[QUOTE=Brown Eyed Girl]
Hmm…I’m thinking on this one. I’m guessing under certain circumstances this may work for you and those around you, but in others it wouldn’t.
–If we are all going the same speed, how would it slow traffic behind you if the gap was large enough to fit my car without having you tailgate me?
–If I had sufficient gap to merge before you sped up and closed the gap, how is that not prolonging my wait?
[/quote]
To both of the above, I’d say I wouldn’t speed up if there was going to be a sufficient gap. If, without me slowing down, there would be enough space in front of me after the lane change for me to feel safe driving behind you, then I wouldn’t (and shouldn’t) speed up.
That’s not really something other drivers can be expected to concern themselves about.
(And I drive an Accent FTR.)
Like I said–if I wouldn’t have to slow down in order to let you over, then come on over. If I would have to slow down, then you’re not supposed to come over anyway. And since you’re not coming over, I can’t see any reason for me not to speed up.
[QUOTE=Sailboat]
Someone like that will signal every time, in case of failing ot notice another driver or pedestrian. Because thinking tnings through before they happen would lead one to that conclusion.
Sailboat
[/QUOTE]
See my post directly above. You are missing the point I was trying to make.
[QUOTE=Frylock]
Like I said–if I wouldn’t have to slow down in order to let you over, then come on over. If I would have to slow down, then you’re not supposed to come over anyway. And since you’re not coming over, I can’t see any reason for me not to speed up.
[/QUOTE]
Why not? What if I need to be in your lane in order to continue to my destination? How is it that I’m not supposed to be in your lane? Just make room and share the lane. It’s not that hard. There should be no expectation that you will be able to maintain the same speed once you’ve chosen your lane from the moment you get on the highway until the moment you get off. Everyone has some place to be and in order to get there, eventually we have to cross each other’s paths. All I’m saying is people don’t need to be dicks about it.
[QUOTE=Queen Bruin]
That’s often the way it is on the 405 during rush hour. Not so much closer to where I live. And I was conceived here 27 years ago
[/QUOTE]
Wow. You were conceived on the 405 during rush hour 27 years ago? Unless traffic was stopped, I’d say that was inattentive (although pleasurable) driving. Driving of a motor vehicle, that is.
Back to Mr. Bearflag70. As has been expressed my numerous others, certain behaviors are habituated because it’s good practice, and many of us believe in them, not to be morally superior, but to courteously coexist with our fellow humans/drivers.
Perhaps my perspective is different, given that it includes operating fire apparatus and triaxle snow plows. Since the vehicle I’m operating is large enough to crush your Geo Metro like a pop can, it’s obligatory for me to signal where I’m going, well in advance, and for you to do likewise, so I’m aware of your intentions. For either of us to do otherwise can lead to unpleasant results.
Ever experience a ghost dump, Bearflag70? You know-a good healthy session of bowel evacuation, and yet the paper is as clean after wiping as it was when you tore it from the roll. In that instance, wiping was a waste of your time and a waste of paper. So, do you stop wiping? Do you use a mirror and a flashlight to see if wiping is required after elimination, or do you just wipe because it makes sense to do so?
I wipe for the same reason I use turn signals every time-nobody wants some dirty assed SOB changing lanes or turning without signalling.
[QUOTE=danceswithcats]
Wow. You were conceived on the 405 during rush hour 27 years ago? Unless traffic was stopped, I’d say that was inattentive (although pleasurable) driving. Driving of a motor vehicle, that is.
[/QUOTE]
I said here, not there, and that was meant as a response to Gangster Octopus’ “I’ve been here 11 years and I’ve never seen it!” thing.
[QUOTE=Voyager]
Not if the time between the signal and the change can be measured in milliseconds. :).
[/QUOTE]
Heh, at that point I am too lazy to bother with the signal!
[QUOTE=Voyager]
The only thing I have against turn signals is the guy who has run up in a lane with a lot of space to get to the point where his lane stops, and then uses the turn signal to try to push into the slower lane now moving faster. (No merge coming.) Too bad, bub.
[/QUOTE]
Same here. When I am driving the big truck, I have a tendency to - cough - wander over to the side so those folks can’t get by.
