# PDB from AUG 6 is out..full text in OP **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 10, 2004, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386 "2004-04-10T23:01:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![braintree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e7dd6/32.png) [@braintree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/braintree)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2004, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386/101 "2004-04-12T18:41:28Z")
Just for nostalgia’s sake, I’d like to remind everyone what Clinton did when faced with information indicating a possible terrorist attack. This is an excerpt from “The Age of Sacred Terror” by former NCS director and senior director for counter terrorism, Daniel Benjamin and Steven Simon: "When Customs agent Diana Dean stopped Ahmad Ressam coming off the Port Angeles ferry…the shock was tinged with gratitude that the alert system had worked… “The revelations put the administration on a war footing. Almost every day for three weeks, Sandy Berger met with Tenet, Dale Watson of the FBI, Janet Remon and top Pentagon and State Department officials in the Situation Room to force everyone to share information and coordinate action…While most of the world was worried about Y2K computer failures, Berger, Clarke, and the rest of the Principals feared a bombing or worse throughout the millennium perioed. Clark spent the night in a special command center near the White House. Berger…called Clarke compulsively, the last time at three A.M.” So Clinton got unspecified warning that something was up and then did something to prevent the attacks. He didn’t go on vacation and then attack an irrelevant country, unlike brainless leader. Compare and contrast. Extra bonus link: How GWB reacted upon learning that the second tower had been hit and that we were definitely under attack. It’s pretty incredible. He just sits on his ass and then schmoozes. Talk about flying into action. [http://www.thememoryhole.org/911/bush-911.htm](http://www.thememoryhole.org/911/bush-911.htm) Meanwhile Reuters reports that intelligence people are quitting the White House at stunningly high numbers because they think he and Condi are numbskulls. [http://www.reuters.com/printerFriendlyPopup.jhtml?type=politicsNews&storyID=4780065](http://www.reuters.com/printerFriendlyPopup.jhtml?type=politicsNews&storyID=4780065) Of course they’re all just a bunch of Democratic partisans. Shorter Condi Rice: Because no one told me what to do, I was not able to exercise leadership. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2004, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386/102 "2004-04-12T18:52:55Z")
> [@New Iskander](#): > > They continued basically in the mode they inherited from Clinton adm. That needs a cite. Show me where Condi was involved in shaking the trees at times of high threat. Show me how she kept the bureaucracies focused on external threats as she drafted her “comprehensive” al Qaeda policy. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2004, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386/103 "2004-04-12T19:08:16Z")
> [@New Iskander](#): > > They were not doing “nothing”. Gov. never does “nothing”, it is a machine that is constantly running. They continued basically in the mode they inherited from Clinton adm. Perhaps they assumed that measures implemented by Clinton will work a while longer? > > Why didn’t Clinton grab Osama when he had a chance? I seem to remember him firing some cruise missiles at Osama’s facilities. Of course, that was obviously wagging the dog, because Pubbies coast to coast were screeching that’s what it was. See, the country was busy spending $40 million on a semen-stained dress. Because of that, Clinton couldn’t do a god damned thing without all sorts of Pubbies screaming that it was all nothing but a distraction from **a fucking blowjob investigation**. Beyond that, when are you people going to come up with some fucking excuse besdies “But Clinton…”. I mean, what the fuck? -Joe ---
**Author:** ![braintree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e7dd6/32.png) [@braintree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/braintree)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2004, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386/104 "2004-04-12T20:12:59Z")
By the way, did anyone see “This Week”? Richard Pearle tried to rationalize away the President’s incompetence and was shot down by — drumroll please — George Will. David Broder complained on “Meet the Press” about GWB disappearing while things were going to hell in Iraq. So they’re losing him too. So, I think it’s high time certain parties around here dropped the pretense that it’s partisan Democrats who are finding fault with GWB’s startling unresponsiveness. See, when we are attacked or are threatened by attack the president is supposed to do something. It doesn’t matter if he’s a Democrat or a Republican. He’s the president and he’s supposed to do something. And by doing something I don’t mean making up a lot of unsubstantiated crap about Saddam Hussein being responsible for the attacks when he wasn’t or having connections with al Qaeda that were pure fiction or passing along a lot of scary-sounding stories about nuclear bombs that you have every reason to know are complete horseshit. He’s supposed to get good information and act on it. And if other parts of the government are insufficiently reactive it’s his job to bitch slap some sense into them. If Clinton did what Bush did, I’d be the first one screaming for his head because, unlike some people I can think of, I’m serious about protecting Americans. ---
