# People Who Smoke in the Car with Children in Them **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 25, 2013, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964 "2013-03-25T22:43:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Sparky\_the\_Wonder\_Spirit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@Sparky\_the\_Wonder\_Spirit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sparky_the_Wonder_Spirit)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2013, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/81 "2013-03-26T23:10:52Z")
> [@](#): > > We concluded that encouraging smoking parents of asthmatic children to smoke outdoors may not be an effective way to lessen exposure. Which, of course, says nothing about whether or not the smoking parents were actually bothering to go outside. ---
**Author:** ![Troppus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a587f6/32.png) [@Troppus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troppus)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2013, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/82 "2013-03-26T23:15:35Z")
> [@bobkitty](#): > > 2010, Journal of the American Academy of Pediatrics okay with you? Otherwise you can choose any of the first ten links that pop up in a Google search of “cotinine levels in children.” I think y’all’ll like this one, though- it’s all knee-jerky and “ZOMG, BAN SMOKING IN APARTMENTS!!” > > [http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/127/1/85.abstract](http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/127/1/85.abstract) Aww, you’re cute. Hey, here’s an idea. Let’s not limit the hazards of second hand smoke to cotinine levels and see what [pops](http://www.epa.gov/smokefre/healtheffects.html) [up.](http://www.cancer.org/cancer/cancercauses/tobaccocancer/secondhand-smoke) ---
**Author:** ![bobkitty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c67d28/32.png) [@bobkitty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobkitty)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2013, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/83 "2013-03-26T23:31:58Z")
> [@Troppus](#): > > Aww, you’re cute. Hey, here’s an idea. Let’s not limit the hazards of second hand smoke to cotinine levels and see what [pops](http://www.epa.gov/smokefre/healtheffects.html) [up.](http://www.cancer.org/cancer/cancercauses/tobaccocancer/secondhand-smoke) You do realize that you’re (and AU, bless his little heart) arguing a point that I agree with? Second hand smoke is bad. Smoking around kids is bad. I get it. We all get it. Life would be beautiful if all smokers were confined to one tiny little room that they smoke in to their hearts’ content, and when they’re ready to rejoin polite society they go through a thorough decon process where their skin is debrided and their clothes burned. But until that happens, then we make realistic guidelines for people to follow. We ban smoking in public areas, we provide education on the health risks, we limit who can purchase tobacco products. We don’t take people’s kids away if the kid is born with nicotine in their system. We don’t raid people’s houses when they light up if their kids are home. And we shouldn’t chase people down in cars because they’re slaves to their legal addiction and don’t roll a window down. That is the reality… hate it all you want, but the alternative is.. well, exactly what we’ve described. Overloaded law enforcement and CPS workers citing dumbasses for something they can legally do. The question remains: where do you think it should stop? Smoking is banned in public gathering places. Do we ban it in ALL public places- no more walking 150 feet past a building into a cloud of smoke? We ban it in cars with children.. do we ban it in cars that children will be riding in at some point in the future? All cars, because some day a smoker might want to sell their car? We ban it in apartment complexes.. do we ban it in private homes? In for a penny, in for a pound- or acknowledge that while the practice well and truly sucks, and is ridiculously selfish on the part of the parent, and potentially does horrible things to children’s health, that there has to be a point where society butts the fuck out (pun intended). ---
**Author:** ![Troppus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a587f6/32.png) [@Troppus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troppus)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2013, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/84 "2013-03-26T23:39:44Z")
> [@bobkitty](#): > > You do realize that you’re (and AU, bless his little heart) arguing a point that I agree with? Second hand smoke is bad. Smoking around kids is bad. I get it. Nah, not when you are deliberately cherry-picking narrow-framed cites which support the other side. What do I think is fair? Giving one’s kids the same consideration one gives co-workers and strangers. ---
**Author:** ![bobkitty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c67d28/32.png) [@bobkitty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobkitty)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2013, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/85 "2013-03-26T23:44:12Z")
> [@Troppus](#): > > What do I think is fair? Giving one’s kids the same consideration one gives co-workers and strangers. So when I carpool with my coworkers, all consenting adults, I should get cited for smoking in the car with them? ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2013, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/86 "2013-03-26T23:46:48Z")
> [@bobkitty](#): > > So when I carpool with my coworkers, all consenting adults, I should get cited for smoking in the car with them? You understand why this isn’t an analogous statement, right? ---
**Author:** ![Troppus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a587f6/32.png) [@Troppus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troppus)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2013, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/87 "2013-03-26T23:54:28Z")
> [@bobkitty](#): > > So when I carpool with my coworkers, all consenting adults, I should get cited for smoking in the car with them? You carpool with children under the age of consent? My god man, what third world country do you work in? ---
