# Penn St. hit hard **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [July 23, 2012, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138 "2012-07-23T15:17:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Enginerd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bcef8e/32.png) [@Enginerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enginerd)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/81 "2012-07-23T20:17:31Z")
> [@garygnu](#): > > The community’s veneration of Paterno certainly aided his ability to dictate the scandal being swept under the rug. > [@oreally](#): > > **Course that’s not what he did** , but let’s not let facts get in the way of a highly emotional witch hunt. Burn baby burn! (Bolding mine) How do you figure? It looks to me like that’s exactly what he did. ---
**Author:** ![oreally](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ab992/32.png) [@oreally](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oreally)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/82 "2012-07-23T20:17:43Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > It’s only a witch _hunt_ when there aren’t real witches around. PSU is a target-rich environment. It’s a witch hunt when people are “burned” who didn’t commit a crime. A crime was committed by exactly 3 people: Sandusky and the 2 execs who Paterno reported the crime to who were supposed to do something about it. But enjoy your delusions about how the whole school is responsible. Why not, the NCAA retards are. ---
**Author:** ![RaftPeople](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@RaftPeople](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RaftPeople)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/83 "2012-07-23T20:19:46Z")
> [@oreally](#): > > I’ve been basically neutral about Penn St over the years but always admired how they won without tolerating crap from players,… Yep, Paterno did not tolerate crap from players. For example, when a group of his players were charged with assaulting some students in an apartment - he defied the University’s person in charge of student affairs, instructed his players not to cooperate, and used his power to punish them on his terms - they had to clean up the stadium instead of face the normal repercussions that non-football players faced, like expulsion, etc. I mean, cleaning up the stadium is way worse than anything the University would have normally handed down. Way to go Paterno. ---
**Author:** ![oreally](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ab992/32.png) [@oreally](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oreally)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/84 "2012-07-23T20:21:00Z")
> [@Enginerd](#): > > (Bolding mine) > > How do you figure? It looks to me like that’s exactly what he did. Because… He reported what another coach told him to his bosses, which is what he’s supposed to do. How is that “sweeping it under the rug?” PS I agree he could have/should have done more, and even he admitted that. Not saying he shares no blame. But hindsight is 20/20 and first firing the guy who has done so much for that school was bad enough. Now trying to strip him of 14 years of victories? It’s another knee-jerk reaction the NCCA is making ONLY to cover their own asses so people won’t start lining them up to burn at the stake. This whole thing is a farce. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/85 "2012-07-23T20:22:43Z")
> [@oreally](#): > > I’ve been basically neutral about Penn St over the years but always admired how they won without tolerating crap from players, which is more than schools like Miami, Fla St, Ohio St, Nebraska (and on and it goes) can say. No it isn’t. Penn State can’t say jack shit in that regard. There’s plenty of evidence that Joe Pa covered up plenty of his players’ transgressions. Oh, and Mince? Nobody is holding you, or anyone else, criminally liable for anything. ---
**Author:** ![RaftPeople](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@RaftPeople](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RaftPeople)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/86 "2012-07-23T20:23:27Z")
> [@oreally](#): > > It’s a witch hunt when people are “burned” who didn’t commit a crime. A crime was committed by exactly 3 people: Sandusky and the 2 execs who Paterno reported the crime to who were supposed to do something about it. > > But enjoy your delusions about how the whole school is responsible. Why not, the NCAA retards are. So USC shouldn’t have received sanctions due to Reggie Bush, right? ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/87 "2012-07-23T20:24:56Z")
> [@Mince](#): > > Yeah, but those programs are _used_ to not fielding a competitive football team. Tell a millionaire he _has_ to live in a shanty for 4 years, see how he responds, then tell a homeless family they \*get \* to live in a shanty for 4 years and see how they respond. Compare. Yep, and Penn State will get used to it too. ---