**Author:** ![Reeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2004, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386/105 "2004-04-12T20:23:27Z")
I can’t take credit for this I heard it on NPR today. Why would it take almost exact knowlegde of an AQ attack for Bushco to respond in anyway to it. Yet they took us to war over very flimsy intelligence on Iraq. Why the difference? ---
**Author:** ![New\_Iskander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/db5fbb/32.png) [@New\_Iskander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Iskander)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2004, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386/106 "2004-04-12T20:38:59Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > That needs a cite. Show me where Condi was involved in shaking the trees at times of high threat. Show me how she kept the bureaucracies focused on external threats as she drafted her “comprehensive” al Qaeda policy. No, they didn’t “shake trees”. The best I could find out “tree shake” episode was a special case that occured in December 99, before the Millenium. After that it was back to business as usual. Bush simply continued in the same mode. Let’s go the source: > [@](#): > > CLARKE: Well, we’ll never know. But let me compare 9/11 and the period immediately before it to the millennium rollover and the period immediately before that. In December, 1999, we received intelligence reports that there were going to be major al Qaeda attacks. President Clinton asked his national security adviser Sandy Berger to hold daily meetings with the attorney general, the FBI director, the CIA director and stop the attacks. And every day they went back from the White House to the FBI, to the Justice Department, to the CIA and they shook the trees to find out if there was any information. You know, when you know the United States is going to be attacked, the top people in the United States government ought to be working hands-on to prevent it and working together. > > Now, contrast that with what happened in the summer of 2001, when we even had more clear indications that there was going to be an attack. Did the president ask for daily meetings of his team to try to stop the attack? Did Condi Rice hold meetings of her counterparts to try to stop the attack? No. Is not that nifty? We are asked to compare 12-31-1999 with 9-11-2001. Makes perfect sense in retrospect: both are very important dates. However, back then 9/11 had no meaning. If we had any information that something was going to happen in September 2001 beforehand, the country would be put on high alert and all the trees would be shaken, just as before. ---
**Author:** ![braintree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e7dd6/32.png) [@braintree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/braintree)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2004, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386/107 "2004-04-12T21:02:50Z")
Uh, Iskander, what Clarke is stating is that the indications of an impending attack were stronger BEFORE 9/11 than they were before the Millennium plot. I swear I’m not being sarcastic when I ask you: do you understand your own cite? Clarke was a holdover from the Clinton administration where he was a holdover of the first Bush administration where he was a holdover of the Reagan administration. We’re not talking about a partisan Democrat but a professional with a long history of working congenially with Republicans. What don’t you get here? I swear. The Republicans aren’t just a politcal party anymore. They’re an insane cult with no regard for the truth and they’re running the goddam country. Holy fucking shit. ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2004, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386/108 "2004-04-13T02:02:48Z")
> [@braintree](#): > > Uh, Iskander, what Clarke is stating is that the indications of an impending attack were stronger BEFORE 9/11 than they were before the Millennium plot. I swear I’m not being sarcastic when I ask you: do you understand your own cite? > > Clarke was a holdover from the Clinton administration where he was a holdover of the first Bush administration where he was a holdover of the Reagan administration. We’re not talking about a partisan Democrat but a professional with a long history of working congenially with Republicans. What don’t you get here? > > I swear. The Republicans aren’t just a politcal party anymore. They’re an insane cult with no regard for the truth and they’re running the goddam country. Holy fucking shit. see, it’s stuff this that gets me riled up, and I go for the foil and start thinking about cancelled elections… what I mean is, what if they reallyare NUTS!!!I mean clinically unhinged… wouldn’t that mean that anything was possible? ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2004, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386/109 "2004-04-13T02:41:18Z")
