# Penn & Teller: Fool Us, US run on CW **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 7, 2014, 7:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015 "2014-08-07T07:25:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 37
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/721 "2015-10-07T17:34:01Z")
Ok guys, what would the plants do in this trick? The audience members don’t do anything affecting the outcome except for the one that picks the bags, and we’ve already discussed the ways that he can tell which bag was picked. There’s just no need for a plant. ---
**Author:** ![Dingbang](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ac8455/32.png) [@Dingbang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dingbang)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/722 "2015-10-07T18:17:48Z")
I agree that the thumper or something like that is the simpler explanation. But I still thought their reaction was quite unusual. And if they really do retakes of things that happen right in the middle of a trick being performed, then wow, that throws the whole show into question. Cutting to different camera angles is bad enough, but I get why that’s necessary for TV. Faking a part of the trick (and picking the audience participant most certainly is part of the trick) makes it pointless to watch. Might as well be watching a David Blaine or Criss Angel TV show. ---
**Author:** ![Stephe96](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Stephe96](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stephe96)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/723 "2015-10-07T18:25:19Z")
> [@Dingbang](#): > > I agree that the thumper or something like that is the simpler explanation. But I still thought their reaction was quite unusual. > > And if they really do retakes of things that happen right in the middle of a trick being performed, then wow, that throws the whole show into question. Cutting to different camera angles is bad enough, but I get why that’s necessary for TV. Faking a part of the trick (and picking the audience participant most certainly is part of the trick) makes it pointless to watch. Might as well be watching a David Blaine or Criss Angel TV show. Penn said something to the effect that they’ll sometimes turn the cameras off to put a mic on a volunteer or something similar, but they would never do anything that could affect the outcome of a trick. Another, smoother take of the volunteers getting to the stage wouldn’t strike me as that big of a deal. ---
**Author:** ![Dingbang](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ac8455/32.png) [@Dingbang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dingbang)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/724 "2015-10-07T18:34:10Z")
> [@Stephe96](#): > > Penn said something to the effect that they’ll sometimes turn the cameras off to put a mic on a volunteer or something similar, but they would never do anything that could affect the outcome of a trick. Another, smoother take of the volunteers getting to the stage wouldn’t strike me as that big of a deal. Ah, but it could be. After all, we’re talking about whether their reactions indicated they might be plants. Holding the action for a second while you put mic on someone, then resuming the trick, doesn’t seem like a big deal. But I see a “retake” as completely different. ---
**Author:** ![Stephe96](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Stephe96](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stephe96)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/725 "2015-10-07T18:42:01Z")
> [@Dingbang](#): > > Ah, but it could be. After all, we’re talking about whether their reactions indicated they might be plants. > > Holding the action for a second while you put mic on someone, then resuming the trick, doesn’t seem like a big deal. But I see a “retake” as completely different. Maybe, but I think real plants would’ve done a better job acting spontaneous. These guys looked more like they had been coached by the producers to get on the stage as quickly as possible. But who knows? ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/726 "2015-10-08T00:40:16Z")
I thought that the third guy was a plant and the first two just happened to be in front of him. The third guy seemed a little too well dressed, seemed to get up to go on stage before the other two, and seemed to know what he was doing instead of fumbling around. Also, the magician walked the first two through ‘hold the bag by the handles, in your left hand, straight in front of you’, but didn’t on the third guy - it wouldn’t be weird if he could see that the the third guy was holding the bag up, but he was blindfolded at the time. ---
**Author:** ![JohnGalt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johngalt/32/184_2.png) [@JohnGalt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnGalt)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/727 "2015-10-08T01:32:41Z")
Was the lady the plant? After all, she was the one who picked the color bags “randomly” and perhaps had some kind of noise or words for each bag (I’m not remembering if she said anything). She was in the front row too and seemed to get up a bit quickly too. I didn’t like his personality either. On a different topic (same trick) the first time I went to the Minnesota Renaissance Festival was 1980. There were some great acts (Puke and Snot getting started) but I wish I would have been able to catch Penn & Teller’s first act; of course I wouldn’t know if had even seen them. This [link](http://www.renaissancefest.com/entertainment.html) shows them from that time; it also talks about last week’s rose trick that Teller did. ---
**Author:** ![JKilez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e5b9ba/32.png) [@JKilez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKilez)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/728 "2015-10-08T02:00:17Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > Also, the magician walked the first two through ‘hold the bag by the handles, in your left hand, straight in front of you’, but didn’t on the third guy - it wouldn’t be weird if he could see that the the third guy was holding the bag up, but he was blindfolded at the time. I do think he could hear, though. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/729 "2015-10-08T04:17:54Z")
> [@Stephe96](#): > > Maybe, but I think real plants would’ve done a better job acting spontaneous. These guys looked more like they had been coached by the producers to get on the stage as quickly as possible. > > But who knows? I also noticed oddness in the timing of that. My guess is that they have to get anyone who goes on stage to sign an extra special release, meaning that the audience members know ahead of time that they will be chosen, but are not necessarily plants. As others have pointed out, what good would plants have accomplished in this trick? ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/730 "2015-10-08T13:59:00Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > As others have pointed out, what good would plants have accomplished in this trick? Well, he needs to know what order the bags are being handed out in, so the plant could be signaling him about which bag is being given out. He either needs a plant or some kind of signal device in the bags. He also might use obvious plant(s) to try to misdirect Penn and Teller about how the trick is actually being done. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/731 "2015-10-08T14:24:48Z")