[QUOTE=Bearflag70]
To clarify, anyone who knowingly fails to comply 100% with all traffic laws at all times, except in cases of emergency, is an asshole, including those who consciously limit their infractions to situations where the risk of harm to others as a result of the infractions is minimal.
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Dante]
Do we have to limit ourselves to Californians? I’d like anyone from anywhere try to explain this behaviour.
[/QUOTE]
I missed the original post, but in California we are not required to turn into the near right lane at all times. In urban areas, that can actually be "most times’.
[QUOTE=Gangster Octopus]
I hear all the time about how when putting on a turn signal somebody will speed up and not let you in and I think that is just false. I would saythat 90% of the time when I put my turn signal on, the person actually slows to allow me in.
And I lived in Southern California for almost 11 years.
[/QUOTE]
Then you were lucky, or you left a long time ago. I would say 99% of the time when I use my signal a significant amount of time prior to changing lanes (i.e. long enough for someone to react), the person next to me will not only speed up, they will end up right on my rear quarter panel. (And I would have said 100% of the time, except when I am driving the truck they tend to be more concerned about whether or not I might actually just merge into them and obliterate them.)
I drive a lot, all over the western states, Mexico and Canada as well as some elsewhere. I use my signals extremely rarely because I have been essentially trained that to do so is counter productive. I find that it is much safer to look to see if I can move over rather than to blink and hope/assume that the people in the lane next to me will be smart/nice enough to stay out of the way.
[QUOTE=curlcoat]
I missed the original post, but in California we are not required to turn into the near right lane at all times. In urban areas, that can actually be "most times’.
Kathy
[/QUOTE]
Quite the contrary, here in California you’re required to turn into the furthest right-hand lane when making a right-hand turn. It’s left turns where you’re not required to turn into the left-most lane. Unless otherwise marked, of course. Cite.
What really freaked me out when I came here was people making right-on-red turns when in a right-turn lane that is not the rightmost lane, which apparently is legal: http://www.insidebayarea.com/argus/localnews/ci_8638309
To clarify, anyone who knowingly fails to comply 100% with all traffic laws at all times, except in cases of emergency, is an asshole, including those who consciously limit their infractions to situations where the risk of harm to others as a result of the infractions is minimal.
[/quote]
[QUOTE=curlcoat]
You never speed? In Sacramento???
Kathy
[/QUOTE]
I was clarifying the position taken by others in this thread, not my own position.
To specifically address your speeding question, I’m not walking into that buzzsaw. Rather, perhaps I should just say that, now that I have corrected my turn signal thing through therapy and sorting out some issues with Mother, I’m an absolute angel behind the wheel and I never do anything wrong or in violation of the law, ever. I am extremely morally outraged at anyone who does anything less than perfect at any time and I am always sure to throw my righteous indignation their way at every opportunity. I realize that people cannot rely on their own senses and good judgment, ever, and near certain death lurks around every corner when driving. People generally suck and driving is so inherently dangerous and fraught with peril and imminent harm to all that it’s a wonder why they let anyone but me and the handful of other Good Citizens in this thread drive at all.
[QUOTE=Bearflag70]
To specifically address your speeding question, I’m not walking into that buzzsaw. Rather, perhaps I should just say that, now that I have corrected my turn signal thing through therapy and sorting out some issues with Mother, I’m an absolute angel behind the wheel and I never do anything wrong or in violation of the law, ever. I am extremely morally outraged at anyone who does anything less than perfect at any time and I am always sure to throw my righteous indignation their way at every opportunity. I realize that people cannot rely on their own senses and good judgment, ever, and near certain death lurks around every corner when driving. People generally suck and driving is so inherently dangerous and fraught with peril and imminent harm to all that it’s a wonder why they let anyone but me and the handful of other Good Citizens in this thread drive at all.
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Frylock]
Like I said–if I wouldn’t have to slow down in order to let you over, then come on over. If I would have to slow down, then you’re not supposed to come over anyway. And since you’re not coming over, I can’t see any reason for me not to speed up.
[/QUOTE]
Why not? What if I need to be in your lane in order to continue to my destination? How is it that I’m not supposed to be in your lane? Just make room and share the lane. It’s not that hard. There should be no expectation that you will be able to maintain the same speed once you’ve chosen your lane from the moment you get on the highway until the moment you get off. Everyone has some place to be and in order to get there, eventually we have to cross each other’s paths. All I’m saying is people don’t need to be dicks about it.
