# Pharmacist refuses to fill prescription for abortion pill on moral grounds **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 4, 2004, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515 "2004-02-04T17:52:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/221 "2004-02-12T17:40:43Z")
According to [CNN](http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/Southwest/02/12/pharmacy.firing.ap/index.html) all three pharmacists involved with this incident were fired. Eckard’s has a policy in place that states that “pharmacists are not allowed to opt out of filling a prescription for religious, moral or ethical reasons.” The pharmacist in question claims that he was not aware of this policy. Shoulda read the fine print, shitbird. Haj ---
**Author:** ![tiny\_ham](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a183cd/32.png) [@tiny\_ham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tiny_ham)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/222 "2004-02-12T17:42:29Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > Holy Christ. Please tell me you didn’t just suggest that the yahoos on those boards are your definition of “most Christians”. No shit. It makes me wonder why I even keep TRYING to do the things I do, speaking out, voting, debating and FIGHTING with family and friends. Why it’s…It’s almost like…I have to battle against a preconceived stereotype to assure people that we are all individuals with varying styles of worship and faith. Thank God gobear has no experience in that or else he may think twice of trashing an entire group of people. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/223 "2004-02-12T17:42:49Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > Holy Christ. Please tell me you didn’t just suggest that the yahoos on those boards are your definition of “most Christians”. It’s a matter of numbers, the yahoos outnumber the reasonable Christians. Notice how the Episcopal church suffered a schism over the appointment of a gay bishop? And that’s the moderate wing of American Christianity–the further right one goes, the more the pendulum swings away from reason and towards unreasoning hate. I’m under no illusions that the great majority of Christians wwant peace and amity with gay folks or that they would fellowship with gay people. Sure, somne Dopers belong to gay-friendly congregations, but that’s a tiny minority in the body of Christ. ---
**Author:** ![beagledave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6de8d8/32.png) [@beagledave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beagledave)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/224 "2004-02-12T17:48:14Z")
> [@Binarydrone](#): > > **beagledave** , not to stir the pot here but I do have a question for you. While I think that it is obvious that _all_ Christians are not one way or another (they are, after all humans with all of the differences that this implies), I wonder if you would consider the following statement debatable: > > Resolved: when you look at the interaction of Christianity as a group upon progressive social issues (for example Gay rights, Women’s rights, advancement of scientific research for its own sake to name a few), the overall trend seems to be one of attempting to block, if not turn back advances made in these areas for the groups involved. Are you asking a) Are Christians pretty much all (or “mostly”…giggle) sheep who have to call up their pastor before making a decision? or b) Are Christians, as a group, more socially conservative than the rest of the country? You don’t seem to be addressing point A, **which is what gobear was saying** …and what I was objecting to. Point B is a different argument, and one that I was NOT objecting to or replying to in my post…so it doesn’t have anything to do with my post. ---
**Author:** ![tiny\_ham](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a183cd/32.png) [@tiny\_ham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tiny_ham)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/225 "2004-02-12T17:48:59Z")
So because the good outnumber the bad, we’re all bad? It’s just not possible for you to say “SOME Christians are off their rocker?” Only one brush in the paintbox m’dear? Just want to get it straight. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/226 "2004-02-12T17:51:39Z")
> [@jarbabyj](#): > > No shit. It makes me wonder why I even keep TRYING to do the things I do, speaking out, voting, debating and FIGHTING with family and friends. > > Why it’s…It’s almost like…I have to battle against a preconceived stereotype to assure people that we are all individuals with varying styles of worship and faith. Thank God gobear has no experience in that or else he may think twice of trashing an entire group of people. :rolleyes: Since when does “most” mean “an entire group of people”? I think that it fair to say that a majority of professed Christians harbor some sort of anti-gay feelings. If that wasn’t true, why would you have to spend so much time speaking out, voting, debating, blah, blah, blah. I said “a majority”, not “all”, not even “almost all.” A majority. Haj ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/227 "2004-02-12T17:52:46Z")
