If you’re college age or younger, it might seem like this election is more heated because it’s the one you’ve cared about and paid attention to most. I’m 27 and I remember 2000 and 2004 being a lot more heated than this, honestly. I remember '88, '92, and '96, but they were more like news events than anything because I couldn’t vote. ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/58 "2008-09-05T21:25:18Z")
I think '68 was the ugliest election of my life. A lot of that, though, is due to three things: the assassinations of Robert Kennedy and Martin Luther King, Jr. and Richard Daley, Major of Chicago, handling the protesting at the Democratic convention very badly. Had it not been for those three things, it would have been a memorable election, but no uglier than any other that I recall. Of course, I was twelve at the time… ---
**Author:** ![Batsinma\_Belfry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ea5d25/32.png) [@Batsinma\_Belfry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Batsinma_Belfry)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2008, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/59 "2008-09-05T22:07:05Z")
I’m less passionate about this election than any other. At first it was because I figured anybody would be an improvement over Bush. Now, it’s because I don’t think the next president (whoever that may be), is going to get us out of the mess we’re in. I just hope whichever one of these two Bozos win, doesn’t make an even bigger mess of things. ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148/60 "2008-09-06T03:34:09Z")
> [@Batsinma\_Belfry](#): > > I’m less passionate about this election than any other. At first it was because I figured anybody would be an improvement over Bush. > Now, it’s because I don’t think the next president (whoever that may be), is going to get us out of the mess we’re in. I just hope whichever one of these two Bozos win, doesn’t make an even bigger mess of things. The big thing, to me at least, is will McCain get us into a shooting war with Iraq or a cold war with Russia if he gets into office? The economy will obviously keep on the same track of trickle down with pretty much as little regulation as they can possibly get away with, which will be somewhat constrained by a Democratic majority in Congress and the Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac problems of this year. So I don’t think McCain will make us much worse domestically, although I don’t see him as making us significantly better, for example, correcting or even addressing the problem in the Justice Department, and certainly not on the economy. On foreign policy, though, the risk is much greater. McCain is a balls to the wall gambler. That could lead to big wins, but it could also lead to major failures. It’s ironic that he’s the guy over seventy, while Obama is the one under fifty, since their approaches are in many ways what you would associate with the reverse. I guess I’m just too old to vote McCain; he’s too risky. 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/passions-why-is-this-election-so-different/462148.md?page=4)