**Author:** ![oreally](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ab992/32.png) [@oreally](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oreally)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/88 "2012-07-23T20:26:56Z")
> [@RaftPeople](#): > > Yep, Paterno did not tolerate crap from players. > > For example, when a group of his players were charged with assaulting some students in an apartment - he defied the University’s person in charge of student affairs, instructed his players not to cooperate, and used his power to punish them on his terms - they had to clean up the stadium instead of face the normal repercussions that non-football players faced, like expulsion, etc. > > I mean, cleaning up the stadium is way worse than anything the University would have normally handed down. > > Way to go Paterno. I give up, do you have any actual information proving this? Or is this the same kind of “proof” that was used in Sandusky’s case (testimony and finger-pointing with no hard evidence of any kind)? ---
**Author:** ![RaftPeople](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@RaftPeople](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RaftPeople)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/89 "2012-07-23T20:27:44Z")
> [@oreally](#): > > Because… > > He reported what another coach told him to his bosses, which is what he’s supposed to do. How is that “sweeping it under the rug?” > > PS I agree he could have/should have done more, and even he admitted that. Not saying he shares no blame. But hindsight is 20/20 and first firing the guy who has done so much for that school was bad enough. Now trying to strip him of 14 years of victories? It’s another knee-jerk reaction the NCCA is making ONLY to cover their own asses so people won’t start lining them up to burn at the stake. This whole thing is a farce. The admin’s were going to report the problem but after talking to Paterno they changed their minds. We don’t know exactly what Paterno said, but there is simply nothing positive that you can conclude from that interaction and most logical conclusions imply Paterno at the minimum swayed them not to report and instead take a different approach. ---
**Author:** ![oreally](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ab992/32.png) [@oreally](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oreally)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/90 "2012-07-23T20:27:56Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > No it isn’t. Penn State can’t say jack shit in that regard. There’s plenty of evidence that Joe Pa covered up plenty of his players’ transgressions. I notice you didn’t list any or provide any evidence either. Well don’t let that stop you. HE’S A WITCH BURRRRRRRN HIM ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/91 "2012-07-23T20:28:21Z")
> [@oreally](#): > > Because… > > He reported what another coach told him to his bosses, which is what he’s supposed to do. How is that “sweeping it under the rug?” Have you been following this story at all? There is a great deal of evidence that Paterno was responsible for convincing the other administrators not to report Sandusky in 2001. On top of that, he told a grand jury that he had no knowledge of the 1998 investigation, which was a total lie. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/92 "2012-07-23T20:29:30Z")
> [@oreally](#): > > The SCHOOL didn’t abuse those kids or fail to act swiftly and severely enough. ONE guy did it and a handful either covered it up or failed to do all they could. You know, to hear some people tell it, this case involved a couple of individuals who happened to work at Penn State. The “handful” who covered up child abuse included the president and the vice president of the university, and the most famous and powerful person at the school. These people were the leadership of the school, which means the rot went all the way to the top. And it’s also true that the people who were charged with overseeing things at the school, including the already-mentioned administrators and the board, were falling down on the job. It is vital that that state of affairs changes. > [@](#): > > So based on that, let’s burn the entire school Oh please. The football team has been sanctioned. It’s not like the school is being shut down. > [@](#): > > And at the front of the line is STILL Paterno. Firing him was bad enough; now they want to take away wins? Including wins that occurred before he even knew anything about this? He knew all about it. Despite what he told the public and the grand jury, he knew in 1998 that Sandusky had been accused of child abuse and he did nothing. Then he heard about another allegation in 2001 (with an eyewitness who was on his staff) and still didn’t do anything. > [@](#): > > I’ve been basically neutral about Penn St over the years but always admired how they won without tolerating crap from players, which is more than schools like Miami, Fla St, Ohio St, Nebraska (and on and it goes) can say. They tolerated plenty of crap from their players, actually. It’s true that they’re not as corrupt as Miami apparently is. ---
