# Persons planning to vote for Clinton: Are you really just voting against Trump?s **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [July 5, 2016, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110 "2016-07-05T03:47:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Balance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ccd318/32.png) [@Balance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balance)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/41 "2016-07-05T15:22:04Z")
I dislike Hillary, but I will be voting for her. My dislike stems, not from the smear campaign, but from an occasion when she came down squarely and actively on the wrong side–the anti-free-speech side–of an issue that was important to me. I didn’t like what she tried to do, how she tried to do it, or what I believe were her reasons for it. However, that issue is settled law now; her side lost, and it would be difficult to overturn, even if she gets to pick several Supremes. Despite my grudge, I regard her as competent and generally inclined to do things that I think will be more beneficial for the country and the world than any generic Republican candidate would, let alone Trump. So, yes, I will be voting _for_ her. Trump increases the urgency, but is far from the determining factor. (As an aside, I will go against the trend here and say that I dislike Biden more than I dislike Hillary. Again, I have specific reasons for it, and they have nothing to do with his “gaffe-prone” persona.) ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/42 "2016-07-05T16:03:57Z")
Hillary will make a fine President, and her election as a woman will advance America’s progressive path. Failures during her Administration will probably be caused by GOP obstruction, not Hillary’s own qualities. I would have preferred Biden as the nominee but _not_ because I think he’d make a better President. I’d just be more confident of November victory with Biden running. (Prediction markets still show the farcical short-fingered man with a 26% chance. :eek: ) ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/43 "2016-07-05T16:08:11Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > In other words, are you motivated by a desire to keep Trump out of office more than any wish to see Clinton in? > > My answer’s is…not exactly. That is, I didn’t especially want Secretary Clinton to be the nominee, even though I think she’s qualified, because I don’t like political dynastics. But I DO think she’s qualified, and while I’d have been happier with Biden as the nominee, I can unapologetically campaign and vote for her. > > But that’s just me. What about the rest of you? Pretty much, though if the Republicans had nominated Cruz I’d have voted for Hillary as well. Basically, while I don’t think that the Dems really want my vote all that much, the Republicans have completely rejected independent centrists such as myself and have jumped the shark in this election cycle, at least IMHO. They COULD have gotten my vote if they would have run someone I could stomach, since I’m no big fan of Clinton, but instead they seem bound and determined to drive folks like me away at every opportunity. So, Clinton it is. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/44 "2016-07-05T16:10:46Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > In other words, are you motivated by a desire to keep Trump out of office more than any wish to see Clinton in? Yes, but only because of the way your question was worded. Absent Trump I would still support Hillary, I voted for her both in this primary and in the 2008 primary, but at this point Hillary’s main selling point is that she isn’t Trump. It’s rather like asking, is the reason you are jumping into the lake because it is a warm day and the lake looked inviting for a swim or is it more because you are currently on fire. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/45 "2016-07-05T16:11:14Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > I’d vote for the proverbial ham sandwich over Trump, come to that, but I don’t have to. That’s what it’s come down to for me. I went into the primaries hoping for Kasich or Bush to win, but with Trump’s ascension, I’ll be voting for Hillary. Like PJ O’Rourke said (paraphrasing), she’s wrong about everything, but wrong within normal parameters. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/46 "2016-07-05T16:34:19Z")
I like Clinton. I supported her early on in 2008 before Obama won me over. I still think she’s great, and it annoys me that she’s had to fend off GOP attacks for the last 25 years. Part of me wants her to win just to spite them ---
**Author:** ![Nonsuch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nonsuch/32/2922_2.png) [@Nonsuch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nonsuch)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/47 "2016-07-05T16:46:04Z")
Definite pro-Clinton voter. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/48 "2016-07-05T16:46:51Z")
> [@Amateur\_Barbarian](#): > > You do see the logical lapse in your post, right? > > I’ve seen polls up into this range on a yes/no basis as to whether they are satisfied with the choice of candidates. > > By the way, **Elendil’s Heir** , what “untrustworthiness” do you mean that doesn’t stem mostly from 20+ years of GOP smear tactics? Both Clintons have been exonerated on every charge except Bill’s philandering, which (IMHO) is their business, not ours. I’m not asserting any logic, so there is no lapse. I am explaining my experience, which does not jive with your assertion, and am asking for information I can look at to decide if my experience is typical or not. Not sure why you think that’s a lapse in logical argument. I’ve seen lots of polls, too, but none that assert the 90% number you are claiming. ---
**Author:** ![Anny\_Middon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bc79bd/32.png) [@Anny\_Middon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anny_Middon)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/49 "2016-07-05T16:48:51Z")
Like many here, I’m not thrilled with Clinton, but I do like her. I’d vote for her over any of the Republicans that ran in the primaries. In 2012 I volunteered for the Obama campaign, the first time in my life I volunteered for any campaign. I got concerned that Romney might actually win, and decided I wanted to do something to help prevent that. I had decided back in the spring that I wouldn’t volunteer for the Clinton campaign. I live in Illinois, which is pretty solidly Blue so my efforts working locally aren’t too likely to mean much, and I was making phone calls for Obama which is not something I really liked doing. However now that Trump is (almost definitely) the Republican candidate, I’ll volunteer for the Clinton campaign. Health issues made it hard in 2012 to go on trips to swing states to help out, but I should be able to do that this time. So, my vote for Clinton is not a vote against Trump, but my volunteer work for Clinton will be volunteer work against Trump. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/50 "2016-07-05T16:58:01Z")
