# Pawn Stars - They totally blew this deal. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 18, 2012, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643 "2012-07-18T17:47:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Kimballkid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5a626/32.png) [@Kimballkid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimballkid)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/21 "2012-07-18T19:47:12Z")
> [@Kimballkid](#): > > There was the guy with the Native American ‘good luck’ thingy (I forget what they called it) and there was another one recently where Rick really wanted to buy the item, but the guy just wanted to pawn it because it was a family heirloom or something like that. Correction, the guy with the family heirloom was on Cajun Pawn Stars and it was Jimmy who really wanted to buy it (it was a really nice watch BTW). ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/22 "2012-07-18T19:50:44Z")
I was watching a somewhat similar show (“Auction Kings” on Discovery) where people bring their stuff into the auction house, they figure out how much its worth, and then they auction it. The auctions aren’t staged, but I was looking into one of the stories and found an interesting article. A woman had a guitar signed by Johnny Cash, that he signed for her because they were friends. She had a great story about her relationship with Cash and you really felt for her when she cried because she was sad about parting with the item. An anonymous celebrity bought the guitar, and they didn’t reveal who it was. I was searching to see if I could find out who bought it and found[this article that revealed the backstory](http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/porter/article_ebc6cb5e-1e55-51b2-a4db-ef621f961d88.html) of the woman’s appearance on the show. She’d actually sold it to a guy in Florida a few years ago. He took it to the auction house and when they wanted to know more about the guitar, he put them in touch w/ the woman that originally owned it. They brought her onto the show as if she was the one auctioning it in the first place. So the auction was real, but the first part where they received the item was completely staged. This isn’t Pawn Stars, obviously, but they’re in the same vein. ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/23 "2012-07-18T19:54:01Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > As for the OP, they don’t want to go into the antique tool selling business. To sell piece by piece to would probably take a long time to make a profit. In order to sell the entire set whole they would have to hope to find that one buyer willing to spend that much or put it up for auction. So they may be sitting on it for a long time or have to pay a percentage to auction. It makes sense to not buy it for too high a price. I watch the show and I agree. They didn’t blow it. They just made a business decision that it wasn’t worth it to them to part out a tool chest over time for a mediocre profit in their terms. They are very wealthy and have to be very selective about the deals they agree to. The items they buy must have very high profit potential (well over double) for things that would take any significant amount of time to sell. They mainly depend on buying things with a very good idea of who is going to buy it already. Sure, they could buy some more things and eventually make money on them but that ties up a lot of cash and requires risk and time. The sellers could usually get more from a specialized auction but that requires knowledge and takes time as well. Pawn Stars simply matches people up who need money immediately with those who know how to sell things for a quick profit. They don’t want their money tied up and have to work very much for only a few thousand dollars profit because that isn’t very significant to them. Someone else who has lots of time on their hands and personally loves antique tools might see it differently but that doesn’t make them wrong when it comes to their business model. The show isn’t fake either at least by my definition. It is the most famous pawn shop in the country if not the world. They do tons of deals that never make it to TV so there is plenty of room to be selective in what they show. Their fame lets people with odd and potentially valuable items know exactly where they can go to get cash money on the spot if they ever need to and some people do it for the money, TV exposure or both. There is no mystery or deception in that. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/24 "2012-07-18T19:55:56Z")
