# "Patty shells" (US) and "vol au vents" (UK) ... exactly the same thing? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 27, 2016, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049 "2016-09-27T17:17:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2016, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/1 "2016-09-27T17:17:34Z")
Title is the question: are American “patty shells” and British “vol au vents” exactly the same thing? [Google for “patty shells”](https://www.google.com/webhp?tab=nw&ei=PeLFVryNNoT2-AGO5auACg&ved=0EKkuCAQoAQ#q=patty+shells) [Google for “vol au vents”](https://www.google.com/webhp?tab=nw&ei=PeLFVryNNoT2-AGO5auACg&ved=0EKkuCAQoAQ#q=vol+au+vents) What I can’t seem to ascertain is whether or not there is a size difference. Patty shells, at least in the New Orleans area, are invariably about 1.5"-2" in diameter (~4-5 cm). Stuffed patty shells are kind of a two-bite hors d’ouevres around here. Are the vol au vents small like that, too? Some of the images I’ve run across make the vol au vents look about palm-sized (call it 4"-5" or 10-12 cm). Maybe the v-o-v’s vary more in size? ---
**Author:** ![Cartoonacy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/848f3c/32.png) [@Cartoonacy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartoonacy)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2016, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/2 "2016-09-27T20:23:00Z")
Is this a regional thing? I’m in New York, something of a foodie, and I’ve never in my life heard a pastry crust called a “patty shell.” ---
**Author:** ![Pai325](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Pai325](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pai325)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2016, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/3 "2016-09-27T22:30:15Z")
I’ve heard of patty shells (Chicago), but the ones I’ve seen have always been larger. We might have creamed tuna or creamed beef on a patty shell. They were good. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2016, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/4 "2016-09-27T23:19:46Z")
> [@Cartoonacy](#): > > Is this a regional thing? I’m in New York, something of a foodie, and I’ve never in my life heard a pastry crust called a “patty shell.” Me, either. The OP puzzled the hell out of me until I looked at the photos. ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2016, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/5 "2016-09-27T23:37:29Z")
> [@Cartoonacy](#): > > Is this a regional thing? I’m in New York, something of a foodie, and I’ve never in my life heard a pastry crust called a “patty shell.” Never heard of it in MI, either ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2016, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/6 "2016-09-27T23:43:59Z")
In Australia we call them vol au vents too, but they come in varying sizes…from mini one-bite size to larger ones that would serve as an entree. ---
**Author:** ![stillownedbysetters](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/41988e/32.png) [@stillownedbysetters](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stillownedbysetters)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2016, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/7 "2016-09-27T23:58:57Z")
Another Chicagoan checking in. We always knew these as patty shells or pastry shells. ---
**Author:** ![jnglmassiv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f07891/32.png) [@jnglmassiv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jnglmassiv)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/8 "2016-09-28T02:34:00Z")
Chicago here and (I’d thought) pretty well plugged into the food scene. I’ve never heard the term patty shell. The linked photos are what I’d call puff pastry. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/9 "2016-09-28T02:35:46Z")
Puff pastry shells or vol au vents. Northeast ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/10 "2016-09-28T02:45:42Z")
> [@jnglmassiv](#): > > Chicago here and (I’d thought) pretty well plugged into the food scene. I’ve never heard the term patty shell. The linked photos are what I’d call puff pastry. Ditto. Maybe it’s a generational thing? Or maybe it’s highly regional in Chicago? ---
**Author:** ![stui\_magpie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stui_magpie/32/11010_2.png) [@stui\_magpie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stui_magpie)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/11 "2016-09-28T02:56:47Z")
Have a look at the images in the google search for patty shells. The “Tenderflake” brand actually has both Patty Shell and Vol au vent written on the box. ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/12 "2016-09-28T03:00:03Z")
