# Penile circumcision-- are today’s young parents opting out of this for their babies? (Read note in OP.) **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 14, 2024, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773 "2024-10-14T17:21:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/61 "2024-10-15T02:52:12Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > This will lead to more gentiles discovering that Jews are better lovers and becoming addicted to the incomperable pleasure of a Jewish penis. We will then move ever closer to our conquest of the world- all without having to fire a single space laser. Dammit! Despite being born a Jew, first I got left out of the giant piles of money which are my apparent birthright. Second, I never get help bumping off my enemies or muscling to the top from the Jewish Mafia, and third, I’ve never once been invited to the secret cabal meetings where I get to plot to rule the world! Hell, I’ve never even been invited to visit, much less fire the vaunted space lasers! And now you tell me I missed out on the preternatural sexual superiority?!?!?!?!? What a rip off! I get all of the bad, and none of the good! Razzafrazzin’ ~!@#$%^&\*()-= Whew. Got that out of my system. 😉 Anecdote is all I have, I’m a 50 year old secular Jewish male, with no kids, and have no plans to have any. My younger brother, 48, has one boy, one girl. According to what I heard when the boy was born, he and his wife both talked about it at length (both are doctors) and finally decided to do so with some reluctance. While mostly secular, as am I, they felt it was a connection to the past, and intended (and did) raise the kids aware of the faith, albeit with all the warts and flaws as they got old enough to understand. They felt it was _slightly_ better to ease his way with the faith if he chose to be more in tune with faith than us, and that the admitted trauma as an infant was, like most things, long lost while if done as an adult would be an extreme exercise and possible one with more complications. But it was a narrow margin for their choice, certainly 60/40 or even closer. ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/62 "2024-10-15T04:15:47Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > However, I agree with you that in many if not most cases a decision not to circumcise a Jewish boy is very likely to put some strain on the “acceptance by other Jews” response. How would anyone know, unless said Jewish boy spoke about it, which is unlikely? Are they checking at the temple door or something? ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/63 "2024-10-15T04:34:04Z")
School showers/locker room comes to mind. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/64 "2024-10-15T04:47:47Z")
I somehow made it through 13 years of public education without seeing any of my classmates’ dicks or vice versa. I dunno what schools y’all went to. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/65 "2024-10-15T04:50:33Z")
Cheapass country public schools with group showers where everyone could see everything. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/66 "2024-10-15T04:51:49Z")
The schools where I lived (Chicagoland area) had the students shower after their PE (physical education) classes. As is normal, we all showered nude. Not to mention many other locker rooms I have been in. Add in steam rooms. I am kinda wondering how you managed to avoid all that? ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/67 "2024-10-15T04:53:26Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Cheapass country public schools with group showers where everyone could see everything. Dunno what “cheapass” has to do with it. This was the norm in well funded schools I went to. It wasn’t cheap. It wasn’t weird. No one fussed about it. ---
**Author:** ![BippityBoppityBoo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bippityboppityboo/32/5745_2.png) [@BippityBoppityBoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BippityBoppityBoo)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/68 "2024-10-15T05:14:18Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > The umbilical cord required more special care than the newly circumcised penis. As a Neonatal Intensive Care nurse early in my career I was the nurse at hundreds if not thousands of circumcisions and then cared for those infants for days afterwards. I can firmly state as a professional nurse that is not the case that that umbilical cords require more care than newly circumcised penises. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 5:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/69 "2024-10-15T05:29:28Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > I am kinda wondering how you managed to avoid all that? Junior high PE had showers in the locker rooms. I never once saw anyone use them. High school I did JROTC instead of PE but I don’t get the impression that those showers got any use either. This was San Diego in the late '90s, for the record. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/70 "2024-10-15T05:41:18Z")
When I was in school (early/mid-80s) showering was mandatory after PE. Most teen boys would have skipped it so the school insisted on it. Girls had to as well (of course they had their own showers). Team sports too. Football, baseball, swimming, track…you showered after. All schools had showers too (so it was not just this or that school…they all did it). To the original point, it was easy to see other naked guys and whether or not they were circumcised. Most in my classes were circumcised but some few were not (and that was the first time I realized there was a difference). No one cared though. No student was bullied for being one way or another as regarded their penis. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/71 "2024-10-15T05:44:34Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > When I was in school (early/mid-80s) showering was mandatory after PE. They would’ve had to give us at least another 10 minutes between classes if they expected that of us. As it was we got exactly 7 minutes from when the bell rang to get to the locker room, change, and get to our next class if we didn’t want to get a tardy. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/72 "2024-10-15T05:46:14Z")
The time to shower was built in the schedule for us. Not a long shower (a few minutes). Also not a problem. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/73 "2024-10-15T05:51:01Z")
I was in middle school in the mid-80s and also had mandatory showers. Maybe you’d learn how to avoid it but, for the most part, we’d strip down and take a quick walk though the shower room with a central sprinkler system. You also had your YMCA or swim classes or other locker room sports-adjacent activities. Oddly, given the middle school setup, in high school there wasn’t a single group shower but rather just a couple of stalls and (unsurprisingly) people rarely used them. ---