I’m still surprised by how many people think they’ll get top dollar value for their junk at a pawn shop. Some of them may just doing clueless negotiation, but why on earth would someone think they’ll get $10,000 for an item appraised by an expert at a value of $10,000 by selling it to a store? I think this why the pawn shops around here, and Rick’s like to buy gold. They pay market value for gold which makes the customer(?) happy, and their profit is (almost) guaranteed. What do you call someone who patronizes a pawn shop? Are they a customer if they’re the ones selling? ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/25 "2012-07-18T20:05:32Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > I’m still surprised by how many people think they’ll get top dollar value for their junk at a pawn shop. I’ve watched Pawn Stars quite a bit and used to ask myself that very question. But then I tried to imagine how I might feel, knowing nothing about the show or pawn shops in general, and what price I would ask after an in-store appraisal. My first reaction would be to ask for top-dollar, because I’m naturally suspicious and would be inclined not to believe a word out of their so-called “expert’s” mouth. Might as well start at the top and be willing to bargain down from there. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/26 "2012-07-18T20:15:06Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > I’ve watched Pawn Stars quite a bit and used to ask myself that very question. But then I tried to imagine how I might feel, knowing nothing about the show or pawn shops in general, and what price I would ask after an in-store appraisal. My first reaction would be to ask for top-dollar, because I’m naturally suspicious and would be inclined not to believe a word out of their so-called “expert’s” mouth. Might as well start at the top and be willing to bargain down from there. Well that’s clueless negotiating. No offense, but you shouldn’t try to dicker over something you don’t know the actual value of. But people on the show turn down a lot of offers after hearing from the expert. Sometimes they’re surprised at how much the value is, other times they think they’ve been low-balled. Kind of surprising because it’s being videotaped. But Antiques Roadshow had some crooked appraisers, so I can understand their cynicism. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/27 "2012-07-18T20:29:59Z")
Which scenario is most likely? [QUOTE=Scenario 1] Guy with an old box of tools bumps into a producer at a party and starts to talking. Producer eventually finds out about this box of tools, says, “Hey, we should fly you out and put you on the show!” Guy is reluctant, so they offer him some per diem and all-expenses paid. Guy agrees under the condition that his item is not actually ever for sale, and just “acts” like it is on camera. [/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Scenario 2] Guy stumbles into pawn shop after a 72 hour bender at the casino with his prized toolbox. Is shocked to discover cameras. [/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Scenario 3] Guy likes watching pawn stars, lives pretty close to Vegas, decides to show Rick his toolbox. (heh) He’s fully willing to sell it for the right price, but he knows deep down that Rick won’t offer enough. He knows this because he’s watched the show a bunch, and he knows Rick doesn’t like to part out collections of crap because it takes way too much time. He decides to go on TV anyway, so he makes the trip out there. Producer sees him walk in, decides to put the show on there air. Guy throws out a price that, for him, is a real price, even though he knows Rick probably won’t pay it. Absolutely nobody is surprised when Rick won’t pay it. [/QUOTE] I’d vote for Scenario 3, and I’d say that doesn’t fall under the condition of “staged.” It’s just that you can’t conduct a reality TV show like that past the first season, because being on TV completely changes the nature of the show. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/28 "2012-07-18T20:31:37Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Well that’s clueless negotiating. Sorry, I wasn’t clear. In other words, I wouldn’t _trust_ the expert.\* I’m assuming here that I know what the item is worth. I wouldn’t ask for more than their expert appraised the item at, because I know there would be no way I could get that. But why not ask for the max? _Unless of course he appraised it above what I think it’s worth!_ ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/29 "2012-07-18T20:32:28Z")
I worked in a baseball card/comic shop in my younger years and it was astounding how common it was for people to walk in and expect to be able to sell their item for full-resale value. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/30 "2012-07-18T20:37:09Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Which scenario is most likely? While I feel that Scenario 1 is pretty unlikely, what with the two basically offering to commit a fraud, I’d have to go with 2 being the most unlikely. Did you see the size of that toolbox? Can’t imagine carrying _that_ around Vegas for 72 hours! ---
**Author:** ![Foxy40](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a9a28c/32.png) [@Foxy40](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Foxy40)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/31 "2012-07-18T20:40:17Z")
I actually just stumbled upon this today and thought it was interesting. Seems like it is just a tourist trap now. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbx5zGMjJFM](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbx5zGMjJFM) ---
