# Persons raised Christian: what were you taught about Satan's motives, origins, & destiny? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [December 12, 2010, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909 "2010-12-12T18:39:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2010, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/41 "2010-12-17T02:53:07Z")
So, **Skald** , since you work down there, are you going to reveal which one of us was right? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![tumbleddown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e9bcb4/32.png) [@tumbleddown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tumbleddown)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2010, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/42 "2010-12-17T04:11:06Z")
> [@amarinth](#): > > I was raised protestant (Evangelical Covenant, to be exact): > motives: wanting to spread the misery-maybe? > origins: Lucifer was an archangel who challenged and disobeyed God and was cast from heaven. > destiny: the final end result is to be bound and cast in a lake of fire and subject to everlasting torment for all eternity. These are similar to the basic teachings I received in the Assemblies of God, an evangelical pentecostal denomination. But it was taken even further, Satan (some wouldn’t capitalize the S in order to diminish him) was responsible for suffering and illness, temptation and strife. Satan was constantly at war against Christians, putting stumbling blocks in their paths, trying to shake their belief, and so on. Satan and his fallen angels were the “powers and principalities” in power in this fallen world, and underlying anything that wasn’t **specifically** honoring to God. Secular and Satanic were essentially synonymous; this was especially true of media like television, films and music. If someone’s children were being exceptionally “rebellious” there was always counsel to get rid of the TV (heaven forbid if you had cable!!) and to cull their music collection to rid the home of Satan’s influence. Satan was also the author (in the way of the supernatural inspiration) of every religion and philosophy other than Christianity. In short, Satan was the Biggest and Baddest Big Bad in the history of forever. ---
**Author:** ![EvilTOJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee59a6/32.png) [@EvilTOJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EvilTOJ)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2010, 9:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/43 "2010-12-17T09:53:49Z")
I don’t have a god in this fight, so I can’t really give much info. Most of my information about Satan came from TV and other media outlets, which I’ve always considered wrong in every way. It’s nice to read about how Satan’s been taught to others. ---
**Author:** ![Shirley\_Ujest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shirley\_Ujest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shirley_Ujest)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2010, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/44 "2010-12-17T14:30:23Z")
Raised RCC. Hell wasn’t discussed, that I remember, but LIMBO and Purgatory were BIGGIES. ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2010, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/45 "2010-12-17T15:05:01Z")
I was raised in a non-religious household, but attended the Presbyterian church for a number of years as a member of the choir. Our minister was a Ph.D., very mainstream and judging by looking back, probably quite liberal, and I can’t remember his ever mentioning Satan or even Hell. Satan was a character in the bible stories we were taught in Sunday school (like the serpent in Eden), but these were presented almost like Uncle Remus stories: folk tales. More adult discussions often centered around morality, but the concept of sin was largely a matter of ethical violations rather than breaking the law of God. The idea of the best disciple/student/friend falling from the path of light and becoming a dark rival to the good guy is a standard literary device; contemporary examples include Tolkien’s Melkor/Morgoth and Darth Vader from Star Wars, but you see it everywhere. It’s part of the Worthy Opponent meme so prevalent in fiction. So, I’m wondering. Does the Bible actually mention the whole Lucifer as the greatest angel falling from Grace business, or is that an interpretation/addition that was added later? For example, apparently the name Lucifer (or the Morning Star, Bringer of Light) shows up in a passage of Isaiah, but was actually referring to a great king of Babylon, predicting his spectacular fall, and only conflated with Satan after the time of Jesus. What I’m driving at is that a lot of people here seem to have been raised with the whole story about Lucifer being the number one angel and rebelling against God, resulting in his becoming Satan. But as far as I know, that’s the plot of Milton’s _Paradise Lost_, not doctrine based on the bible. Is there actually biblical support for this story? ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Onimous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ea5d25/32.png) [@Ann\_Onimous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Onimous)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2010, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/46 "2010-12-17T15:31:44Z")
> [@cruel\_butterfly](#): > > I was taught that Lucifer was once the most majestic of God’s angels. At some point before the creation of the Heavens and the Earth, Lucifer began to fancy himself smarter and more powerful than God, and he spearheaded a mutiny against God with the help of some of his celestial cronies. They were soundly defeated and cast out of heaven. Lucifer became Satan; his partners in crime became known as demons. When Christ makes a comeback, Satan and all the demons will be cast into a lake of fire and destroyed forever. Southern Baptist with a little Catholic influence, and this exactly. My pastor was of the mindset that it was hard to preach about Satan and staying away from evil if you didn’t know just who Satan was and what his motives are. ---