Here’s a couple articles that a little further into what tack the president set after getting the aug 6 PDB: [Bush Withheld al Qaeda Warning From Ashcroft, FBI](http://www.capitolhillblue.com/artman/publish/article_4383.shtml) > [@](#): > > Attorney General John Ashcroft never saw the August 6, 2001 Presidential Daily Briefing (PDB) warning of an Al Qaeda attack inside the United States because President George W. Bush, with his penchant for secrecy, restricted the distribution of the PDB to just seven national security officials. > Ashcroft didn’t make the cut. [Officials: Pre-9/11 Memo Excluded Data](http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=536&e=1&u=/ap/20040413/ap_on_go_pr_wh/sept__11_al_qaida_memo) > [@](#): > > Just one day after President Bush received a pre-Sept. 11 briefing on al-Qaida’s effort to strike on U.S. soil, senior government executives received a similarly titled memo that excluded information about current threats and investigations, say federal officials who have read both documents. > The Aug. 7, 2001 memo, known as the senior executive intelligence brief or SEIB, didn’t mention the 70 FBI investigations into possible al-Qaida activity that Bush had been told of a day earlier Could someone please explain to me what the point is of collecting intelligence for our top guys when they just look at the stuff, perhaps nod sagely, and then lock it away where no one else can ever see it? ---
**Author:** ![pantom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/34f0e0/32.png) [@pantom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pantom)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2004, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386/110 "2004-04-13T03:09:55Z")
Keith Olbermann on MSNBC had the best crack about this absurd line that the Bush Admin is peddling about the intelligence not being ‘specific’ enough or something: “Unlike the intelligence on Iraq?” he asked rhetorically. Cracked me up. These guys are getting so bad, so unbelievably, awfully, stupidly bad that I’m beginning to think they might actually lose in November. Who can take these idjits seriously anymore? ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2004, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386/111 "2004-04-14T02:33:54Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > Here’s a couple articles that a little further into what tack the president set after getting the aug 6 PDB: > [Bush Withheld al Qaeda Warning From Ashcroft, FBI](http://www.capitolhillblue.com/artman/publish/article_4383.shtml)[Officials: Pre-9/11 Memo Excluded Data](http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=536&e=1&u=/ap/20040413/ap_on_go_pr_wh/sept__11_al_qaida_memo) Could someone please explain to me what the point is of collecting intelligence for our top guys when they just look at the stuff, perhaps nod sagely, and then lock it away where no one else can ever see it? Isn’t there a strange smell surrounding two different versions of basically the same document, a day apart? Ever try to get a secretary to retype a finished document and change it, rather than simply xerox what you have and pass it on? Ya feelin’ me? ---
**Author:** ![braintree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e7dd6/32.png) [@braintree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/braintree)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2004, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386/112 "2004-04-14T17:26:11Z")
Now it turns out that the August 6th PDB was just one in a SERIES of memos warning of oncoming terrorist attacks. [http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A9642-2004Apr13.html](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A9642-2004Apr13.html) Behold as the intricate, yet flimsy latticework of right-wing fantasy continues to break apart in the harsh environment of actual reality. All the Fox networks in the world cannot stop it. Your asses are supremely cooked. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2004, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386/113 "2004-04-14T17:41:10Z")
Aw, geez – between this and the embarassing press conference last night (which I’m now seriously regretting missing), I wonder if the Bush Presidency will flame out before the elections… Not that that would be a _bad_ thing IMO, of course, but the ship is listing even faster than I’d expect. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2004, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386/114 "2004-04-14T22:51:21Z")
> [@braintree](#): > > Now it turns out that the August 6th PDB was just one in a SERIES of memos warning of oncoming terrorist attacks. > > [http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A9642-2004Apr13.html](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A9642-2004Apr13.html) I remember being surprised with how quickly the suspicion settled on the Taliban and bin Laden. It seemed like less than a day and everyone knew it was him (memory’s tricky sometimes, of course, and maybe it took a day or two longer.) Anyway, I’ve always wondered how and why they were able to know so fast who the culprit was - apparently they’d been expecting it. Or ought to have been. I assumed that there were CIA & FBI files on al Qaeda, like any other known terrorist group. I didn’t know that they’d been talking for months about a coming attack. I didn’t know that they warned our President repeatedly at the start of his enormous vacation. Words fail me. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pdb-from-aug-6-is-out-full-text-in-op/239386.md?page=5)