**Author:** ![Enderw24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba9def/32.png) [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/32 "2012-07-18T20:43:49Z")
In general, I think the experts on the show try to be on the mark with their appraisals. It’s bad business practice to consistently lowball your appraisals on national TV. That said, I don’t trust Danny the car guy at all. Not his appraisals and not his renovation estimates. They always run over budget. I think the biggest mistake Pawn Stars has made, and I think I mentioned it here before, is with a $20 gold double eagle coin. IIRC, they had an appraiser come in, eyeball the thing, rated it MS-63 and declare it worth around $33,000. I think they settled for arund $17,000. Here’s the problem. In the world of coins, one expert, no matter how skilled, is NOT the same as getting it professionally appraised. Nobody is going to spend $33,000 on a coin that just has “MS-63” marked on it even if you swear up and down that some guy says that’s what the coin’s grade is. You need it professionally appraised and locked into a tamper-proof case. So what happens if they do that and it comes back at MS-62 or MS-61? It’s a huge, huge difference in price. We’re talking possibly a ten thousand dollar mistake. ---
**Author:** ![antonio107](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/7ea924/32.png) [@antonio107](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antonio107)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/33 "2012-07-18T20:49:46Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > Here is how the show works if you have ever been to Las Vegas and seen the store. The store is huge. You only see a part of it. I’m sure things were done differently in the first season when no one knew about the place. Now there are lines of people hoping to sell their crap. None of them walk right up to Rick or even see him (although the entire store has signs saying just entering you give consent to be shown on TV). All that stuff is screened ahead of time. If there is anything interesting that might make for good TV they are asked to come back. I’m sure the producers set up the experts and everything else ahead of time. They are not going to waste time having everyone come back. If you are on TV (speaking not background) you are going to get paid an appearence fee. But I saw no evidence that any of the buying or selling is fake. Lots of the items you see on the TV are still in the store. So its all set up ahead of time. Not the same as fake. For scripted and fake see Hardcore Pawn. I was at the store Monday morning on my Vegas vacation. None of the guys from the show were there, and there’s an enormous rack of souvenirs that everyone was picking up stuff from. Assuming it was full like that all day (it was 9:30 AM) they’re making money hand over fist just from that. There was also a LOT of stuff there with signs that read “not for sale.” Antique guns, sports memorabilia (including a few grey cup rings I was surprised to see!), movie posters…the really cool stuff, IMHO. Why would you fill your store with neat stuff you have ZERO intention of selling? Serious question. I don’t know about the specific episode OP is referring to, but the whole place felt more like 90% tourist trap, 10% pawn shop, with the 10% being the enourmous display case of second hand wedding rings. I wouldn’t surprise me if there were a few people who brought junk out just to be on the TV, with no intention of selling! ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/34 "2012-07-18T20:50:15Z")
> [@Enderw24](#): > > In general, I think the experts on the show try to be on the mark with their appraisals. It’s bad business practice to consistently lowball your appraisals on national TV. I would agree with this, and think the experts would be fools not to give honest appraisals on the show. That being said, I’d believe _anything_ book expert [Rebecca Romney](http://www.google.com/imgres?num=10&hl=en&newwindow=1&tbm=isch&tbnid=tweySyEuLUgIKM:&imgrefurl=https://www.baumanrarebooks.com/about-us/press/library-lights.aspx&docid=sl91HtZqgveS3M&imgurl=https://www.baumanrarebooks.com/SiteFiles/images/romney.jpg&w=250&h=250&ei=uyAHULU2isTRAd7okbwI&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=232&vpy=176&dur=1114&hovh=200&hovw=200&tx=108&ty=62&sig=107977707109648243708&page=1&tbnh=178&tbnw=200&start=0&ndsp=20&ved=1t:429,r:0,s:0,i:76&biw=1330&bih=896) told me! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/35 "2012-07-18T20:53:01Z")
> [@Foxy40](#): > > I actually just stumbled upon this today and thought it was interesting. Seems like it is just a tourist trap now. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbx5zGMjJFM](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbx5zGMjJFM) Umm, that guy is obviously a moron. Why do you think they wouldn’t be trying sell TShirts to all the people who come in now because they saw the TV show? I don’t understand what people thought the show was about in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/36 "2012-07-18T20:53:24Z")