> [@](#): > > Why it’s…It’s almost like…I have to battle against a preconceived stereotype to assure people that we are all individuals with varying styles of worship and faith. Thank God gobear has no experience in that or else he may think twice of trashing an entire group of people. And again I am accused of “trashing an entire group of people.” Don’t you guys ever tire of blatant dishonesty in lying about my posts? I acknowledged the existence of pro-gay Christians, but if you think that the churches are run by pro-gay folks, think again. I point you again to the Episcopal schism, to the crowds protesting gay marriage, to the unreasoning bigotry of most Christians against gay people. It would be nice to beleive that Christians are largely kind and open to gay folks, but I’d have to deny the evidence I see every day to do so. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/228 "2004-02-12T17:55:05Z")
> [@](#): > > So because the good outnumber the bad, we’re all bad? It’s just not possible for you to say “SOME Christians are off their rocker?” Only one brush in the paintbox m’dear? But I said the reverse–the bad outnumber the good. You are a tiny, miniscule minority in the church. Anti-gay folks are in the majority. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/229 "2004-02-12T17:57:03Z")
> [@](#): > > - > > Instead of admitting that some embryonic development occurs in the time frame I mentioned AND admitting that a blastocyst IS an embryo…you dodge and weave. Is it really that hard to admit you’re wrong on those 2 biological points (which AGAIN, have fucking NOTHING to do with the MAP)? > > I guess for you…it is. > > * * * > > [deep breath] > > Ok, you got me on the embryonic development part, Beagle, I was wrong and I shouldn’t have shot my mouth off. > \*\* > [@](#): > > Morning After Pill (AKA emergency contraception) is a high dose of plain old birth control pills. It works by 3 possible methods: 1) delaying ovulation, 2) preventing fertilization, or 3) **potentially preventing a zygote from implanting in the womb (thus, if MAP worked, you’d never get a positive pregnancy test). The 3rd method is what bothers some people.** > [@](#): > > Some BCs work by suppressing ovulation. Some work by creating a “hostile environment” in the uterus **such that a fertilized egg cannot implant. And that very type are being sold right now!!!** > [@](#): > > Example: A girl is on ortho and for whatever reason doesn’t take her pill for three days. She has sex, implantation occurs and the next morning takes three pills. Same result. > Is this an abortion? If you think yes, then I’d have to conclude that you are as morally opposed to ortho being available as you are the MAP or an 11th week abortion. > [@](#): > > According to the full prescribing information for Ortho Tri-Cyclen, birth control pills work in three different ways. They do inhibit ovulation, if taken daily. They also thicken the cervical mucus, making it harder for sperm to enter the uterus. Finally, and most significantly for our discussion, they make the endometrial lining of the uterus hostile for implantation; **if an egg is fertilized (after all, these things aren’t perfect and neither are the people using them), it can’t implant itself in the endometrium.** Feel free to ignore this. Again. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Binarydrone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3da27b/32.png) [@Binarydrone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Binarydrone)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/230 "2004-02-12T17:59:19Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > …It would be nice to beleive that Christians are largely kind and open to gay folks, but I’d have to deny the evidence I see every day to do so. So, you’re saying that each and every human being on the planet that claims to be a Christian is bad, right? Oh, oh! How about next we nitpick all of the words of your posts and take them out of context while ignoring the obvious meaning behind them! Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee! ---
