# People who are born gay.
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-are-born-gay/145662
**Category:** In My Humble Opinion
**Created:** [December 30, 2002, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-are-born-gay/145662 "2002-12-30T11:53:50Z")
**Posts on this page:** 11
**Page:** 3
### Author:  [@MrVisible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrVisible)
#### Post date: [December 31, 2002, 7:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-are-born-gay/145662/42 "2002-12-31T07:36:57Z")
Not to mention the fact that people have been told that homosexuality is wrong, at least in most Western cultures, for-freaking-ever. And yet, we gay people keep cropping up.
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### Author:  [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)
#### Post date: [December 31, 2002, 7:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-are-born-gay/145662/43 "2002-12-31T07:54:54Z")
> [@](#):
>
> And yet, we gay people keep cropping up.
Makes you wonder whether it’s nature’s way of saying, “Yo! Bozos! You need gay genes around!”
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### Author:  [@Sdrawkcab](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sdrawkcab)
#### Post date: [December 31, 2002, 8:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-are-born-gay/145662/44 "2002-12-31T08:52:10Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by JerseyDiamond \*
> I never thought of that. This will be interesting.
> Another possible argument will be that maybe ‘gayness’ skips a generation, if the child doesn’t turn out to be gay. I guess we’ll see…
Gay genes don’t “skip a generation,” they just may not be active from one generation to the next. The presence of the gene may not mean anything without an environmental trigger in early childhood or the womb. Therefore you can have genetically identical twins be born, and one be gay and the other not be… though I believe in most cases twin studies produced two gay twins.
If the gay gene exists, it is clearly regressive, like the gene for red hair or green eyes. It can lie dormant for generations before being placed in a combination that doesn’t override it.
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### Author:  [@Susanann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Susanann)
#### Post date: [December 31, 2002, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-are-born-gay/145662/45 "2002-12-31T14:21:47Z")
With all of the problems, outcasting, hazing, discrimination, and actual physical danger that these people face, I cannot believe that anyone actually freely “chooses” to become a homosexual.
It just doesnt make sense to me.
I think they have to be “born” and wired that way, else being with someone of the same sex just has no appeal at all.
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### Author:  [@BeatenMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeatenMan)
#### Post date: [January 1, 2003, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-are-born-gay/145662/46 "2003-01-01T03:09:24Z")
* * *
posted by :Audrey Levins
Which leads me to my theory that more people would be gay if the situation arose where they felt emboldened enough to try it. In other words, people are afraid to try it because they might, like these strippers, end up liking it as much as, or more than, heterosexual sex…and that once this barrier is eroded–by the opposite sex, by opportunity, by simple curiosity–you will end up with a much wider scope of sexuality than you had before.
* * *
People know what they want. I have had oppertunities to be with the other sex. Its like an 80 year old grandma their are some things you just don’t want to fuck. Unless you are real fucking horney and will fuck a dog or anything that will hold still and feel like sick fuck after you bust your nut. Are you saying their is no such thing as that sick fuck nut?
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### Author:  [@Danimal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Danimal)
#### Post date: [January 1, 2003, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-are-born-gay/145662/47 "2003-01-01T05:41:15Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by DMark \*
> \*\*
> And after that is settled, let’s get to the root of the problem why some folks are rabidly obsessed with finding out the “cause” of homosexuality…as if that would change their opinion of the dreaded fag one iota. \*\*
**DMark** , I consider that statement obscurantist and unworthy of a forum dedicated to fighting ignorance.
Contrary to your nasty little implication that anyone who wants to find out what causes sexual orientation must be a mindless homophobe, the origin of human sexual orientation is of interest to all sorts of people, including quite a few gays who are perfectly at ease with themselves.
Understanding how human beings tick is one of the noblest goals of science. And achieving that understanding will strike a blow not only against homophobia, but against all petty and stupid hatreds based on ignorance.
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### Author:  [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)
#### Post date: [January 1, 2003, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-are-born-gay/145662/48 "2003-01-01T18:05:38Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by BeatenMan \*
> \*\*\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_
> posted by :Audrey Levins
>
> Which leads me to my theory that more people would be gay if the situation arose where they felt emboldened enough to try it. In other words, people are afraid to try it because they might, like these strippers, end up liking it as much as, or more than, heterosexual sex…and that once this barrier is eroded–by the opposite sex, by opportunity, by simple curiosity–you will end up with a much wider scope of sexuality than you had before.
>
> * * *
>
> People know what they want. I have had oppertunities to be with the other sex. Its like an 80 year old grandma their are some things you just don’t want to fuck. Unless you are real fucking horney and will fuck a dog or anything that will hold still and feel like sick fuck after you bust your nut. Are you saying their is no such thing as that sick fuck nut? \*\*
Consider this to be an official warning, **BeatenMan**. If you post like this again in any forum other than the BBQ Pit, you will suffer the rather obvious consequences.
