# Penn & Teller's Bullshit series...is bullshit? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 28, 2006, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534 "2006-08-28T15:51:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/1 "2006-08-28T15:51:56Z")
I found a bunch of episodes of this series on Google Video, I’d never even heard of it before. It’s entertaining, I’ll give it that. It makes you think, but obviously they’re very biased and hostile towards dissenting views. It’s not much of a debate when they just show selected parts of interviews and then agree with or disagree/insult the person. A lot of the topics they work on don’t really have a clear right or wrong answer either, but Penn makes it sound like he has all the answers. I generally agree with their views, but there’s something in the series to insult just about everyone. What do you guys think of it? ---
**Author:** ![Ensign\_Edison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ab992/32.png) [@Ensign\_Edison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ensign_Edison)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/2 "2006-08-28T15:57:36Z")
Give an example of a topic they’ve covered with no right or wrong answer? I’ve only seen a couple of episodes. Yes, they are biased and hostile toward certain views that they think are extremely dangerous, misguided, and far too often coddled. They’re not obligated to pretend to like psychic surgeons to meet some mythical standard of disinterest. It’s not called “Bullshit?”. That said, their vehemence doesn’t make them wrong (or right). Like any other television program, the viewers are responsible to fill in the holes themselves. ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/3 "2006-08-28T16:07:10Z")
Recycling, Gun Control, Family Values, Environmental Hysteria, College, War on Drugs. Not to get out of Cafe Society topical restrictions, but I think there is no completely right or wrong answer to these things, but they make it sound like “we’re right, anybody who disagrees is wrong.” And I agree with them on 3 of those 6 things. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/4 "2006-08-28T16:07:29Z")
I’ve seen seasons 1 and 2 in their entirety, and generally I liked it. But yeah, the present a pretty one-sided view of things with little dissent, except by clear assholes. Since I agree with most of what they say, I don’t have a huge problem with it. But once in a while, they are simply wrong. The only example I can remember is the one about bottled water. All tap water in America, they claim, is perfectly potable. I’d like to celebrate their conclusion by offereing them a nice big glass of the brown stuff that comes out of the taps here at work. ---
**Author:** ![Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/bc8723/32.png) [@Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unauthorized_Cinnamon)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/5 "2006-08-28T16:24:04Z")
I kind of think it’s part of the beauty of the show. If you turn off your brain and just believe what P&T spoon-feed you, you’re as gullible as the rubes they show believing in John Edward (TBDITU). If viewers actually pay attention and get the lessons of the show, they will know to turn a skeptical eye on the show itself. For instance, P&T are clearly staunch Libertarians. It colors their presentation. In another vein, the show is meant to be entertaining, not merely educational. This influences what they present and how. I don’t think that really undermines the show much though. It certainly does more for critical thinking than most TV I’ve ever seen. ---
**Author:** ![Rachael\_Rage](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/71c47a/32.png) [@Rachael\_Rage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rachael_Rage)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/6 "2006-08-28T16:31:45Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > The only example I can remember is the one about bottled water. All tap water in America, they claim, is perfectly potable. I’d like to celebrate their conclusion by offereing them a nice big glass of the brown stuff that comes out of the taps here at work. I think it’s reasonable to believe that the _water_ is safe, but not necessarily the _pipes_ it runs through. **tdn** , is _all_ the water where you live brown, or just where you work? I believe brown water is usually caused by rust in the pipes (and, IIRC, this is not harmful, just unappetizing). NYC has the safest, cleanest, tastiest water in the U.S., if not the world, but I rarely drink it unfiltered because I don’t trust the pipes in older buildings. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/7 "2006-08-28T16:32:11Z")
> [@Unauthorized Cinnamon](#): > > I kind of think it’s part of the beauty of the show. If you turn off your brain and just believe what P&T spoon-feed you, you’re as gullible as the rubes they show believing in John Edward (TBDITU). If viewers actually pay attention and get the lessons of the show, they will know to turn a skeptical eye on the show itself. Right. It’s like that area of Snopes with the false reports: the point being that if you blindly believe ANYONE, even Snopes, then you’re just as foolish and blind as the people who believe Mikey died from Pop Rocks and Coke because they got it in an email. They may be vehement in their beliefs, and they may even be correct about many of them. But of course they have their biases and filters - they are still human. Penn, anyway. I’m not so sure about Teller. 😃 “Do not believe in anything simply because you have heard it. Do not believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do not believe in anything simply because it is found written in your religious books. Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of your teachers and elders. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations. But after observation and analysis, when you find that anything agrees with reason and is conductive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it.” -Buddha ---
**Author:** ![pool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pool/32/4152_2.png) [@pool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pool)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/8 "2006-08-28T16:34:51Z")
While I stayed in Florida this summer I was watching the local news and saw a report telling people in certain counties that they would need to boil their water before drinking. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/9 "2006-08-28T16:35:58Z")
> [@Darth Vader's Little Pal](#): > > NYC has the safest, cleanest, tastiest water in the U.S., if not the world, but I rarely drink it unfiltered because I don’t trust the pipes in older buildings. I can name several towns in Upstate NY that beat NYC in tapwater tastiness. At least one is tastier IMO because it tastes exactly like unfiltered mountain water (with just the right taste of dirt to give it that “natural” taste.) Then again, compared to Orlando tap water, NYC’s is Ev-freakin-ian. ---