**Author:** ![RaftPeople](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@RaftPeople](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RaftPeople)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/93 "2012-07-23T20:30:50Z")
> [@oreally](#): > > I give up, do you have any actual information proving this? Or is this the same kind of “proof” that was used in Sandusky’s case (testimony and finger-pointing with no hard evidence of any kind)? [report](http://www.collegian.psu.edu/archive/2012/07/09/chronicle_report_joe_paterno.aspx) It’s pretty easy to find info including emails like the one quoted in this report. ---
**Author:** ![oreally](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ab992/32.png) [@oreally](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oreally)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/94 "2012-07-23T20:31:42Z")
> [@RaftPeople](#): > > The admin’s were going to report the problem but after talking to Paterno they changed their minds. …so the CLAIM goes. > [@](#): > > We don’t know exactly what Paterno said, but there is simply nothing positive that you can conclude from that interaction and most logical conclusions imply Paterno at the minimum swayed them not to report and instead take a different approach. So let’s burn him (and oh btw the entire school) based on assumptions and “conclusions,” not facts. Brilliant. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/95 "2012-07-23T20:32:16Z")
> [@oreally](#): > > I notice you didn’t list any or provide any evidence either. > > Well don’t let that stop you. HE’S A WITCH BURRRRRRRN HIM Is that the sum total of your argument? You appear to not even have a basic knowledge of the scandal, so it’s hardly surprising that you’re now pulling your pants down for our amusement. Vicky Triponey is a former head of student affairs at Penn State who has outlined many of the ways that Paterno would resist her attempts to discipline football players. ---
**Author:** ![Mince](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecd19e/32.png) [@Mince](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mince)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/96 "2012-07-23T20:34:11Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Oh please. The football team has been sanctioned. It’s not like the school is being shut down. Great point! Education still goes on! (pardon my exclamations) ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/97 "2012-07-23T20:34:27Z")
> [@oreally](#): > > He reported what another coach told him to his bosses, which is what he’s supposed to do. How is that “sweeping it under the rug?” You’ve formed a lot of strong opinions about this case, but seems like you did so without reading anything about what happened. What he’s supposed to do is tell the police or child welfare, not confer with his supervisors and decide to handle it himself. The evidence says he told them he didn’t want to get the police involved. > [@](#): > > Now trying to strip him of 14 years of victories? They’re not trying. It’s done. He’s been stripped of 111 wins, including the record-breaking win Sandusky watched firsthand in October 2011. > [@](#): > > It’s another knee-jerk reaction the NCCA is making ONLY to cover their own asses so people won’t start lining them up to burn at the stake. This makes no sense at all because nobody would blame the NCAA for Penn State’s failure to take any interest in the child abuse. > [@oreally](#): > > So let’s burn him (and oh btw the entire school) based on assumptions and “conclusions,” not facts. Brilliant. The conclusions are based on facts: they come from the emails the administrators sent after they became aware of the shower rape in 2001. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/98 "2012-07-23T20:35:21Z")
> [@oreally](#): > > I give up, do you have any actual information proving this? Or is this the same kind of “proof” that was used in Sandusky’s case (testimony and finger-pointing with no hard evidence of any kind)? Hang on a sec, are you saying you think Sandusky was railroaded? Jesus Christ. I think we’re done here. ---
**Author:** ![Mince](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecd19e/32.png) [@Mince](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mince)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/99 "2012-07-23T20:37:30Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > You’ve formed a lot of strong opinions about this case, but seems like you did so without reading anything about what happened. What he’s supposed to do is tell the police or child welfare, not confer with his supervisors and decide to handle it himself. Yep! I hear (even possible) child rape, I’m on the phone to my nearest 911 (not my nearest Joe Paterno, may he rest in discomfort). ---
**Author:** ![Enginerd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bcef8e/32.png) [@Enginerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enginerd)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-st-hit-hard/629138/100 "2012-07-23T20:38:15Z")
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