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### Author:  [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)
#### Post date: [January 1, 2003, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-are-born-gay/145662/49 "2003-01-01T22:00:27Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Danimal \*
> \*\ ***DMark** , I consider that statement obscurantist and unworthy of a forum dedicated to fighting ignorance.
>
> Contrary to your nasty little implication that anyone who wants to find out what causes sexual orientation must be a mindless homophobe, the origin of human sexual orientation is of interest to all sorts of people, including quite a few gays who are perfectly at ease with themselves.
>
> Understanding how human beings tick is one of the noblest goals of science. And achieving that understanding will strike a blow not only against homophobia, but against all petty and stupid hatreds based on ignorance. \*\*
Or it will create a situation like in the movie **Twilight of the Golds** where homosexuality is tested for and either the fetus is aborted or they attempt to do “gene therapy.”
Many things which start out noble do not end that way.
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### Author:  [@jayseebee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayseebee)
#### Post date: [January 1, 2003, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-are-born-gay/145662/50 "2003-01-01T22:52:53Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by ñañi \*
> **Maybe the book WAS talking about transvestites. I don’t remember. Please take the above two paragraphs with a grain or two of salt.**
Or possibly quite a few grains. I read a book that sounds vaguely like it could be this one but it didn’t say that. It’s a pop science book by a UK geneticist [Steve Jones](http://www.sciencebase.com/BFB-jones.html) and is called [_Y, the descent of men_](http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0316856150/ref=sr_aps_books_1_1/026-2082374-1206019).
He does write quite a bit about people who fall somewhere between the two extremes of gender but just three pages about sexuality. It’s good though.
> [@](#):
>
> The idea of a gay gene re-emerged in the 1990s. It was hailed by much of the community as an alibi because, if the preference finds its roots in DNA, then it is at least not catching and should not be used to condemn those who practise it. The _Daily Mail_, in contrast greeted the claim with the vile headline ‘Abortion Hope after Gay Gene Finding’. Such preferences might indeed have an inborn foundation, but as usual when it comes to genes and human nature, reliable evidence is hard to find.
He talks about a study that showed that identical twins (who’re genetically identical) were twice as likely to share a same sex preference as non-identicals, suggesting that there is a link. But the claim was later shown not to stand up.
There have been claims that gay men are likely to have gay male relatives on their mother’s side of the family and at one stage it was claimed that the actual gene had been found on the X chromosome (comes from your mum if you’re a man so that’d add up)… all disputed though and later studies have failed to find it.
If there is a gene, then we have to start guessing why it’s not evolved away. One that he mentions is that gay men might help with childcare so their family’s genes survive because their kids are better cared for even though gay men themselves don’t pass on their own genetic material. Surveys don’t show millions of gay men looking after their brother’s and sister’s kids though. It could have happened in the past though… who knows?
I reckon the only plausible answer to **Sinful** ’s question is… dunno. Steve Jones puts it more eloquently than I’m able though:
> [@](#):
>
> Perhaps, as for schizophrenia, depression and other rare patterns of behaviour, the preference has a genetic component in some people but not in others. A partiality for the same sex is, after all, just an extreme of the normal range of activity. Nobody claims that single genes are responsible for tall or clever people and there is no more reason to do so when it comes to our diverse erotic interests.
Those are his thoughts; here’s mine…
The only reason you need the answer to this question is if you’re starting from the assumption that there’s something wrong with being gay. So ‘it’s genetic’ can be some sort of excuse. We’d be better off focussing our efforts on persuading people that homosexuality doesn’t have to be cured and looking for genetic causes for things that do.
Somewhat off the point, but d’you know that baboons greet their friends by grabbing their testicles… it’d make a change from shaking hands 😉
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### Author:  [@kimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kimera)
#### Post date: [January 1, 2003, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-are-born-gay/145662/51 "2003-01-01T23:13:59Z")
\*\*
> [@](#):
>
> _nobody knows what causes people’s sexual orientations, and that it is impossible to tell gay people from straight people on psychological tests._
> \*\*
Actually, gays tend to score _better_ on psycholigical tests in terms of being well-adjusted than do straight men.
Unfortunately, I am visiting my fiance’s parents over the holiday, so when I return home tomarrow I will get my cite.
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### Author:  [@Meatros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meatros)
#### Post date: [January 2, 2003, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-are-born-gay/145662/52 "2003-01-02T02:05:39Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Lissa \*
> \*\*Well, if the Raelians have done what they claim, a cloned baby will be born any moment to a lesbian couple.
>
> If the baby turns out to be gay, will this support the “nature” argument, or will people say that it was “nurture,” in that the lesbian parents nudged the baby in the direction of being gay?
>
> If the baby is straight, would this totally defeat the “nature” argument?
>
> It could turn out to be very interesting. \*\*
There’s something odd about the Raelians:
[http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A56233-2002Dec30.html](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A56233-2002Dec30.html)
I think there credibility is under scrutiney.
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