**Author:** ![mouthbreather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a698b9/32.png) [@mouthbreather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mouthbreather)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/231 "2004-02-12T18:00:09Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > According to [CNN](http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/Southwest/02/12/pharmacy.firing.ap/index.html), the pharmacist has been fired 🙂 Good for Eckerd. ---
**Author:** ![beagledave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6de8d8/32.png) [@beagledave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beagledave)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/232 "2004-02-12T18:11:25Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > It would be nice to beleive that Christians are largely kind and open to gay folks, but I’d have to deny the evidence I see every day to do so. It’s almost as if my objection to your post had anything to do with gay rights and attitudes of Christians towards same…because then that would make your point almost coherent. Of course, my post had nothing to do with that. It had to do with your characterization of Christians (oops “most” Christians…giggle) as sheep who have to call their pastor before making a decision of any consequence. But don’t let that stop you from your “being angry” and stuff. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/233 "2004-02-12T19:03:26Z")
> [@](#): > > - Originally posted by Binarydrone\*So, you’re saying that each and every human being on the planet that claims to be a Christian is bad, right? No, that’s NOT what I said, but why let the truth get in the way of having a hysterical defensive snit? If I say, “There are some well-intentioned Christians, but they are way outnumbered by the bad ones,” and you read it as “ALL CHRISTIANS ARE BAD!”, then there’s no way for us to have any meaningful communication. > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Beagledave_ > It had to do with your characterization of Christians (oops “most” Christians…giggle) as sheep who have to call their pastor before making a decision of any consequence. Hey, if those folks were capable of independent thinking in the first place, they wouldn’t buy into that pernicious mythology. In any event, I didn’t invent the quote or the news story–Now maybe I have it all wrong, and Christians in the US are almost all critical thinkers who are passionate advocates of logic and reason in decision-making and who would never dream of forcing their religious choices on non-Christians, but I doubt it. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/13edae/32.png) [@Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Cheatem_Undhow)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/234 "2004-02-12T19:17:53Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > You want to know what most Christians think? Toddle down to [Raptureready.com](http://Raptureready.com). [Christianforums.com](http://Christianforums.com), or [BaptistBoard.com](http://BaptistBoard.com) and see exactly how accepting most Christians are of the modern world. :rolleyes: Shall we start turning to the Earth Liberation Front to find out what most environmentalists think? Shall we start turning to PETA to find out what most vegetarians think? Good Lord, **gobear** , this is one of the most pig-ignorant things you’ve ever posted. You really ought to stop taking your cues on Christianity from nutbar websites. Try poking your head into a few local churches of varying denominational stripes on Sunday morning and see how the real deal operates. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/235 "2004-02-12T19:31:06Z")
> [@](#): > > Good Lord, gobear, this is one of the most pig-ignorant things you’ve ever posted. You really ought to stop taking your cues on Christianity from nutbar websites. Try poking your head into a few local churches of varying denominational stripes on Sunday morning and see how the real deal operates. Oh please! I used to BE a Christian–prayer meetings, Bible study, church on Sunday, all of it steeped in bigotry against gay people. I know what the heck I’m talking about. But the other folks here are good, decent people fooling themselves that every Christian is as kind and as reasonable as they are; that somehow there are no yahoo Christians, that there are no fundies trying to force a Constitutional amendment to ban gay marriage, no Christian groups attempt to force legislation to madate creationism in schools, that no Christian group of any size opposes these things, and that any demonstrations to the contrary must be the work of a few lone individuals. Yeah, right. ---
**Author:** ![Binarydrone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3da27b/32.png) [@Binarydrone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Binarydrone)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/236 "2004-02-12T19:35:38Z")
[QUOTE=gobear] No, that’s NOT what I said, but why let the truth get in the way of having a hysterical defensive snit? If I say, “There are some well-intentioned Christians, but they are way outnumbered by the bad ones,” and you read it as “ALL CHRISTIANS ARE BAD!”, then there’s no way for us to have any meaningful communication… [QUOTE] I just want to make sure that you know that I was joking. I do get what you meant, and agree with you. Perhaps I should have put in some emoticon. ---
