# Pete Hoekstra **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 6, 2012, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939 "2012-02-06T05:00:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2012, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/262 "2012-02-17T04:18:04Z")
Funny that everyone knows Willie Horton, who here remembers [Angel Medrano](http://articles.latimes.com/1988-10-22/news/mn-289_1_ad-campaigns)? CMC fnord! ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2012, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/263 "2012-02-17T05:25:12Z")
Pete Hoekstra is bringing out the big guns. Yes, he has drafted Herman Cain [to come campaign with him](http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2012/02/herman_cain_to_join_pete_hoeks.html). Because Herman Cain? Proven winner. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2012, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/264 "2012-02-18T13:20:20Z")
Closing out an earlier question, the actress has now apologized. > [@](#): > > “I am deeply sorry for any pain that the character I portrayed brought to my communities,” Chan wrote on her Facebook page, as first reported by the Angry Asian Man blog. “As a recent college grad who has spent time working to improve communities and empower those without a voice, this role is not in any way representative of who I am. It was absolutely a mistake on my part and one that, over time, I hope can be forgiven. I feel horrible about my participation and I am determined to resolve my actions.” ---
**Author:** ![Harborwolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Harborwolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harborwolf)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2012, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/265 "2012-02-20T00:19:20Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Because of the appearance of racism is something any decent American would avoid. The appearance of racism is something any decent american would avoid. Something about that I just don’t like. The way it tosses aside actual intent in favor of the simple appearance of something unpleasant. Doesn’t matter what was meant. Just what it looks like. Seems to suggest that one need not dig deeper or think more. The surface is enough. The “decent Americans” bit doesn’t help. Classic “us vs. them” there. There’s “decent americans” and then there’s…indecent americans. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2012, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/266 "2012-02-20T00:33:39Z")
Because cheap as hypocrisy is, it matters. If someone is, at heart, a racist but feels social constraints that forbid his free expression, so much the better. At least he knows that much, that his views are no longer acceptable for American society at large. Of course sincerity is the ideal. Failing that, grudging compliance will have to do. ---
**Author:** ![Harborwolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Harborwolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harborwolf)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2012, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/267 "2012-02-20T00:40:19Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Because cheap as hypocrisy is, it matters. If someone is, at heart, a racist but feels social constraints that forbid his free expression, so much the better. At least he knows that much, that his views are no longer acceptable for American society at large. > > Of course sincerity is the ideal. Failing that, grudging compliance will have to do. So we must root out anything that even appears to be racist. Whether or not the person or act in question is racist be damned. And don’t go thinking too hard about that sir or madam. Just go ahead and let that knee jerk as much as it wants. It’s better for society as a whole if they are protected from the appearance of dangerous ideas. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2012, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/268 "2012-02-20T02:31:01Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Yes, that’s what they said upthread. How it could be surprising that I live in the US because I don’t know a quote from a movie I’ve never seen, I don’t know. You’re a Russian spy aren’t you? > [@](#): > > I’m not getting how context can influence whether or not something is racist. Well, you say it later on but it seems to be designed to appeal to the racist elements in that area. > [@curlcoat](#): > > For example, I haven’t seen any of the Matrix movies, so if you all come up with a meme from that one, I’m not likely to recognize that either. Oh shit, you really ARE a Russian spy. > [@](#): > > So the attitude that only an idiot or closet racist wouldn’t see that ad for what it is (“yellow peril”, “I love you long time” and all that) seems kind of dumb considering that this board goes all over the world. I don’t think the extent of the racism would be obvious to everyone but I don’t think I would go “well, gee why would anyone ever have a problem with that” either. > [@](#): > > Tho, even knowing that stuff now I don’t see it as racist, but I do see it as trying to get already racist voters there to go with Hoekstra. I kinda see that as racist. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2012, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/269 "2012-02-20T02:54:27Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Oh shit, you really ARE a Russian spy. No, I just don’t have that much interest in watching movies. When I do, I prefer comedies or scifi. Matrix is sort of scifi, but since my husband hasn’t brought that one home (I can’t do movie theaters any more) I haven’t seen it. > [@](#): > > I don’t think the extent of the racism would be obvious to everyone but I don’t think I would go “well, gee why would anyone ever have a problem with that” either. Neither would I since I’m well aware that there are folks out there that are ready to yell “racist!” at anything. > [@](#): > > I kinda see that as racist. What you quoted I said? Why? ---
**Author:** ![What\_the](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f4b2a3/32.png) [@What\_the](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_the)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2012, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/270 "2012-02-20T12:36:42Z")
Yesterday I saw a Vonage commercial and the Indians sounded like… wait for it… Indians. Or were they Pakistani? ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2012, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/271 "2012-02-20T14:01:23Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Not seeing any racism. They show what is supposed to be a Chinese girl in China. and a very attractive, likable one at that. And as others have pointed out, her imperfect English makes sense in that context. I think the ad is pretty intelligent in how it makes its point, and the production values are way better than the vast majority of political ads. It is racist because the Chinese chick is so much more attractive than the bald guy that comes after. It’s horrible stereotyping of white males that they have to be portrayed so ugly, like Asian chicks are supposed to be some kind of Ubermench. Well perhaps they are. Otherwise a good ad. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2012, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/272 "2012-02-20T14:59:03Z")
