# Paul McCartney says: "Yoko didn't break us up" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 31, 2012, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446 "2012-10-31T15:36:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/21 "2012-10-31T17:14:02Z")
> [@Raskolnikov](#): > > already during the “white album” Paul was playing bass, guitar and even drums and many of the tracks because the band was in such discord. If Ringo tells you to go fuck yourself and storms off, things are not good. Although that’s not the only reason Paul was playing multiple instruments. Paul and John and George were all working separately on their own songs at times. There wasn’t much of a band concept. > [@](#): > > anyone who’s read a few reputable books on the Beatles will come to realize that Paul was the glue that held the band together during the later years. Something the others didn’t always appreciate. Maybe there would have been less bitterness if they’d let it go a few years earlier, but it fell to Paul. If John was angry at Paul for going public with the breakup (while he was promoting his solo album) I suspect it’s because they weren’t talking at all. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/22 "2012-10-31T17:16:41Z")
I never thought she was funny, either. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/23 "2012-10-31T17:17:04Z")
Yoko was certainly a part of the breakup, but it would have happened without her. The group was falling apart as they moved in different directions. George wanted more of his music highlighted. The **Get Back** album sessions were extremely stressful because of the camera crews and the unfamiliar studio. The group no longer toured, which was necessary, which made what they did more work than fun (you can see how much they enjoyed doing the rooftop concert). There were stresses due to the financial mismanagement of Apple Corps, and bringing in Alan Klein created a rift (Paul wanted Linda Eastman’s father, who probably was a better choice, but obviously the others in the band were suspicious of he would favor Paul). Into that, John insisted on bringing Yoko into the studio. The others were uncomfortable with her presence, mostly because they wanted it to be a work environment, but John didn’t care. This really was more John’s doing than Yoko’s, though. McCartney had been the one working to keep the group together after Brian Epstein’s death, and he eventually grew tired of it. He got everyone together to do **Abbey Road** , though George understood at that point that it would be their last album as the Beatles. After that, he stopped trying. The Beatles would have broken up, Yoko or not. If she hadn’t been there, it would have made little difference. ---
**Author:** ![tomcar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tomcar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomcar)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/24 "2012-10-31T18:29:12Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > I have. All the works that I’ve seen have been derivative, banal, badly-executed, or all three at once. Her accomplishments as an artist are on about the same level as her accomplishments as a singer. Yoko was a major influence musically. Bands like B52s, sugarcubes, cocteau twins all show Yoko’s influence. She is a talented artist and much of the art world considers her as such. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/25 "2012-10-31T18:32:35Z")
And she was something of an accomplished artist before she met John Lennon. ---
**Author:** ![Nonsuch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nonsuch/32/2922_2.png) [@Nonsuch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nonsuch)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/26 "2012-10-31T18:54:48Z")
Yoko once said, on the subject of her going with John to Beatles recording sessions, that John might have refused to show up altogether had Yoko not agreed to go with him. Taking her at her word —which I do in this case, even knowing that she has an uncommonly convenient memory — you could argue that Yoko actually helped the Beatles stay together longer than they otherwise would have. ---
**Author:** ![Dallas\_Jones](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dallas_jones/32/3277_2.png) [@Dallas\_Jones](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dallas_Jones)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/27 "2012-10-31T19:16:49Z")
John was always the dominant band member, the driving force. If he wanted to quit, they would be done. And it seems, as I recall, that John and Paul were geting a bit sick of each other. But as **kunilou** says, they were together for a long time, and the break up was overdue, for whatever reason came along. > [@](#): > > That said, the group was together for an extraordinarily long time in band years. It just happened to be partly Yoko. And that is good enough for the nightly news. A conveinient excuse. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/28 "2012-10-31T19:20:49Z")