> [@Fiddle\_Peghead](#): > > Sorry, I wasn’t clear. In other words, I wouldn’t _trust_ the expert.\* I’m assuming here that I know what the item is worth. I wouldn’t ask for more than their expert appraised the item at, because I know there would be no way I could get that. But why not ask for the max? > > _Unless of course he appraised it above what I think it’s worth!_ I don’t understand your point. It doesn’t matter how much you think it is worth. It is only worth what someone will pay you for it. The experts are the ones that know the range your item would go for in a private sale to an interested collector or at an ideal auction and they are all real experts in their field. In other words, they quote the suggested retail range to the customer. Pawn Stars doesn’t ever pay the retail price because they are a business with taxes, store overhead, employees, etc. and they make that very clear. The customer is expected to give an appropriate wholesale price. Sometimes they do make the bone-headed move and say things like “The expert says it is worth $10,000 so I want $10,000.” That just makes them look dumb and like an inexperienced negotiator which Rick and Co. will happily take advantage of after a couple of negotiating moves of their own. The person selling the item is perfectly free to walk away and find a buyer on their own and sometimes they do but few of them actually know how to do that. Occasionally, they do get someone who is a good negotiator and knows exactly what the item is worth at WHOLESALE and demands that. Rick actually respects the few that make a good case on how a particular sale will benefit both of them. Items often get appraised for much more than the seller originally thought it was worth even at the final wholesale price and they will pay it if they want it. In at least one case, Rick insisted on paying several times what the customer asked for because a woman had a very valuable handmade broach that appraised for over $20,000 I think and she originally wanted only a fraction of that but Rick insisted on a more fair price for such an item that he knew he could still make good money on. ---
**Author:** ![Fiddle\_Peghead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddle_peghead/32/3506_2.png) [@Fiddle\_Peghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiddle_Peghead)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/37 "2012-07-18T21:11:44Z")
Yes, it’s only worth what someone will pay for it. We can agree on that by definition. I mean, for instance, that I wouldn’t walk into some pawn shop that I’ve never been in and know nothing about, to pawn my 1978 all-original, tobacco-sunburst Les Paul Custom without having a prior appraisal (apprx $3,000, thank you very much :)) from someone whom I trust. Btw, in my first post, what I meant by “top-dollar” was the upper range of their expert, if that wasn’t clear. As for looking like an inexperienced negotiator, I agree that’s what I would, or the people on the show do, look like when they ask for the max. You mention “negotiating moves” of Rick and Co. Even as someone whose never really dickered like this at all, I honestly don’t think there’s anything tricky that they could pull to make me walk out of there after being taken advantage of. I hope I would go in with a set minimum, and not deviate from it. But in the end, for me the question is moot. Unless I were desperate, I wouldn’t take my LP into a pawn shop in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/38 "2012-07-18T21:35:52Z")
> [@antonio107](#): > > I was at the store Monday morning on my Vegas vacation. None of the guys from the show were there, and there’s an enormous rack of souvenirs that everyone was picking up stuff from. Assuming it was full like that all day (it was 9:30 AM) they’re making money hand over fist just from that. > > There was also a LOT of stuff there with signs that read “not for sale.” Antique guns, sports memorabilia (including a few grey cup rings I was surprised to see!), movie posters…the really cool stuff, IMHO. Why would you fill your store with neat stuff you have ZERO intention of selling? Serious question. I don’t know about the specific episode OP is referring to, but the whole place felt more like 90% tourist trap, 10% pawn shop, with the 10% being the enourmous display case of second hand wedding rings. I wouldn’t surprise me if there were a few people who brought junk out just to be on the TV, with no intention of selling! No doubt the store has changed a lot since the first season. Then they could film all day and no one knew. Since then they became stars and curious tourists show up. The tourist don’t want to buy just window shop. And hundreds of people come in dragging their junk. Of course things have changed. So they have to be clever and make it seem like its still a regular pawn shop. I have heard they do most of their big resales online now. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/39 "2012-07-18T21:36:23Z")
I’ve never watched Pawn Stars but I’ve watched Hardcore Pawn (set in a large pawn shop in Detroit) many times. Part of the appeal is the outrageous behavior of the people looking to sell or pawn their merchandise. And I think I know why people act so outrageously. My guess is that the television producers promise people a small or no fee for just appearing on the program, but a larger amount if they are featured therein. So some people act out just to make sure that they get more money. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643/40 "2012-07-18T22:52:21Z")
You don’t have to offer money to people to get them to appear on TV. People will act outrageous to get on TV, not because they want money, but because they want to be on TV. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pawn-stars-they-totally-blew-this-deal/628643.md?page=1)