**Author:** ![bobkitty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c67d28/32.png) [@bobkitty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobkitty)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2013, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/88 "2013-03-26T23:55:30Z")
> [@DiosaBellissima](#): > > You understand why this isn’t an analogous statement, right? I absolutely do. I purposely turned the comment “What do I think is fair? Giving one’s kids the same consideration one gives co-workers and strangers.” around because- since she seems completely unwilling to actually answer the question that I’ve asked multiple times- I’m trying to ferret out exactly where she’d like the boundaries of these ‘considerations’ to be. I’d also like to figure out why she thinks that my pointing out that any exposure endangers the health of children is arguing ‘the other side,’ but I suspect she won’t answer that either. I apologize (specifically to you, because I’ve always admired your posting style) if this approach comes across as disingenuous, but it seems to be the only option I’ve got at the moment. ---
**Author:** ![Troppus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a587f6/32.png) [@Troppus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troppus)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2013, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/89 "2013-03-27T00:05:51Z")
> [@bobkitty](#): > > I absolutely do. I purposely turned the comment “What do I think is fair? Giving one’s kids the same consideration one gives co-workers and strangers.” around because- since she seems completely unwilling to actually answer the question that I’ve asked multiple times- I’m trying to ferret out exactly where she’d like the boundaries of these ‘considerations’ to be. > > I’d also like to figure out why she thinks that my pointing out that any exposure endangers the health of children is arguing ‘the other side,’ but I suspect she won’t answer that either. > > I apologize (specifically to you, because I’ve always admired your posting style) if this approach comes across as disingenuous, but it seems to be the only option I’ve got at the moment. Well, ask it directly, because I thought I answered you directly. Fair would be treating your children the same as your non-smoking co-workers and strangers: do it outdoors rather than trapping them in the smoke-filled car or house. What is unclear? ---
**Author:** ![flatlined](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/eb9ed0/32.png) [@flatlined](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flatlined)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2013, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/90 "2013-03-27T04:53:18Z")
> [@EmilyG](#): > > My mother smoked throughout her pregnancy with me (my sister too), and routinely smoked in the car with us as kids, until one day when she threw her cigarette out the window when she was finished with it - but it didn’t go out the window, it went into the backseat and left a nasty burn on my arm. She didn’t smoke in the car after that. That sort of stuff just ticks me off **EmilyG** I’m serious about this. It ticks me off when people throw lit butts out of their windows. I scare Hell’s Angels and delivery drivers into not doing it when I’m around. > [@April\_R](#): > > You make a good point. Plus, what happened to you is much worse than second hand smoke, I would never say otherwise. Diverting resources from DCS to go after second hand smokers would be ridiculous. Maybe just make it an offense like not waring a seat belt? I am not adverse to compromise and amending my stance when presented with a sound argument. Again, my greatest sympathies for what you went through. I like you a lot now. I probably shouldn’t have brought up what happened to me, but people who call minor stuff child abuse waste the time of people who need to be doing other stuff like checking on the kid who keeps falling down the stairs. Its a bit of a sore spot for me. I’m totally up for a ticket for people smoking in cars with children. That’s just not right. I won’t smoke around cats, kids are much more important. Could everyone redact that part where I said why its such a sore spot? I am not a victim, I’m a survivor. That is all in the past. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2013, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/91 "2013-03-27T05:05:37Z")
> [@bobkitty](#): > > The only 100% positive way to not impact your kids is to not smoke. So… you want to go ahead and start on the nanny-state legislation for that? You mean like the decades-long national effort to discourage smoking, which has _successfully_ drastically lowered the amount of smoking in this country? ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2013, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/92 "2013-03-27T05:09:24Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > You mean like the decades-long national effort to discourage smoking, which has _successfully_ drastically lowered the amount of smoking in this country? Did they ever do a “These are your lungs; _these_ are your lungs on nicotine! :eek:”-type commercial? ETA: Just curious; the question isn’t really relevant to anything. ---