**Author:** ![Sylvanz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/fbc32d/32.png) [@Sylvanz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sylvanz)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 6:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/74 "2024-10-15T06:43:53Z")
My sons were born in 1986, and 1988, respectively. We had neither of them circumcised. I could not stand the thought of someone cutting a normal piece of their perfectly formed bodies off. With no pain management. They strapped them, at the time, to a baby shaped, “circucision positioner.” If it doesn’t hurt they sure do scream. I don’t think my daughter did it to my grandson, but I don’t remember. Neither my dad nor my father in law were circumcised. They had no issues. My sons are both healthy. My youngest just became the father of a beautiful baby girl. He told me they would not have circumcised the baby if she had been a boy. I was an outlier in my generation. Most people I knew did it, but I just couldn’t. Lucky me Hubster agreed though he wasn’t as disturbed by the very idea. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 7:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/75 "2024-10-15T07:19:37Z")
> [@Sylvanz](#): > > I could not stand the thought of someone cutting a normal piece of their perfectly formed bodies off. This implies that those who are circumcised are less perfect. Mutilated. I reject that notion. I was circumcised and I like my penis. Women I have been intimate with seem to like it too. I have no sense that I was disabled or mutilated as a child because I was circumcised. I have no problem enjoying sex. Most men in the US are circumcised. Most women in the US [prefer a circumcised male](https://academic.oup.com/smoa/article/7/2/145/6956488) (assuming heterosexual people for this). But, honestly, if the relationship has progressed to getting naked together I think anything will be fine. In the 70s and 80s no men I knew complained about being circumcised. Now it seems a cause celebre to have something for men to complain about. From the study cite above: > The present systematic review has identified a wide range of opinions regarding women’s preference for circumcised penises in an extensive range of geographical and cultural settings. Overall, most women expressed a preference for the circumcised penis. Such a preference was seen in most populations regardless of MC prevalence in that population. Reasons expressed for this preference included better appearance, improved hygiene, reduced risk of infection, and more pleasurable sexual activity. ---
**Author:** ![Sylvanz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/fbc32d/32.png) [@Sylvanz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sylvanz)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/76 "2024-10-15T07:35:28Z")
Hmm, my appologies, I didn’t intend to imply circed men were mutilated. I think it’s unnecessary. My intent was to say that I thought they were beautiful the way they were born. I’ve seen and experienced both circed and uncirced. It made no difference to me; both function up to specs 😉. However, I think _routine_ circumcision is unnecessary. I wouldn’t support making it illegal, but I hope it runs its course and goes out of style. I used to feel it was a bit like (look out imperfect analogy) cutting the breast tissue away from a newborn girl routinely, to prevent breast cancer. ---
**Author:** ![Sylvanz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/fbc32d/32.png) [@Sylvanz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sylvanz)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/77 "2024-10-15T07:39:53Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Reasons expressed for this preference included better appearance, improved hygiene, I strongly disagree with this. Not that the opinions weren’t expressed, but my experience differed greatly. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 7:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/78 "2024-10-15T07:49:31Z")
> [@Sylvanz](#): > > I strongly disagree with this. Not that the opinions weren’t expressed, but my experience differed greatly. Fair enough. This part should also be noted (it was from the study): > [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > The present systematic review has identified a wide range of opinions regarding women’s preference for circumcised penises in an extensive range of geographical and cultural settings. Overall, most women expressed a preference for the circumcised penis. ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 8:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/79 "2024-10-15T08:10:43Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > I’m sorry, you mistook this for Factual Questions or Great Debates. > > I have zero interest in playing No True Scotsman data gathering with you where you get to arbitrate what counts as “clear evidence” or what “cuts it”. You have the same access to Google that I do. WTF? True Scotsman? [ quote=“Jophiel, post:42, topic:1008773”] I have participated in a few threads with all the cites, studies and factual stuff and have yet to see one that doesn’t become a dumpster fire. No offense to the OP, of course, but that’s a major motivator in my low effort approach these days. I’m not all THAT interested in trying to change anyone’s mind and it all devolves into emotionally-driven twaddle anyway. [/quote] > [@Jophiel](#): > > (FWIW, the rate of penile cancer in North America is around 0.56 per 100,000 and 0.92 in Europe, though there’s variance between regions (1.2 in the UK, 1.3 in Poland)) So… I asked out of general curiosity. I wanted to know if there is a study comparing European men and American man. I asked so specifically because of socio-economic reasons, i.e. comparing health/HIV statistics between un-circumcised men in Sub-Sharan Africa with men in The U.S. doesn’t seem to be a way to yield good results… Y ou claimed there was health benefits and I was curious. But you went into (extremely mild) attack mode and blew me off. And later you could indeed find statistics and told us you don’t want to put any effort into this. So thanks for blowing off an honest question by making assumptions about me, I guess. ---
**Author:** ![scudsucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scudsucker/32/14101_2.png) [@scudsucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scudsucker)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2024, 8:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773/80 "2024-10-15T08:50:25Z")
> [@Charlie\_Tan](#): > > and blew me off. A slightly unfortunate phrase given the penile nature of the thread! FWIW, I and my brother, and my father are all circumcised. I thought it was because of our (nominal) Catholicism, but apparently it is not (ahem) catholic. My dad is no longer alive to ask. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penile-circumcision-are-today-s-young-parents-opting-out-of-this-for-their-babies-read-note-in-op/1008773.md?page=5)