# Paying Taxes vs. the Right to Vote **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 2, 2004, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paying-taxes-vs-the-right-to-vote/222395 "2004-01-02T23:31:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![burundi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3ec8ea/32.png) [@burundi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burundi)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2004, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paying-taxes-vs-the-right-to-vote/222395/21 "2004-01-03T23:11:46Z")
**amarone** , I can understand your attitude somewhat if we’re talking about national elections. But local elections are a whole 'nother ballgame. That’s where your vote really is important. Voter turn out is often low (25-30%) for local elections, so if you do drag your ass out to vote, it can make a difference. Local officials also often make many of the decisions that affect you most directly. As an exmaple, in our county, we elect the sheriff. The current sheriff has a reputation (pretty well based in fact) for being corrupt and selectively pursuing cases. He’s especially soft on domestic violence cases. (A few of his relatives, including his son, have been implicated in such cases.) You better believe I’m going to do my best to throw his sorry ass out of office. And when voter turn-out consists of 8,000 people in a county of 80,000, I do have a chance of getting the bastard out. ---
**Author:** ![amarone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e0b2c6/32.png) [@amarone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarone)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2004, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paying-taxes-vs-the-right-to-vote/222395/22 "2004-01-03T23:30:18Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by netscape 6 \* > \*\ ***amarone** What if most people felt that way? \*\* That actually changes the argument. The more people feel it is not worth voting, the more valuable your vote becomes as your vote is a more significant portion of the whole - it is more likely you can affect the result. This also addresses **Burundi** ’s comment. \*\* > [@](#): > > That’s where your vote really is important. Voter turn out is often low (25-30%) for local elections, so if you do drag your ass out to vote, it can make a difference. \*\* I agree that a vote is more likely to be of use in local elections where the size of the electorate is much smaller. There again, the stakes are also lower. I may be one of only a few hundred voting for members of the county school board, but the result will not have consequences such as whether an undesirable foreign country gets invaded. But overall, if I had a vote, I would be much more likely to use it in local elections where it might make a difference. This is, of course, counter to the norm where most people are more likely to vote in state or national elections. ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_H](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a5b964/32.png) [@Bill\_H](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_H)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2004, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paying-taxes-vs-the-right-to-vote/222395/23 "2004-01-04T03:21:02Z")
Well, the two things are very unrelated; it’s really a “would you give up your left hand to have true love” kind of question. The question could be rephrased “how much would the government have to pay you to give up your vote?” Sadly, I’d give up my vote for a lot less than I pay in taxes. Not that I don’t value voting. I consider my vote very important; I’ve never missed one. But in the scope of things, I’d rather have the cash. So the next question is, if you give up your vote, do you have to give up your influence on other votes? I like to think that I vote at least 5 or ten times by influencing others, so one vote is pretty small. And that leads to the most important aspect: could I still make political contributions? I have no idea what the typical dollar per vote is in political contributions, but I’m sure I must influence hundreds of votes minimum currently, again making my individual vote miniscule in the scope of things. ---
**Author:** ![Tygr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/df788c/32.png) [@Tygr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tygr)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2004, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paying-taxes-vs-the-right-to-vote/222395/24 "2004-01-04T05:11:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Q.E.D. \* > \*\*Psssst! It _is_ a hypothetical Q. Obviously such a thing couldn’t work in real life. \*\* Yeah, but the only way to figure out the answer is to determine the potential benefits and consequences. I mean, hypothetically, in keeping with the OP, nearly everybody decides to keep their taxes, and almost nobody votes. Power gets concentrated in the hands of a few special interests. _ **BUT…** _ …they have no means (i.e., money in the form of tax revenue) to excercise their power. I mean, does the OP mean _NO_ taxes whatsoever? Not just income? No sales tax, and a refund on all built-in taxes, like the gas tax? Does it apply to corporations? See, there’s too many variables to consider in determining if giving up your right to vote would be worth it. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by netscape 6 \* > **but, but what if someone joined the hypocrats and did excatly what they said they would?