**Author:** ![Jayrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Jayrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jayrot)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/10 "2006-08-28T16:46:57Z")
Seems that their main point with the water episode is not that tap water is so great, but rather that bottled water is Bullshit! The bottled water with fresh mountain streams on the label comes from a processing plant in some industrial district somwhere. Furthermore, the idiots in the fancy restaurant sampling the $8/bottle garden hose water think it’s great. Sure tap water often has some added taste to it, but when you’re told it’s specialty Brazilian Monkey Sweat added, you’re fooled. I think they’re point is that it’s all in the mind. They’re point is BE SCEPTICAL. ---
**Author:** ![Jayrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Jayrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jayrot)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/11 "2006-08-28T16:48:47Z")
they’re --\> their Funny…I never make that mistake. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/12 "2006-08-28T16:54:26Z")
> [@](#): > > They’re point is BE SCEPTICAL. No, their point is LOOK COOL. And part of looking cool when you’re not is being cynical - making sure you never openly believe in anything because somebody else might laugh at your beliefs. Penn Jillette seems to have made it his life mission to ensure that nobody ever calls him a dork again. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/13 "2006-08-28T17:02:58Z")
I’m somewhat put off by the scorn they heap on people who don’t really deserve it, as the cat-lovers episode. “These people are FUCKING NUTS!! They put their cats on DISPLAY and that’s just FUCKING NUTS! Did we mention how FUCKING NUTS these people are? SHIT!” Geez, Penn, give it a rest, willya? And lose some weight. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/14 "2006-08-28T17:03:03Z")
> [@Darth Vader's Little Pal](#): > > I think it’s reasonable to believe that the _water_ is safe, but not necessarily the _pipes_ it runs through. **tdn** , is _all_ the water where you live brown, or just where you work? I believe brown water is usually caused by rust in the pipes (and, IIRC, this is not harmful, just unappetizing). I’ll accept that as a possible explanation. I still ain’t drinking it, though. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/15 "2006-08-28T17:05:54Z")
> [@Jayrot](#): > > Seems that their main point with the water episode is not that tap water is so great, but rather that bottled water is Bullshit! The bottled water with fresh mountain streams on the label comes from a processing plant in some industrial district somwhere. And it’s a point well taken. However, they imply (if not outright state) that all bottled water comes from municipal supplies in major cities. I have since checked labels on various bottles waters and found this not to be the case. But they’ve got me checking labels, so I guess that’s all that counts. ---
**Author:** ![Ensign\_Edison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ab992/32.png) [@Ensign\_Edison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ensign_Edison)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/16 "2006-08-28T17:10:40Z")
> [@Little Nemo](#): > > No, their point is LOOK COOL. And part of looking cool when you’re not is being cynical - making sure you never openly believe in anything because somebody else might laugh at your beliefs. > > Penn Jillette seems to have made it his life mission to ensure that nobody ever calls him a dork again. Very far from factual to say that they don’t openly believe in anything. Or that Penn doesn’t know he’s a dork. I’m not so sure he knows he’s an asshole, but his dorkitude he is quite comfortable in. He once wrote an essay recommending dumping a milkshake over your own head to get out of a fight, because it worked for him. He has no dork shame. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/17 "2006-08-28T17:14:50Z")
> [@Darth Vader's Little Pal](#): > > I\*\* think it’s reasonable to believe that the _water_ is safe, but not necessarily the _pipes_ it runs through. \*\* **tdn** , is _all_ the water where you live brown, or just where you work? I believe brown water is usually caused by rust in the pipes (and, IIRC, this is not harmful, just unappetizing). > > NYC has the safest, cleanest, tastiest water in the U.S., if not the world, but I rarely drink it unfiltered because I don’t trust the pipes in older buildings. The highlighted statement seems silly to me. It’s not tap water until it comes out the tap, after all; if much of it is not potable at that point, then it’s fair to say that not all tap water is potable. The condition of the water before it begins its journey’s through the pipes is irrevelant. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/18 "2006-08-28T17:19:00Z")
> [@Little Nemo](#): > > Penn Jillette seems to have made it his life mission to ensure that nobody ever calls him a dork again. He’s the same way on his radio show. I find him very pretentious, very cocksure, yet still kinda funny. ---
**Author:** ![Dunderman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecb155/32.png) [@Dunderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dunderman)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/19 "2006-08-28T17:26:10Z")
> [@control-z](#): > > Recycling, Gun Control, Family Values, Environmental Hysteria, College, War on Drugs. I haven’t seen many episodes, but I did see one about environmental hysteria, and their point wasn’t that we shouldn’t care about the environment, but that using the environment to push socialism is bullshit. I’m an environmentalist socialist, and I agree with them. ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2006, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534/20 "2006-08-28T17:43:52Z")
I’ve watched all 3 seasons. I believe everything they (or actually their experts) say but I’m not sure that I agree with it. They do present it in an entertaining way, and I’m much more inclined to go to their show than to 20/20 to view a discussion of most of these matters. I think with P&T tho…being familiar with their act helps you realize that they can often be full of bullshit but they know it, and they allow us to know it, and it comes down to making money being showmen. They DO make it easy for us to just trust them and use their opinions as our own, but hopefully I’m right (and everyone else who’s said so) that they just want us to be more skepical. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/penn-tellers-bullshit-series-is-bullshit/370534.md?page=2)