**Author:** ![ExTank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2010, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/47 "2010-12-17T23:18:11Z")
I was raised UCC, and Satan was never mentioned. It was a very touchy-feely (emotionally, dammit! get your minds out of the gutter!), “God/Jesus is all about love/peace/harmony/forgiveness” type of church with a good deal of emphasis on community outreach/charity. We sponsored lots of refugees from Asia and Central America. I remeber a Laotian family we sponsored that did quite well here in the states. They were good people. Satan was at best an abstract concept representing Man’s evil. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2010, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/48 "2010-12-17T23:29:30Z")
> [@Oy](#): > > So, I’m wondering. Does the Bible actually mention the whole Lucifer as the greatest angel falling from Grace business, or is that an interpretation/addition that was added later? For example, apparently the name Lucifer (or the Morning Star, Bringer of Light) shows up in a passage of Isaiah, but was actually referring to a great king of Babylon, predicting his spectacular fall, and only conflated with Satan after the time of Jesus. What I’m driving at is that a lot of people here seem to have been raised with the whole story about Lucifer being the number one angel and rebelling against God, resulting in his becoming Satan. But as far as I know, that’s the plot of Milton’s _Paradise Lost_, not doctrine based on the bible. Is there actually biblical support for this story? Not really, beyond what you’ve stated. I’m not sure where the idea of Satan = Lucifer the rebel angel got started, but there’s some info in the old threads [From Where Did Christianity Adopt the “All Powerful” Satan Concept?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=492171) and [Canonical Information on Lucifer/Satan](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=409560), and the Staff Report [What’s the deal with angels?](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2059/whats-the-deal-with-angels) ---
**Author:** ![emmaliminal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7bcc69/32.png) [@emmaliminal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emmaliminal)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2010, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/49 "2010-12-18T00:08:11Z")
> [@Oy](#): > > So, I’m wondering. Does the Bible actually mention the whole Lucifer as the greatest angel falling from Grace business, or is that an interpretation/addition that was added later? For example, apparently the name Lucifer (or the Morning Star, Bringer of Light) shows up in a passage of Isaiah, but was actually referring to a great king of Babylon, predicting his spectacular fall, and only conflated with Satan after the time of Jesus. What I’m driving at is that a lot of people here seem to have been raised with the whole story about Lucifer being the number one angel and rebelling against God, resulting in his becoming Satan. But as far as I know, that’s the plot of Milton’s _Paradise Lost_, not doctrine based on the bible. Is there actually biblical support for this story? Interesting question. [Wikipedia on identifying Satan with Lucifer](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucifer#The_Lucifer_story): > [@](#): > > A myth of the fall of angels, associated with the Morning Star, was transferred to Satan, as seen in the Life of Adam and Eve and the Second Book of Enoch, which the Jewish Encyclopedia attributes to the first pre-Christian century… > > Early Christian writers continued this identification of “Lucifer” with Satan. Tertullian (“Contra Marcionem,” v. 11, 17), Origen (Homilies on Ezekiel 13), and others, identify Lucifer with Satan, who also is represented as being “cast down from heaven” (Revelation 12:7–10; cf. Luke 10:18). > > In the New Testament the Adversary has many names, but “Lucifer” is not among them. … In Luke 10:18, John 12:31, 2. Cor. 6:16, and Rev. 12:9 the fall of Satan is mentioned. … though the New Testament includes the conception that Satan fell from heaven “as lightning” (Luke 10:18; Rev. 12:7-10), it nowhere applies the name Lucifer to him. [On Satan in Christianity](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satan#Christianity): > [@](#): > > …The popularly held beliefs that Satan was once a prideful angel who eventually rebels against God, however, are barely portrayed explicitly in the Bible and are mostly based on inference (e.g., Ezekiel 28 and Isaiah 14:12-17). ---
**Author:** ![Rala](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@Rala](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rala)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/50 "2010-12-20T01:52:46Z")
I was raised in the United Church, a small denomination affiliated with both the Uniting and Baptist churches. Satan’s origin was never discussed in church or by my parents. His motives were to hurt and corrupt human beings, partly to spite God and partly because he just plain hated us. He was doomed from the moment of Jesus’ resurrection - we were given the analogy of a mortally wounded animal that can still attack you even as it’s dying, the pain giving it extra adrenaline - and would be permanently destroyed on the day of Jesus’ return. ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/51 "2010-12-20T04:38:58Z")
To the OP, what kind of answers were you expecting? ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2010, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/52 "2010-12-20T18:43:31Z")
> [@amarinth](#): > > To the OP, what kind of answers were you expecting? I have no agenda and was not expecting any particular answer from persons of any particular faith. May I ask why you ask? ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2010, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/53 "2010-12-25T04:42:22Z")
I was raised United Church of Canada, Canada’s largest Protestant denomination, based on a merger of the Methodist, Presbyterian, and Congregationalist churches, and a very liberal denomination. I can’t remember Satan/Lucifer/the Devil being much mentioned at all, nor Hell for that matter, apart from in certain hymns (and not much even there). There was way more emphasis put on being good than on not being bad. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2010, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/54 "2010-12-25T04:50:19Z")
Raised RCC. I don’t remember the subject coming up at all. This was in the 1970s and 80s, and our religious instruction was very happy-smiley, love-thy-neighbour stuff, and the rest was the mechanics of the Church like what Lent and Advent and the sacraments ands tuff were all about (I still don’t remember which is Lent and which is Advent.) There just wasn’t much fire and brimstone in our version. ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2010, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/55 "2010-12-25T05:35:10Z")