How has Yoko magically morphed into “a woman of color” and how did being Asian influence negativity toward her? I have disliked her attempts at music (which range from dreadful, to meh on rare occasion), whiny singing voice\* and pitiful efforts to stay in the spotlight (including being a judge for Rolling Stone’s listing of 500 supposedly all-time best rock songs). I don’t blame her for breaking up the Beatles, a collection of increasingly overwrought egos who would’ve busted up without her. The only bad thing I can note about her possible effect on others is that John Lennon’s quality output drifted downwards after he got involved with her and sank even more quickly when he went solo. But I suspect drugs were far more responsible for that than Yoko (she has however expressed contempt for Lennon’s work while with the Beatles, a further indication of her musical illiteracy). \*“Attica State, Attica State, we all live in Attica State.” ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/29 "2012-10-31T19:26:53Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > how did being Asian influence negativity toward her? You can claim (reasonably) that people would have disliked her anyway if they blamed her for the breakup of the band, but you can’t read stuff like “John Rennon’s Excrusive Gloupie” and not realize that a lot of people said some really racist shit about her. That was an article in Esquire Magazine, by the way - not the 1960s equivalent of Stormfront. ---
**Author:** ![drewtwo99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d07c76/32.png) [@drewtwo99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewtwo99)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/30 "2012-10-31T19:31:19Z")
Why be mad at Ono when our hate is more properly directed at the person responsible for… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/31 "2012-10-31T19:43:55Z")
> [@drewtwo99](#): > > Why be mad at Ono when our hate is more properly directed at the person responsible for… > > simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time…simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… simply having a wonderful christmas time… You are going to die a lonely, cold death. Alone. Did I say alone? > [@](#): > > You can claim (reasonably) that people would have disliked her anyway if they blamed her for the breakup of the band, but you can’t read stuff like “John Rennon’s Excrusive Gloupie” and not realize that a lot of people said some really racist shit about her. That was an article in Esquire Magazine, by the way - not the 1960s equivalent of Stormfront. Holy shit. The level of casual racism throughout the years in this country still manages to shock me sometimes. Esquire Magazine? And people still say “How did being Asian affect her?” ---
**Author:** ![Polerius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d78d45/32.png) [@Polerius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polerius)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/32 "2012-10-31T20:23:06Z")
Can someone remind me the arguments people used in the past that supported the “Yoko broke up the band” idea? It seems to me that there would at least have been some smidgen of truth to it, if the myth has persisted for decades. ---
**Author:** ![Nonsuch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nonsuch/32/2922_2.png) [@Nonsuch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nonsuch)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/33 "2012-10-31T20:28:04Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > The only bad thing I can note about her possible effect on others is that John Lennon’s quality output drifted downwards after he got involved with her and sank even more quickly when he went solo. But I suspect drugs were far more responsible for that than Yoko (she has however expressed contempt for Lennon’s work while with the Beatles, a further indication of her musical illiteracy). Yoko certainly encouraged John’s solipsism —his belief that, because all art is inescapably self-referential, his own work had to be explicitly and recognizably about himself in order to be authentic. He hated Paul’s “character” songs, “all those songs about people being postmen” or however he put it. He ended up putting himself in a trap that seriously compromised the quality of his post-Beatles work. He was fine when he had fresh angst to tap into, as he did on _Plastic Ono Band_. When he didn’t, he ended up producing conflicted, vaguely hacky stuff like _Walls and Bridges_, or throwing in the towel altogether (by recording an album of non-originals and, later, giving up recording entirely for five years). ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/34 "2012-10-31T22:22:01Z")
I recently watched _Let It Be_ and I have to say that Yoko’s presence is awkward. You’ve got John, Paul, George, Ringo and Yoko all sitting in a circle putting together a Beatles album. You don’t have to be a Yoko-hater to feel there was one person who didn’t belong there. Heck, George Martin and Billy Preston were staying off to the background and they could have made a legitimate argument that they belonged in the inner circle. I can see why the other three were resentful that John apparently had decided to promote Yoko to full membership in the group. That said, I agree it wasn’t Yoko who was the cause of this problem. It was John who was pushing her to be there. ---
**Author:** ![sco3tt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@sco3tt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sco3tt)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/35 "2012-10-31T23:13:28Z")
> [@tomcar](#): > > Bands like B52s, sugarcubes, cocteau twins all show Yoko’s influence. I’m not up on the Cocteau Twins but if you’re referring to the obnoxious atonal contributions of Fred Schneider and Einar Orn to the other two bands, I don’t know that you’re really helping your argument. ---
