# Paul Thomas Anderson's Magnolia **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 21, 2004, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973 "2004-12-21T14:57:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2004, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/1 "2004-12-21T14:57:05Z")
I like dramas, especially well-acted dramas. I like surreal movies - Big Fish was great, and Hudson Hawk is a favorite. This movie, however, was a complete and utter piece of trash. I got The Insider, The Iron Giant, and Magnolia from Netflix last weekend. And watched them in that order. I really enjoyed in the Insider… loved the Iron Giant, too. But Magnolia… ugh. I want three hours of my life back. Mr. Anderson : To have a successful and entertaining drama, you need two things. One, a plot. It can be a weak plot, but there should be one. Two, characters. No, not “caricatures”… I know they sound similar, but they’re quite different, I can assure you. Your over-the-top, poorly developed “portraits” of human beings do not qualify. Cut Tom Cruise, Jason Robards, Julianne Moore, and Philip Seymour Hoffman out of the film, and their respective subplot… what have you lost? Some incoherence, some bad acting (even from Julianne Moore, usually solid) and about an hour of time. which might turn this stinker into a bearable, but boring film. ---
**Author:** ![Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dfb087/32.png) [@Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scoundrel_Swanswater)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2004, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/2 "2004-12-21T15:14:04Z")
I couldn’t disagree more. I thought it was a beautiful, moving piece of work. I didn’t like his other movies though. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2004, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/3 "2004-12-21T16:25:44Z")
I thought Tom Cruise was absolutely amazing in this film. Easily his best performance, and that’s not faint praise. ---
**Author:** ![CrazyCatLady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@CrazyCatLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CrazyCatLady)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2004, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/4 "2004-12-21T16:56:31Z")
Tom Cruise was impressive, I’ll grant you that. But overall, the movie sucked rancid goat ass. It was just excruciating, to the point that when it started raining frogs, my only reaction was relief that the damn thing must surely be almost over. Seriously, if I hadn’t ridden to the theater with other people, I would have walked out during the music montage. It was just that bad. I think the biggest thing was what bothered me about _Lost in Translation_–I just didn’t feel a damn thing for a single one of the characters. Give me characters I can like or dislike or feel sorry for, or something. If you won’t do that, at least the people I don’t give a shit about **do** something. ---
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2004, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/5 "2004-12-21T16:59:56Z")
Thanks, CCL - that’s the biggest part of my problem. The characters seemed so…contrived, that it was impossible to empathize with them. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2004, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/6 "2004-12-21T17:11:01Z")
[thread=286744]here[/thread] is a thread I started on the subject. ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2004, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/7 "2004-12-21T17:18:25Z")
I’m with you. Years ago, I talked my best friend into seeing _Magnolia_ when it first came out. The way the plotlines interlinked and everything tied up at the end looked interesting, at least according to what I read in the reviews. I wanted to like the movie. As I said, it looked interesting. Unfortunately, I found myself bored by the plots, unmoved by the characters, and annoyed by the movie’s pretentiousness. It seemed too show-offy for my taste, showing too much of the technique through the art, kind of like seeing an artist’s rough sketch through a painting. There was also only one character I came close to liking, the policeman, I think, and I got the impression the audience wasn’t supposed to like him because he was a stereotypical goody-goody. I admit Tom Cruise’s character was fun, in part because he seemed so easy to shoot down and because he reminds me of a friend of mine, but at the same time, I didn’t like him. I know there are people who love this movie and I thought I’d be one. I’m not. At least this one looked good. It’s also not the worst movie I’ve seen. Among other things, I indulged a different friend by agreeing to see _Troy_ with him this summer. The karmic debt I picked up by taking a friend to see _Magnolia_ has been repaid. 😉 CJ ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2004, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/8 "2004-12-21T17:46:46Z")
> [@Siege](#): > > There was also only one character I came close to liking, the policeman, I think, and I got the impression the audience wasn’t supposed to like him because he was a stereotypical goody-goody. I liked that character, too, and I disagree that the audience was supposed to dislike him. One of the things I liked about this movie was that _none_ of the characters are meant to be disliked by the audience, even the truly awful ones. The policman in particular, I think, was disliked by his fellow officers for being a “stereotypical goody-goody,” but never let that dissuade him from being a goody-goody. I thought that was very admirable, and I think was the major purpose behind his character. Also, William H. Macy. No film with William H. Macy can be totally worthless. ---
**Author:** ![shy\_guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a6a055/32.png) [@shy\_guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shy_guy)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2004, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/9 "2004-12-21T17:50:10Z")
I’m right there with 'ya, CandidGamera. _Magnolia_ is easily one of my ten least favorite films of all time. Absolutely putrid. ---
**Author:** ![Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19adc/32.png) [@Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2004, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/10 "2004-12-21T19:07:50Z")
I loved this movie. I liked the characters, found them believable (to a certain extent) and could relate to their pain. The soundtrack kicks ass too. ---