> [@Pai325](#): > > …creamed beef on a patty shell. They were good. My dear Papa, who served the U.S. during the second world war, lovingly referred to this as “Shit on a Shingle.” ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/13 "2016-09-28T12:05:58Z")
> [@jnglmassiv](#): > > Chicago here and (I’d thought) pretty well plugged into the food scene. I’ve never heard the term patty shell. The linked photos are what I’d call puff pastry. Well, vol-au-vents are made out off puff pastry, which is the ingredient rather than the shell itself. I’m in the UK, and agree with others that vol-au-vents come in a variety of sizes, but generally I’d estimate about 5-6cm diameter. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/14 "2016-09-28T12:35:35Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Ditto. Maybe it’s a generational thing? Or maybe it’s highly regional in Chicago? Not all of Chicago. Chicagoan, born and bred, never heard of 'em. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/15 "2016-09-28T15:13:20Z")
> [@Cartoonacy](#): > > Is this a regional thing? I’m in New York, something of a foodie, and I’ve never in my life heard a pastry crust called a “patty shell.” “Patty shells” are widely known in the New Orleans area – patty shells with various stuffings (seafood, especially oyster, is most popular) are a popular upscale hors d’oueuvre. Many locals also prepare them for Thanksgiving and Christmas. Google, and the responses to this thread, suggest that “patty shells” are known by that name by some people in other parts of the U.S. but that the term doesn’t break cleanly by either regional or generational lines. … [One of our esteemed local bakeries answers my O.P. question decisively](https://www.haydelbakery.com/N.O.-Pattie-Shells--48) – yes, “patty shells” = “vol-au-vents”: > [@](#): > > The pattie shell, also known as a vol-au-vent, is an old New Orleans favorite that is prepared from our “made from scratch” recipe. Each pattie shell is hand cut. The end result is a rich buttery flaky bite of puff pastry filled with your favorite recipe. Preparing for your next event just became easier! ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/16 "2016-09-28T15:19:09Z")
Something else: I don’t think I’ll be able to cite it … but I would bet that the “patty” in “patty shell” ultimately derives from French _pâte_ (dough, pastry). In the U.S., the term may have originated in French-speaking areas of Louisiana and spread from there – perhaps up river along the Mississippi originally. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/17 "2016-09-28T15:47:43Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > Something else: I don’t think I’ll be able to cite it … but I would bet that the “patty” in “patty shell” ultimately derives from French _pâte_ (dough, pastry). In the U.S., the term may have originated in French-speaking areas of Louisiana and spread from there – perhaps up river along the Mississippi originally. That makes a lot of sense. So it is obviously **wrong**! 😛 ---
**Author:** ![That\_Don\_Guy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/that_don_guy/32/538_2.png) [@That\_Don\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/That_Don_Guy)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/18 "2016-09-28T16:05:18Z")
> [@Ukulele\_Ike](#): > > My dear Papa, who served the U.S. during the second world war, lovingly referred to this as “Shit on a Shingle.” I thought that term referred to the version on toast. ---
**Author:** ![Misnomer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/misnomer/32/14897_2.png) [@Misnomer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Misnomer)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/19 "2016-09-28T17:02:59Z")
DC/Northern Virginia here (with stints in MD, PA, NJ, TX, CA, Germany, and England) and I’d never heard the term “patty shell” or “vol au vent.” I’ve also never seen one, going by the pictures on Google. At first I thought the OP was talking about an English pasty, but with those the dough is thicker and they’re closed – kind of like a Hot Pocket (but _much_ better). I’ve never seen a tall, open shell of puff pastry before, but I think I would like it! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Pai325](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Pai325](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pai325)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/patty-shells-us-and-vol-au-vents-uk-exactly-the-same-thing/767049/20 "2016-09-28T18:12:57Z")
> [@Ukulele\_Ike](#): > > My dear Papa, who served the U.S. during the second world war, lovingly referred to this as “Shit on a Shingle.” My dear father did the same, but assured my mother hers was not like that. True or tactful? I’ll never know.