I’ll be voting for Clinton. Trump’s candidacy just means that even if I’m in a coma, I’ll wake up to vote for Clinton. ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/51 "2016-07-05T17:24:13Z")
Interestingly [a recent USA today poll](http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2016/07/04/usa-today-suffolk-poll-voters-alarmed-trump-clinton/86632526/) asked about this exact issue. > [@](#): > > Clinton commands more positive allegiance than Trump. By more than 3-1, 74% to 22%, Clinton supporters say they are mostly voting for her, not against him. Trump’s backers are more evenly divided on their motivation: 48% are mostly voting for him; 39% are mostly voting against her. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/52 "2016-07-05T17:37:33Z")
> [@Amateur\_Barbarian](#): > > …By the way, **Elendil’s Heir** , what “untrustworthiness” do you mean that doesn’t stem mostly from 20+ years of GOP smear tactics? Both Clintons have been exonerated on every charge except Bill’s philandering, which (IMHO) is their business, not ours. Setting up a private email server when she _had_ to have known, after her Whitewater experiences, that the press and public would want to see her official emails as Secretary of State - then deleting 30,000 emails before anyone else could see them: [http://www.cbsnews.com/news/report-fbi-pulls-deleted-emails-from-hillary-clintons-server/](http://www.cbsnews.com/news/report-fbi-pulls-deleted-emails-from-hillary-clintons-server/) Lying about landing under fire in Bosnia - her own Brian Williams moment: [https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2016/05/23/recalling-hillary-clintons-claim-of-landing-under-sniper-fire-in-bosnia/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2016/05/23/recalling-hillary-clintons-claim-of-landing-under-sniper-fire-in-bosnia/) Changing the status of a key personal aide and thus permitting a conflict of interest: [http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/19/nyregion/questions-on-the-dual-role-of-a-clinton-aide-persist.html](http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/19/nyregion/questions-on-the-dual-role-of-a-clinton-aide-persist.html) Rewarding an unqualified donor with a State Dept. post: [How Clinton Donor Got on Sensitive Intelligence Board - ABC News](http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/clinton-donor-sensitive-intelligence-board/story?id=39710624) Saying the Clinton Foundation would issue reports to reveal possible conflicts of interest - and then not doing so: [The Clinton Foundation and Conflicts of Interest - The Atlantic](http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/03/hillarys-campaign-is-built-on-a-shaky-foundation/388324/) Politically-advantageous (for her) pardons as Bill left the White House: [Hasidic Clemency Case Entangles Hillary Clinton](http://articles.latimes.com/2001/feb/24/news/mn-29756) I’m a Democrat, and vastly prefer Hillary to Trump, but yeesh, she has problems. ---
**Author:** ![Stuffy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f17d59/32.png) [@Stuffy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stuffy)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/53 "2016-07-05T17:42:58Z")
If I vote it will be an anti-Trump vote. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/54 "2016-07-05T17:44:52Z")
I don’t like Clinton at all. The dynasty aspect is important, but she’s also way to hawkish and tied to Wall Street for my tastes. However, she certainly has the experience and temperament to be a successful president even if I don’t like her policies or her last name. I’d say I’m mostly voting against Trump, since Clinton doesn’t excite me at all and I can’t muster the enthusiasm to campaign for her. But she’s better than just about any Republican - who would only be _more_ hawkish and _more_ beholden to Wall Street than she is. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/55 "2016-07-05T18:15:16Z")
I think I’m fairly well-informed about the job of the President, and there’s one main thing I want from a candidate: a steady hand under fire. Hillary is well-proven on that score. I don’t expect perfection, just the willingness and diligence to work things out. Trump has none of those qualities. Hillary all the way. ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/56 "2016-07-05T19:18:44Z")
Plenty of people don’t get their first choice on the ballot. Happens all the time. It’s fine with me. Hillary is acceptable, and maybe will even be pretty decent as president. But it really doesn’t matter. My choice is Clinton or Trump, and I choose Clinton, regardless of whether that’s based on liking Clinton or hating Trump. ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/57 "2016-07-05T19:24:45Z")
I am solidly Clinton and I am casting my ballot for her. I find it weird when people suggest that she’s part of a dynasty. If Hillary Rodham had married Bill Jones, she still would have been the same ambitious woman that she is today. I expect should would have entered politics eventually as well. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/58 "2016-07-05T19:29:44Z")
> [@dalej42](#): > > I am solidly Clinton and I am casting my ballot for her. I find it weird when people suggest that she’s part of a dynasty. If Hillary Rodham had married Bill Jones, she still would have been the same ambitious woman that she is today. I expect should would have entered politics eventually as well. At Wellesley she was already saying she was going to be the first woman president. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/59 "2016-07-05T19:42:30Z")
No, Clinton is a fine candidate. Looking at the list of GOP losers in the race, there’s maybe only one or two I’d even \*think \*about voting for. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2016, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110/60 "2016-07-05T20:09:00Z")
I’m surprised I’m the first person to say that my primary motivation is neither pro-Hillary nor anti-Trump. It’s anti-Republican-party, and (somewhat less so) pro-Democratic-party. Given the Republican behavior in congress, their anti-intellectualism, the importance of the supreme court, and the generally loathsome nature of the party as a whole, it would take a combination of a once-in-a-century amazing Republican and a once-in-a-century-unacceptable Democrat to get me to vote for a Republican. As it turns out, we do have a once-in-a-century-despicable candidate… but on the Republican side, which just makes an easy decision easier. And I think Clinton is a fine candidate. Not particularly better or worse than, say, John Kerry. So I’ll happily vote for her. And I very much like the idea of a first woman president, although that’s just a fringe benefit. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-planning-to-vote-for-clinton-are-you-really-just-voting-against-trump-s/759110.md?page=4)