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2004, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/11 "2004-12-21T19:35:44Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Also, William H. Macy. No film with William H. Macy can be totally worthless. I felt he was wasted here. (No pun intended on his bar scene.) And his desire for braces, capped off with the jaw damage at the end of the movie? “Duuuhhrr. IRONY! Get it?” Yes, PT. We get it. “IRONY!” That’s a good boy, here’s a juice box. Go play with your crayons. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2004, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/12 "2004-12-22T00:50:40Z")
Eh, I thought the Macy storyline had a good O Henry vibe. Since I don’t really have anything else to say, I’ll just link to [**Cervaise** ’s review of the movie.](http://www.moviegeek.homestead.com/files/magnolia.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Harborwolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Harborwolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harborwolf)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2004, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/13 "2004-12-22T00:50:58Z")
I’m somewhat torn on the whole Magnolia thing. I liked parts of it, and I think Paul Thomas Anderson is a promising director. There were parts that drove me up the friggin wall though. The whole urban legend beginning thing seemed really friggin pointless. The rain of frogs part knocked my right out of the movie. :mad: Once I got past the beginning and into the movie, it was okay. Not brilliant, but good. When the rain of frogs happened, I couldn’t care less what happened to anyone. That was entirely pointless. ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2004, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/14 "2004-12-22T03:06:25Z")
I saw it once and had no desire to see it again. But I think it could have been improved if it hadn’t been dragged out for such a friggin’ long time. The length just seemed unnecessary to me. And the part where all the characters are listening to the same song at the same time and singing along to it was so contrived that I could do nothing but roll my eyes. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Escorpio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d07c76/32.png) [@El\_Escorpio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Escorpio)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2004, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/15 "2004-12-22T03:37:07Z")
Interesting that it would generate such ire. I loved this movie… I might consider it a flawed masterpiece, since it was longer than hell, but I truly loved it. I thought Tom Cruise was unbelievable, and I don’t usually like him. I thought the kid who played Stanley was fantastic, the numerous references to the Exodus verse (8:2) about the rain of frogs, the little hints about Freemasonry (Ricky Jay’s character), the culture of misogyny in the “Seduce and Conquer” group and the tyrannical and condescending woman that works there (you only hear her on the cell phone)… I don’t know. I compare it to Short Cuts, another movie that a whole lot of people seem to hate, but I thought the characters were much more palatable in this one. Just casting my vote in the “pro” column. ---
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2004, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/16 "2004-12-22T13:42:27Z")
> [@vivalostwages](#): > > I saw it once and had no desire to see it again. But I think it could have been improved if it hadn’t been dragged out for such a friggin’ long time. The length just seemed unnecessary to me. And the part where all the characters are listening to the same song at the same time and singing along to it was so contrived that I could do nothing but roll my eyes. Yeah, that scene is one of my biggest problems with it - see also the scene with the male nurse (Phil Parma/Philip Seymour Hoffman) on the phone with the Seduce and Destroy salesdroid, and talking about “You see, in a movie, this is the scene where…” ---
**Author:** ![cbawlmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@cbawlmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cbawlmer)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2004, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/17 "2004-12-22T18:32:50Z")
I have very mixed feelings about _Magnolia_, but overall I didn’t really care for it. I’ve only seen it once, and never could work up the desire to watch it again to figure out what I liked or didn’t like. Neither could I work up the energy to really hate it. I love many of the actors in the film and I absolutely adored _Boogie Nights_. I could see what he was going for with the film, but it left me cold. It’s just a big ol’ void in my brain. On the other hand, I know lots of people who loved the movie and were incredibly moved by it. ---
**Author:** ![FriendRob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecc23a/32.png) [@FriendRob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriendRob)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2004, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/18 "2004-12-22T18:41:25Z")
I loved _Magnolia_. Now, if you really want to see a bunch of pretentious, overwrought dreck with characters that you can’t possibly give a damn about, try _Moulin Rouge_… ---
**Author:** ![down\_by\_law](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/65b543/32.png) [@down\_by\_law](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/down_by_law)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2004, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/19 "2004-12-22T19:54:44Z")
i though magnolia was a special film. i was totally engrossed during the whole movie. plus, it just had something i can’t describe. it just clicked with me. i’ve recommended it to a few people and they’ve all hated it, though. one said it was the worst movie he’s ever seen. so who knows. ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2004, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973/20 "2004-12-22T20:13:56Z")
> [@FriendRob](#): > > I loved _Magnolia_. > > Now, if you really want to see a bunch of pretentious, overwrought dreck with characters that you can’t possibly give a damn about, try _Moulin Rouge_… I loved both movies. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paul-thomas-andersons-magnolia/280973.md?page=2)