** Geez, another hypothetical question that could never happen in real life… If they did what they said they would, they wouldn’t politicians. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![netscape\_6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/8c91f0/32.png) [@netscape\_6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/netscape_6)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2004, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paying-taxes-vs-the-right-to-vote/222395/25 "2004-01-04T14:56:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Tygr \* > \*\*If they did what they said they would, they wouldn’t politicians. 😉 \*\* I like that resolution of that paradox. It’s based on real world facts. ---
**Author:** ![robertliguori](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/46a35a/32.png) [@robertliguori](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robertliguori)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2004, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paying-taxes-vs-the-right-to-vote/222395/26 "2004-01-04T15:06:10Z")
> [@](#): > > but, but what if someone joined the hypocrats and excatly what they said they would? Then they’d be saying one thing and doing another, and fit right in. Three cheers for the liar paradox. ---
**Author:** ![burundi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3ec8ea/32.png) [@burundi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burundi)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2004, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paying-taxes-vs-the-right-to-vote/222395/27 "2004-01-04T15:09:43Z")
> [@](#): > > _originally posted by amarone_ > **I may be one of only a few hundred voting for members of the county school board, but the result will not have consequences such as whether an undesirable foreign country gets invaded.** Local elections are kind of weird. In terms of big picture issues, they aren’t as important as national elections. But in terms of what affects you day to day, they’re more important. I have a strongly held opinion on the Iraq war, and the war has huge international consequences, but, honestly, the U.S. going to war against Iraq hasn’t changed my daily life. With the important exception of military/reserve families, I doubt it’s changed most Americans’ daily lives. When the county commissioners vote to limit the hours the public libraries are open, that does change my daily rountine. When they vote against funding community non-profits, that makes a _big_ difference to me, considering I work for one. I realize the above paragraph sounds petty. Big issues _do_ matter. That’s why I vote in national and state elections. But the smaller picture matters, too, and that’s where local elections come into play. ---
**Author:** ![chestnutmare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d6d6ee/32.png) [@chestnutmare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chestnutmare)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2004, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paying-taxes-vs-the-right-to-vote/222395/28 "2004-01-04T16:07:19Z")
Alas you seem to be forgetting that there are several jurisdictions that are taxed without representation, including The Nation’s capitol as well as Puerto Rico, USVI and Guam. We must all pay our fair share to the IRS, but have no representation in the legislative process. However, in DC we do get to vote in the presidential election ( I have no idea if PR, USVI or Guam can) but since the House and Senate are more direct forms of representation it really is an insignificant privilege. _Not that POTUS is an insignificant position, but that in terms of having a say in the laws of the nation, Congressional representation would be more valuable_ ---
**Author:** ![Kristen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c4cdca/32.png) [@Kristen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kristen)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2004, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paying-taxes-vs-the-right-to-vote/222395/29 "2004-01-04T16:22:54Z")
I don’t pay taxes now, I get that poor worker’s credit refund. And I don’t vote. Does that answer the question? ---
**Author:** ![LifeOnWry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/96bed5/32.png) [@LifeOnWry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LifeOnWry)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2004, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paying-taxes-vs-the-right-to-vote/222395/30 "2004-01-04T16:54:37Z")
Forgive me for being all “high horse” here, but I think voting is a responsibility, more than a right. And I wouldn’t give it up. I kind of agree with **Magiver** , too: “I’ve actually thought that there should be some form of social contribution involved as a qualifier to vote but I’ve never concieved of a way of doing it. Hurts my brain.” It does hurt the brain, and every time I think of this I can come up with six dozen reasons it won’t work - but I still wish it were possible. 'Course, I also think potential parents should have to pass an aptitude test, so that ought to give you some insight into the way my brain works anyway. And **Tygr** - I don’t believe our taxes will EVER go DOWN. Not to disparage you at all, but I truly guffaw at the idea. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/paying-taxes-vs-the-right-to-vote/222395.md?page=1)