**Author:** ![TreacherousCretin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treacherouscretin/32/476_2.png) [@TreacherousCretin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TreacherousCretin)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/36 "2012-10-31T23:29:15Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > I can’t think of a single good thing to say about Yoko Ono as an artist or musician (I don’t know her as a person, so I won’t comment on that), but it’s pretty OBVIOUS she wasn’t to blame for the Beatles’ split. She was a symptom of John Lennon’s alienation from the band, not the cause. This is what I would have posted, almost word for word, particularly the last line. ---
**Author:** ![tomcar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tomcar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomcar)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2012, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/37 "2012-11-01T00:25:21Z")
> [@sco3tt](#): > > I’m not up on the Cocteau Twins but if you’re referring to the obnoxious atonal contributions of Fred Schneider and Einar Orn to the other two bands, I don’t know that you’re really helping your argument. I can see why you would say that, but no, the bands’ early sound in general. Check out Yoko’s wiki pg for some more notes on the subject. She was an innovator trebley, electronic music, that alot of the early new wave used. Her high pitch singing also influenced many females. I grew to like her music through listening to Lennon. Try not skipping over her tracks. They can be a little uncomfortable at first… But that is a good thing. ---
**Author:** ![Jim\_s\_Son](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19adc/32.png) [@Jim\_s\_Son](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jim_s_Son)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2012, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/38 "2012-11-01T01:05:43Z")
> [@Polerius](#): > > Can someone remind me the arguments people used in the past that supported the “Yoko broke up the band” idea? > > It seems to me that there would at least have been some smidgen of truth to it, if the myth has persisted for decades. I suppose in the late 1960s the avant garde albums she and John did helped cause this, along with tracks like “Revolution #9” on “The White Album”. While that album’s reputation has grown over the years, contemporary reaction was more mixed. You also had them posing naked for “Two Virgins”, both front and back view (Yoko had an exceedingly ugly butt). You also have Yoko sitting herself down in the middle of the "Let it Be’ sessions. I don’t buy the argument that it was John’s idea..she was clearly the dominant person in that relationship (if it suited both of them, fine). A couple months before he was murdered, John willingly posing naked, curled up on Yoko, was looked impassive and remote. Made the cover of “Rolling Stone”. One should use Albert Goldman’s “The Lives of John Lennon” book with hesitation, but he has some details on their “Double Fantasy” album that it would have been stronger if it had John only material (the posthumous “Milk and Honey”). Producer Jack Douglas brought in Cheap Trick’s Rick Nielsen and Bun E Carlos to play on some songs but Yoko vetoed that, wanting control (again according to Goldman, who apparently did a lot of research but failed to use it when he wrote it, preferring the “goodies” that he remembered). Paul and Linda got a lot of grief for breaking up the Beatles. He tried to hold them together but was the guy who left, and quickly released a solo album after asking the others to hold back their efforts. And certainly Linda was a constant member of Wings, despite little talent. My understanding is they turned the mix down on her voice and keyboards during concerts. I think the Beatles would have broken up but Yoko accelerated it. Reminds m of in the 1980s, one guy I was stationed with had just got back from Japan and had a Japanese wife. A some people the subject of Yoko came up and he said Japanese hated her as much as Americans. One thing I wonder about is how other performance/avant garde artists view each other. I remember Laurie Anderson (who had a number 2 British song) saying she thought the commercial market was better than avant garde because the former you put it out there and the public decides. But in the latter, you need a patron. I would think whoever gets a patron’s sponsorship would have jealous detractors, no matter what their ability was. And Yoko married a pretty rich one. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2012, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/39 "2012-11-01T01:29:01Z")
This reminds me of the time Pope Paul VI said that Jews weren’t responsible for killing Christ. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2012, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446/40 "2012-11-01T01:38:12Z")
> [@Jim\_s\_Son](#): > > But in the latter, you need a patron. I would think whoever gets a patron’s sponsorship would have jealous detractors, no matter what their ability was. And Yoko married a pretty rich one. I don’t think she married John for his money. Yoko came from a very wealthy family. No doubt she and her art got a lot of publicity and a much wider audience tanks to her relationship with John, but even there, she was far from unknown before. I can remember hearing about her and her art projects (just from casual reading of the newspaper) before she took up with John, while she was still with Anthony Cox. It is odd how both the main Beatles seem to have ended up so pussy-whipped. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-mccartney-says-yoko-didnt-break-us-up/639446.md?page=3)