**Author:** ![Tollhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e99b99/32.png) [@Tollhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tollhouse)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2013, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/93 "2013-03-27T05:09:56Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > I’m 50 years old. > > When I was a child, my father smoked 1.5-2 packs a day. When he smoked in the car, he refused to roll down the window because it bothered him. So we all got smoked (so to speak). > > None of us has cancer, none of us has asthma. > > Not that I’m defending the practice, but hysterical “oh won’t someone think of the children!” reactions always bother me. Ditto Grew up with both parents who smoked…dad a few times a week andmy mom smoked at least a pack a day…we also were in the car while she smoked and none of us kids suffered any effects from it, in fact, we are all pretty physically healthy…im not recommending driving with a smoke filled car, im just saying its not the evil horrific tragedy its made out to be by some…wouod i have preferred she didnt smoke in the car, yes, i wouodve preffered it but no, it wasnt the end of the world either ---
**Author:** ![Tollhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e99b99/32.png) [@Tollhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tollhouse)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2013, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/94 "2013-03-27T05:23:30Z")
> [@April\_R](#): > > Smoking is not a matter of a nanny state. It is poison, not a gun. Guns can be handled safely, tell me how one can safely smoke in a car around children and I will detract my objection. It isn’t about doing the “best possible,” it is about doing the bare minimum. Go outside to smoke, resist the urge to smoke around children. It’s not hard. It’s not an outrageous expectation of any decent parent or adult, even if they can’t kick the cigarette habit, they can refrain from smoking around children. > > Can anyone come up with a legitimate simile in this thread? It is getting ridiculous. Im sorry, butI agree, it would be. a nanny state, I know you feel strongly its child abuse,if I understand your post, I just do not agree at all and it should not be legislated. What about a whole host of behaviors that arent that healthy either, such as fast food, some parents have their kids live off it, parents who let their little kids watch R rated stuff or. worse not on purpose but they dont supervise, im tired so wont bother to think of a parade of u healthy undesirable behaviors ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2013, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/95 "2013-03-27T06:12:09Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > Did they ever do a “These are your lungs; _these_ are your lungs on nicotine! :eek:”-type commercial? > ETA: Just curious; the question isn’t really relevant to anything. Back in my childhood (I’m 27), I remember lots of commercials and stuff showing different organs of smokers and non smokers-- I remember it in school, too. Nowadays, they have gross [commercials like this one](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zWB4dLYChM). ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2013, 6:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/96 "2013-03-27T06:26:03Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > Did they ever do a “These are your lungs; _these_ are your lungs on nicotine! :eek:”-type commercial? I don’t recall what commercials they had, but I recall in school they passed around lung samples encased in glass, one set from normal lungs, another from a smoker with severe emphysema. The latter looked a lot like someone had used a blowtorch on it. It was a lot more convincing than fingerwaving moralizing, at least to me. ---
**Author:** ![Leonard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a6a055/32.png) [@Leonard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leonard)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2013, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/97 "2013-03-27T16:24:54Z")
If someone is going to smoke around their kids, doing it in the car while it’s moving with the window cracked open is probably the best way. The smoke gets sucked right out of the car. Doing it with the windows up would probably be the worst way possible, but I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone do that. ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2013, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/98 "2013-03-27T16:38:30Z")
> [@Leonard](#): > > The smoke gets sucked right out of the car. Yeah, this isn’t correct. In theory, yes, but in practice, no. My mom used to always crack the window, but I’d be hacking and coughing and sneezing and wheezing regardless. ---
**Author:** ![Troppus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a587f6/32.png) [@Troppus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troppus)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2013, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/99 "2013-03-27T17:02:33Z")
> [@Leonard](#): > > If someone is going to smoke around their kids, doing it in the car while it’s moving with the window cracked open is probably the best way. The smoke gets sucked right out of the car. Doing it with the windows up would probably be the worst way possible, but I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone do that. No it doesn’t, anymore than having a cracked window sucks any loose paper or dust, or my long hair out of the car. How does your suction theory work at stop signs, lights, and stalled in traffic? And how fast would a car need to go, how many inches of window crack, and what interior shape of what car allows for no smoke to settle into the back seat, corners, and apex of the interior roof? Don’t bother with doing the math, just look at the smoker’s car next to yours as you travel. See all that murky haze inside the car and note how the passenger and back seat are partially obscured? That’s smoke. The only purpose the driver’s cracked window serves is to give him or her a much needed blast of clean air. The passengers get to suck it. ---
**Author:** ![April\_R](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3da27b/32.png) [@April\_R](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/April_R)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2013, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964/100 "2013-03-27T17:27:53Z")
The purpose it to flick ash out of the window, not ventilation. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-who-smoke-in-the-car-with-children-in-them/653964.md?page=6)