# People Who Don't Know What A Billion Is **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [February 13, 2017, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755 "2017-02-13T14:49:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Jefferson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/8491ac/32.png) [@Jefferson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jefferson)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/1 "2017-02-13T14:49:04Z")
I was watching the Wright Stuff this morning and the far-Left ex-soap actor Mark Little when reviewing the papers asked what a billion was, enquiring if it was a thousand million. Matt the Left-wing host, said it was a hundred million. Christine Hamilton said it was certainly a lot of money. A female Labour MP didn’t add anything to speak of (but may have muttered it’s a lot). Would you expect these people to know what a billion is? At least the host who has been doing the job for 15 years and the politician. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/2 "2017-02-13T15:05:26Z")
This sounds British. Are we talking about a metric billion? ---
**Author:** ![Jefferson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/8491ac/32.png) [@Jefferson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jefferson)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/3 "2017-02-13T15:09:40Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > This sounds British. Are we talking about a metric billion? A billion, as in 1,000,000,000. So that if you had 999 million you’d be almost to the magic number. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/4 "2017-02-13T15:17:59Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > This sounds British. Are we talking about a metric billion? This is not a joke, but a for-real distinction. Used to be that what Americans called a “billion” the British called a “Milliard”, and they used “billion” for what Americans called a “trillion”. But we’ve converted them to our way of speaking (now we have to work on “aluminium” and “zed”) > [@](#): > > A billion is a number with two distinct definitions: > 1,000,000,000, i.e. one thousand million, or 109 (ten to the ninth power), as defined on the short scale. This is now generally the meaning in both British and American English.[1][2] > 1,000,000,000,000, i.e. one million million, or 1012 (ten to the twelfth power), as defined on the long scale. This is one thousand times larger than the short scale billion, and equivalent to the short scale trillion. > > American English always uses the short scale definition but British English has employed both versions. Historically, the United Kingdom used the long scale billion but since 1974 official UK statistics have used the short scale. Since the 1950s the short scale has been increasingly used in technical writing and journalism, although the long scale definition still enjoys common usage.[3] > **[Billion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Billion)** > > Billion is a word for a large number with two distinct definitions: American English adopted the short scale definition from the French (it enjoyed usage in France at the time, alongside the long-scale definition). The United Kingdom used the long scale until 1974, when the government officially switched to the short scale, but since the 1950s the short scale had already been increasingly used in technical writing and journalism. Moreover, in 1941, Winston Churchill remarked: "For all practical... ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/5 "2017-02-13T15:19:26Z")
To be fair, the word “billion” has traditionally had different meanings in the British Isles and America (though I think the American usage has now mostly become the worldwide standard). But it’s never meant a hundred million, in any dialect. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/6 "2017-02-13T15:19:35Z")
> [@Jefferson](#): > > A billion, as in 1,000,000,000. So that if you had 999 million you’d be almost to the magic number. This is not true everywhere. In some countries a billion is 1,000,000,000,000 (what we would call a trillion). ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/7 "2017-02-13T16:15:58Z")
Wait til you get to India and they start talking (in perfect English) about lakhs and crores. One lakh = 100,000. One crore =100 lakh = 10,000,000. Usually rupees, but can be for any countable. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/8 "2017-02-13T17:09:23Z")
My favorite illustration of a billion was in a line from Dennis Miller on Saturday Night Live’s Weekend Update: “The People’s Republic of China has just announced that their population has reached one billion people. To give you an idea of how many people that is…if you’re a one-in-a-million kind of person, that means there’s a thousand of you walking around out there.” ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/9 "2017-02-13T17:31:39Z")
If we ever needed Carl Sagan, now is the time! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/10 "2017-02-13T17:36:05Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > If we ever needed Carl Sagan, now is the time! 😃 Because of the “Billions and Billions” thing, my wife’s friends used to refer to any large number as a “Sagan”. There’s a problem, though – Sagan himself says he never said that famous “billions and billions” line: > **[11 Famous Misquotations and What Was Really Said](https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/31522/11-famous-misquotations-and-what-was-really-said)** > > 1. 'Billions and billions.' Carl Sagan never said this, and he even explained that he never said it in the first chapter of his book, which, incidentally, was titled Billions & Billions:'Oh, I said there are maybe 100 billion galaxies and 10... [http://www.funtrivia.com/askft/Question107320.html](http://www.funtrivia.com/askft/Question107320.html) Although see here: [http://www.avclub.com/article/carl-sagan-did-say-billions-and-billions-lot-cosmo-213673](http://www.avclub.com/article/carl-sagan-did-say-billions-and-billions-lot-cosmo-213673) ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/11 "2017-02-13T18:00:51Z")
I remember reading an article by Sagan in which he was describing a large number of something or other, atoms or galaxies or some immense amount. He wrote, and I’m paraphrasing from memory: > [@](#): > > There are billions (yes, I know, I know, but that’s how many there are)… ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/12 "2017-02-13T18:07:20Z")
Point of clarification: where billion meant 10^12, did trillion mean 10^15 or 10^18? Was there a word billiard for 10^15? Or just for a kind of pool? Just curious. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/13 "2017-02-13T18:14:05Z")
> [@jtur88](#): > > Wait til you get to India and they start talking (in perfect English) about lakhs and crores. > > One lakh = 100,000. One crore =100 lakh = 10,000,000. Usually rupees, but can be for any countable. And, to continue the confusion, “10,000,000” would be written as “1,00,00,000” in the Indian system. Really confused the heck out of me the first few times I read the local English language papers there. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/14 "2017-02-13T18:14:07Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > Point of clarification: where billion meant 10^12, did trillion mean 10^15 or 10^18? Was there a word billiard for 10^15? Or just for a kind of pool? Just curious. A British trillion used to mean 10[sup]18[/sup], or the equivalent of a quadrillion in the US. > **[Oxford Languages | The Home of Language Data](https://languages.oup.com/)** > > Explore Oxford Languages, the home of world-renowned language data. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/15 "2017-02-13T18:19:00Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > Point of clarification: where billion meant 10^12, did trillion mean 10^15 or 10^18? Was there a word billiard for 10^15? Or just for a kind of pool? Just curious. In other European languages (at least in French, and it looks like it might be an obselete usage in English), yes, 10^15 was billiard, and 10^21 was trilliard, and so on. ---
**Author:** ![Jefferson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/8491ac/32.png) [@Jefferson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jefferson)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/16 "2017-02-13T18:31:54Z")
Just a reminder, my question is: Would you expect these people to know what a billion is? ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/17 "2017-02-13T18:40:35Z")
> [@Jefferson](#): > > Just a reminder, my question is: Would you expect these people to know what a billion is? The only one I would expect to know - and here by “expect to know” I mean “it sure would be nice if they knew” - is the MP; it would be disconcerting to have someone in office tinkering with the economy of the nation without really understanding how big a billion pounds is compared to the average working person’s salary. The others are actors and entertainers, so I’m not terribly shocked that they’re innumerate. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/18 "2017-02-13T19:54:56Z")
> [@Jefferson](#): > > Just a reminder, my question is: Would you expect these people to know what a billion is? Yes. Even the actors and entertainers. I would expect a grade school child to know what a billion is. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/19 "2017-02-13T20:02:49Z")
When watching astronomy documentaries hosted by Brits, I’ve noticed they prefer to say “thousand million” over “billion.” ---
**Author:** ![Kimballkid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5a626/32.png) [@Kimballkid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimballkid)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2017, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755/20 "2017-02-13T20:13:26Z")
Is a billion more than a fuckton? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-dont-know-what-a-billion-is/779755.md?page=2)