> [@JohnGalt](#): > > Was the lady the plant? After all, she was the one who picked the color bags “randomly” and perhaps had some kind of noise or words for each bag (I’m not remembering if she said anything). She was in the front row too and seemed to get up a bit quickly too. > > I didn’t like his personality either. > > On a different topic (same trick) the first time I went to the Minnesota Renaissance Festival was 1980. There were some great acts (Puke and Snot getting started) but I wish I would have been able to catch Penn & Teller’s first act; of course I wouldn’t know if had even seen them. This [link](http://www.renaissancefest.com/entertainment.html) shows them from that time; it also talks about last week’s rose trick that Teller did. I thought he had an electronic vibrating device(a Thumper?). Someone off stage or in the crowd signals to him in code what bag has been picked up. He then assigns the bags to the certain guys. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/732 "2015-10-08T15:11:41Z")
> [@Spud](#): > > I’m also not convinced there weren’t plants involved. Three guys sitting one behind the other. At least one and maybe two looked like they were there solo. The third one started to get up before the second one was called. No hesitation of the “is he pointing at me?” and then the woman was the one right next to the first guy. A group of “strangers” in a small area of adjoining seats… kind of like if a performer got a block of tickets to use for “friends and family.” > > I have been called up before and there was always the “me?.. yes you… is he still talking to me or is he pointing to someone behind me?” moment involved. IIRC the show does not allow audience plants. But I suspect the producers have cleared audience volunteers ahead of time (and had them sign appearance waivers) so they knew they were going to be “randomly” picked. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/733 "2015-10-08T16:25:58Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > IIRC the show does not allow audience plants. I searched and found other people saying that, but didn’t see anything definite. If there’s a list of rules for the show or an interview where P&T say that I would really like to know for sure, the chance that there is an audience plants makes some of the tricks more ‘meh’ for me. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/734 "2015-10-08T18:26:35Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > I thought he had an electronic vibrating device(a Thumper?). Someone off stage or in the crowd signals to him in code what bag has been picked up. He then assigns the bags to the certain guys. An electronic thumper doesn’t require anyone else. It vibrates in your pocket. It shakes once, you know red, twice you know green, 1 short 2 long it’s blue, etc. Whatever pattern you assign to the tags. That’s why plants seem irrelevant to the trick. It could all be done without them. > [@Pantastic](#): > > I searched and found other people saying that, but didn’t see anything definite. If there’s a list of rules for the show or an interview where P&T say that I would really like to know for sure, the chance that there is an audience plants makes some of the tricks more ‘meh’ for me. I vaguely recall that at some point being said, but couldn’t find it now. Maybe Penn at one of the early season 1 shows? ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/735 "2015-10-08T18:45:36Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > I vaguely recall that at some point being said, but couldn’t find it now. Maybe Penn at one of the early season 1 shows? I think I remember Jonathan saying so during one of the early shows (maybe the first BBC special) but now I’m not sure. I’ll have to see if I can find that episode somewhere to check. The rules may have also changed between the UK and US versions. ---
**Author:** ![numeroussyrup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/edb3f5/32.png) [@numeroussyrup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/numeroussyrup)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/736 "2015-10-08T23:59:18Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Band-Aids - I think they believed that like magic slates that there was an extra Band-Aid already marked and there was a double layer used to expose the previous markings. The part that fooled them was that there were no extra marked Band-Aids or pieces of them left over at the end. Watching it again, it seems clear to me that when she is placing the bandaids on Jonathan’s hand and her head, she is just peeling off the fake layer and then discards it. There are some camera cuts so I don’t see when she discarded them but my guess for Jonathan’s would be when she grabs the second band aid. Overall, I think it’s a very simple trick and Penn and Teller thought it was way more complicated then it actually was. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2015, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/737 "2015-10-09T02:17:09Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > I searched and found other people saying that, but didn’t see anything definite. If there’s a list of rules for the show or an interview where P&T say that I would really like to know for sure, the chance that there is an audience plants makes some of the tricks more ‘meh’ for me. > [@Irishman](#): > > I vaguely recall that at some point being said, but couldn’t find it now. Maybe Penn at one of the early season 1 shows? It’s just so lame, I don’t think the producers would cast a magician using plants. They have to reveal the trick to the magician-producer before they go on. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2015, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/738 "2015-10-09T04:16:00Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > It’s just so lame, I don’t think the producers would cast a magician using plants. They have to reveal the trick to the magician-producer before they go on. They’ve allowed a plant before. There was a magician who had video of him (supposedly remotely) directing the trick, but he was actually in the audience as a plant with a disguise. He did a number draw that ‘randomly’ picked him as the volunteer, then revealed himself at the finale. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2015, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/739 "2015-10-09T04:42:28Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > They’ve allowed a plant before. There was a magician who had video of him (supposedly remotely) directing the trick, but he was actually in the audience as a plant with a disguise. He did a number draw that ‘randomly’ picked him as the volunteer, then revealed himself at the finale. Yeah, but the fact that he revealed himself made it not really a plant. And also completely ruined the trick. ---
**Author:** ![numeroussyrup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/edb3f5/32.png) [@numeroussyrup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/numeroussyrup)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2015, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015/740 "2015-10-09T11:45:18Z")
Someone on reddit [posted](http://imgur.com/a/3szig) from Paul Vigil’s book on how he did the trick. The guesses people had here were spot on with an elastic to pull the card onto the back of his jacket. It’s a cool effect and I understand why Penn and Teller wanted to use it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015.md?page=36) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-teller-fool-us-us-run-on-cw/695015.md?page=38)