[/QUOTE]
Damn right. The attitude of “it’s my lane, and I’ll let you enter it if I feel like it” is wrong. We all share the road. If I need to get over, I’ll put on my signal, and I expect you to make room for me. Because that’s what a nice person does.
[QUOTE=MrSquishy]
Damn right. The attitude of “it’s my lane, and I’ll let you enter it if I feel like it” is wrong. We all share the road. If I need to get over, I’ll put on my signal, and I expect you to make room for me. Because that’s what a nice person does.
[/QUOTE]
I get what you’re saying here, but you’re not supposed to change lanes unless it’s safe to do so. If someone is nice, that’s great, but they’re not obligated to make room for you. You are obligated to find room.
In the real world, there’s give and take, especially on busy roads, but I can see why someone might not want to let someone in, for instance if they’ve just come screaming up another lane in order to bypass the people who thought ahead and who have been waiting patiently.
I see this all the time on the Gardiner in Toronto. Driving in the slow lane, and there’s a merge lane to my right. I’ve left a giant gap so that drivers can enter it at speed to reduce congestion. Do they? Hardly ever. They go barreling up the merge lane to the very end, cram on their brakes, and nose their way into traffic. Counter-productive, and not to be encouraged, says I.
BTW, Buffalo drivers are the exact opposite. They get into traffic immediately. It’s awesome to watch.
[QUOTE=MrSquishy]
Damn right. The attitude of “it’s my lane, and I’ll let you enter it if I feel like it” is wrong. We all share the road. If I need to get over, I’ll put on my signal, and I expect you to make room for me. Because that’s what a nice person does.
[/QUOTE]
If you’re in a forced merge situation, yes. I always slow down to let the next car merging in (and then speed up so the guy after that doesn’t try to take advantage.) But otherwise, slowing down in heavy traffic makes all the cars behind you slow down also, and leads to congestion. That’s not worth it to help the kind of driver who always wants to be in the fastest lane, and will change lanes a dozen times to do so. Around here plenty of knuckleheads leave 5 car lengths of space when moving at 4 mph - wait until you hit a gap like that and then move over. That’s what I do.
If anyone has to slam on the brakes to avoid hitting a car making a sudden lane change, the changer is a jerk.
And BTW - if someone is trying to change lanes behind you, and you have space in front of you, move up to give him room. That keeps two lanes from being blocked.
[QUOTE=MrSquishy]
Damn right. The attitude of “it’s my lane, and I’ll let you enter it if I feel like it” is wrong. We all share the road. If I need to get over, I’ll put on my signal, and I expect you to make room for me. Because that’s what a nice person does.
[/QUOTE]
It’s also the law (at least here) - obstructionist driving is illegal.
[QUOTE=Ruken]
Ok, ok, Bearflag is an asshole, …
[/QUOTE]
Slight Hijack, (not directed at you Ruken, I’ve seen this more and more lately and this particular thread it just really seemed out of place).
Bearflag’s an Asshole? Really? Has the definition of the word asshole changed drastically lately? I thought it meant someone who is purposefully nasty, cruel, selfish, and malicious in thought, deed, and the spoken word and someone who enjoys being that way.
Bearflag’s turn signal belief is incorrect (technically per laws of the road), maybe kind of lazy, and silly but he’s an asshole?
[QUOTE=Dante] Okay.
[/QUOTE]
I dunno… I really liked his post. I sensed it was done with a touch of humor, but with a bite. And I’m sorry, some of the people who jumped him… were real asses and hypocrites besides.
As an aside: I continue to think that from IMHO to the Pit was quite a jump. And the tone changed in that same post.
He had opened up about one thing in a DIFFERENT forum. If we have to tread so lightly as to expect that as soon as we say something someone CAN take offense at it will go to the Pit… then we will have some serious hedging on posts. That seems counter-productive to me.
One bitten… twice shy.
As I’ve pointed out, plenty of “legal” drivers do things that nearly create accidents all the time. Like the ongoing “it’s my lane” discussion.