Lapsed Jehovah’s Witness here. Satan (we never called him Lucifer) is an angel that just can’t accept that God is deserving of worship. Very, very jealous, I guess. He tries to get mankind to turn against God because that’s what he likes doing. Strangely, he never insists that people should worship him, just that they should disobey God’s commandments. His demons were not with him at the beginning. His demons are the angels that noticed how awfully cute the daughters of men were around Noah’s time. They came down to earth and made little demon babies with these girls. These babies became big giant jerks that pushed people around. The jerks were called Nephilim (sp?) When the flood came, the Nephilim died with everyone else, and the partying angels went back to heaven, but God threw all their stuff out on the lawn. So they all went to live with Satan. And they have to do what Satan tells them because he’s their landlord, I guess. This isn’t exactly how it was told to me, but that’s basically the idea. I was intrigued by the comment earlier that angels couldn’t possess people like demons can. More likely angels can possess people. They just don’t because it’s rude. No, probably it’s against God’s rules. God gives everyone free will, BUT YOU MUST OBEY HIM ABSOLUTELY AND UNQUESTIONINGLY AT ALL TIMES!!! I can see Satan having a point about the value of rebelling. ---
**Author:** ![Claverhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/13edae/32.png) [@Claverhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claverhouse)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2010, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/56 "2010-12-26T00:03:32Z")
Anglican. I can affirm that at no point was his Highness mentioned. The C of E doesn’t really ‘_do_’ evil. Or much else, really. [On the other hand, I was given a real palm cross in Sunday School at the age of six.] ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2010, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/57 "2010-12-26T00:13:29Z")
I was raised in both Catholic and Southern Baptist traditons (Catholic father, Baptist mother, Catholic scools, Baptist sunday school and church services). The Catholics didn’t talk much about Satan at all, and weren’t really concerned with him, although I guess he was acknowledged as a rebellious angel who would get his in the end. The Baptists adored Satan and would talk about him incessently. He was God’s favorite angel who had turned on God, been cast out, etc. and now was engaged in a sort of soul collecting competition. All evil thoughts were caused by Satan. He was a tempter. Jesus was on on side of the heart, the Devil on another, and you had to always make sure you listened to the Jesus side. the Devil is a slick talker so you have to watch out. The Devil can even quote scripture to trick you. Demons are real and can possess you. The Devil is very much a real entity to them, and they see him as lying behind all evil. They also blame him for their own sins a lot. ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2010, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/58 "2010-12-26T13:51:56Z")
My brother’s boss, who is a member of one of the charismatic sects that basically say “Worship God and you will become rich” believes that every time one of the vehemently homophobic preachers/politicians gets caught with his pants down, it’s because Satan specifically targeted him for because he was so good. From this, I gather that Satan is both real and very personal in their religion, just as **Diogenes** described with the Southern Baptists. ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2010, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/59 "2010-12-26T18:21:27Z")
> [@cruel\_butterfly](#): > > I was taught that Lucifer was once the most majestic of God’s angels. At some point before the creation of the Heavens and the Earth, Lucifer began to fancy himself smarter and more powerful than God, and he spearheaded a mutiny against God with the help of some of his celestial cronies. They were soundly defeated and cast out of heaven. Lucifer became Satan; his partners in crime became known as demons. When Christ makes a comeback, Satan and all the demons will be cast into a lake of fire and destroyed forever. > > That’s what I’ve always been told anyway. I have no idea where this story came from. I heard that too, in the Baptist church. They loved to terrify the congregation with tales of hell and eternal torment as well. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2010, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909/60 "2010-12-27T01:35:28Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > Lucifer was the most glorious of angels, and pride was his downfall. Like this, but also some stuff about him enjoying gambling and playing a saxaphone 🙂 Raised universialist: Lucifer had too much pride, and decided he was better than God, so he tried to take over. This failed badly and he was cast out of heaven, and ultimately took over the dominion of evil. Because he’s jealous of God loving people more, he’s made it his mission to turn humans away from God by tempting them into disobedience. Some, like Jesus, are able to resist, and others are not. Eventually good people who accept God will be wisked away to paradise, and everyone else stays on earth, where the devil will rule for 1,000 years. During that time period, people who repent will be rescued too. (they never said how this will work re: lifespan and reproduction. that’s always bothered me.) Eventually at the end of the 1,000 years, there will be a great battle between God’s chosen (jews, and virgins no less) and the devil. The devil will lose and be cast into hell. It will then be judgment day, and the dead shall all rise to make an account of themselves. Those who refuse to accept the light of God’s love - and most current non-believers are hoped to be convinced once they stand before God - will simply cease to exist (which doesn’t seem to be such a bad punishment since that’s what atheists think is going to happen after they die anyway) rather than join the devil in hell. Kumbaya my lord, Kumbaya… The End [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/persons-raised-christian-what-were-you-taught-about-satans-motives-origins-destiny/563909.md?page=4)