> [@What\_the](#): > > Yesterday I saw a Vonage commercial and the Indians sounded like… wait for it… Indians. Or were they Pakistani? Were they talking about taking jobs away from white people like Ma Bell? ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2012, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/273 "2012-02-20T15:37:49Z")
> [@What\_the](#): > > Yesterday I saw a Vonage commercial and the Indians sounded like… wait for it… Indians. Or were they Pakistani? A few years ago I saw a very intellectual stimulating American teenage film about some college students travelling Europe. Tasting various beverages on the way. I’m sure everybody can imagine my horror and shock when the group of very nice young blonde and well-endowed ladies described as Danish turned out to be in fact speaking Swedish. American racist filmmakers can’t even be bothered to know the difference between the different Scandinavian countries and cultures, thinking we’re all alike. Very hurtful. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2012, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/274 "2012-02-20T15:50:57Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > No, I just don’t have that much interest in watching movies. When I do, I prefer comedies or scifi. Matrix is sort of scifi, but since my husband hasn’t brought that one home (I can’t do movie theaters any more) I haven’t seen it. You can’t fool me, you’re just waiting for Putin to reconstitute the USSR. 🙂 > [@](#): > > Neither would I since I’m well aware that there are folks out there that are ready to yell “racist!” at anything. And that’s what you think this is? A baseless kneejerk reaction by people who look for reasons to accuse others of racism? I don’t think we’re going to have to agree to disagree on this. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2012, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/275 "2012-02-20T15:53:38Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > A few years ago I saw a very intellectual stimulating American teenage film about some college students travelling Europe. Tasting various beverages on the way. I’m sure everybody can imagine my horror and shock when the group of very nice young blonde and well-endowed ladies described as Danish turned out to be in fact speaking Swedish. American racist filmmakers can’t even be bothered to know the difference between the different Scandinavian countries and cultures, thinking we’re all alike. Very hurtful. They were probably speaking Swedish so nobody would think they were Danish. ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2012, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/276 "2012-02-20T15:58:33Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > They were probably speaking Swedish so nobody would think they were Danish. That’s like pretending to be a dead bloated pestilence carrying sewer rat so nobody would think you’re an ermine. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2012, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/277 "2012-02-20T17:37:41Z")
Oh, no doubt! If I met some hot, shapely blonde women but then found out they were Swedish, I would be like, totally, _ewww_! gross! ---
**Author:** ![Rune](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e68b1a/32.png) [@Rune](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rune)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2012, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/278 "2012-02-20T17:53:00Z")
Understandable so. Who wouldn’t. ---
**Author:** ![What\_the](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f4b2a3/32.png) [@What\_the](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_the)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/279 "2012-02-21T12:45:36Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Were they talking about taking jobs away from white people like Ma Bell? Does it matter? Is the argument about racism or content? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/280 "2012-02-21T21:20:09Z")
> [@Harborwolf](#): > > So we must root out anything that even appears to be racist. […] It’s better for society as a whole if they are protected from the appearance of dangerous ideas. “Avoid”, not “root out”. Why is that even controversial? Why would anybody **want** to appear to be racist if they’re not? Racist behavior isn’t “dangerous ideas”, it’s just gratuitous dickishness. Anybody who thinks that they ought to be able to ignore the racist connotations of certain words and actions and be given the benefit of the doubt for it, on the grounds that they **might** not **personally** be a racist, is a self-absorbed wanker with an overdeveloped sense of entitlement. For instance, I personally happen to think the nickname “Sambo” sounds kind of cute, irrespective of its historical racial connotations. But when I meet with an African-American student of mine named Sam, I don’t call him “Sambo”. Not because I’m smotheringly trying to “protect him from the appearance of dangerous ideas”, but just because I’m not a dick. ---
**Author:** ![Harborwolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Harborwolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harborwolf)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2012, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939/281 "2012-02-22T02:33:00Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > “Avoid”, not “root out”. Why is that even controversial? Why would anybody **want** to appear to be racist if they’re not? In the line quoted, the phrase “grudging compliance” was used. To me that indicates at least coerced avoidance. And supposing we’re talking about unintentional racism, would the best approach be to point and shout “RACIST” at the top of ones lungs? > [@](#): > > Racist behavior isn’t “dangerous ideas”, it’s just gratuitous dickishness. Anybody who thinks that they ought to be able to ignore the racist connotations of certain words and actions and be given the benefit of the doubt for it, on the grounds that they **might** not **personally** be a racist, is a self-absorbed wanker with an overdeveloped sense of entitlement. So what in this commercial is racist? The rather light accent? The bike? Are we to give an asian woman a swedish accent and have her come down in a jet pack to avoid any and all racial sensitivities? > [@](#): > > For instance, I personally happen to think the nickname “Sambo” sounds kind of cute, irrespective of its historical racial connotations. But when I meet with an African-American student of mine named Sam, I don’t call him “Sambo”. > > Not because I’m smotheringly trying to “protect him from the appearance of dangerous ideas”, but just because I’m not a dick. What in the commercial we’re discussing is the equal of “sambo?” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pete-hoekstra/611939.md?page=15)