**Author:** ![Homebrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Homebrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homebrew)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/237 "2004-02-12T20:27:23Z")
Shit, Dewey, we don’t have to go to the message boards to find idiot Christians. Let’s just look at what the biggest demoninations have to say. Do I even need to quote the Pope and several of the Bishops. I’m certain you’re aware of the problems in the Episcopal Church. Further, we can read the official positions from the [Southern Baptists](http://www.sbc.net/aboutus/pssexuality.asp), [Assemblies of God](http://ag.org/top/beliefs/position_papers/4181_homosexuality.cfm) or, even, the more moderate [Methodists](http://www.umc.org/interior.asp?ptid=1&mid=1324). You’re asking for a whole lotta slack for us to accept that Christianity in general is accepting of us. > [@](#): > > _Methodist Book of Discipline_ > [W]e do not condone the practice of homosexuality and consider this practice incompatible with Christian teaching. > > _Southern Baptist Convention Statement of Principles_ > We affirm God’s plan for marriage and sexual intimacy – one man, and one woman, for life. Homosexuality is not a “valid alternative lifestyle.” The Bible condemns it as sin. > > _Official Assemblies of God Position Paper_ > We believe, in the light of biblical revelation, that the growing cultural acceptance of homosexual identity and behavior, male and female, is symptomatic of a broader spiritual disorder that threatens the family, the government, and the church. This paper is a brief exposition of salient biblical teachings on this subject. > > Homosexual Behavior Is Sin. ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/238 "2004-02-12T20:37:50Z")
> [@This Year's Model](#): > > They all three got [canned](http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/Southwest/02/12/pharmacy.firing.ap/index.html). Oh, I thought you said they got _caned_.😉 > [@](#): > > “I went in the back room and briefly prayed about it,” said Herr, who had worked for Eckerd for five years. “I actually called my pastor … and asked him what he thought about it.” What a fucking loser. Sounds like a real-life Ned Flanders, except more sanctimonious. “I’ll be with you in a minute ma’am - I have to go call my pastor.” Ugh. He needs to jump-start the atrophied mass of grey matter up there. ---
**Author:** ![tiny\_ham](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a183cd/32.png) [@tiny\_ham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tiny_ham)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/239 "2004-02-12T20:52:15Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > Oh please! I used to BE a Christian–prayer meetings, Bible study, church on Sunday, all of it steeped in bigotry against gay people. I know what the heck I’m talking about. > > But the other folks here are good, decent people fooling themselves that every Christian is as kind and as reasonable as they are; that somehow there are no yahoo Christians, that there are no fundies trying to force a Constitutional amendment to ban gay marriage, no Christian groups attempt to force legislation to madate creationism in schools, that no Christian group of any size opposes these things, and that any demonstrations to the contrary must be the work of a few lone individuals. > > Yeah, right. Oh for the love of PETE. :rolleyes: It is precisely because I DO believe there are Christian nutballs that I raise a stink. I KNOW there are crazy fundies out there who believe social security numbers are the mark of the beast, and who actively HATE homosexuals and try to ban all abortions. There are Christians who think dancing is a sin, who won’t cut their hair, who demand that women wear hats and remain silent in the church. I AM NOT ONE OF THEM, nor is my family or the non-denominational church to which we belong. What i have in common with those people is ONE thing. I believe in the divinity of Jesus Christ. From there, Christians branch off into a giant, trillion limbed tree. It is precisely because of this tree that when I see you cite [RAPTUREREADY.COM](http://RAPTUREREADY.COM) as “most christians” I go bonkers. But if it makes you feel better to think that I’m working against you via my faith, go ahead. I’ve typed “we’re not all like that” more times than I can count on this board. ---
**Author:** ![beagledave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6de8d8/32.png) [@beagledave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beagledave)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2004, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515/240 "2004-02-12T21:03:35Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > Hey, if those folks were capable of independent thinking in the first place, they wouldn’t buy into that pernicious mythology. . Since Polycarp, tomndebb, Jodi, Bricker, myself and dozens/hundreds of other Christian dopers “buy into that mythology” I assume you think that we are ALL “incapable of independent thinking”. right? And add Zev and other believing doper Jews to the list as well. (I’m not as familiar with followers of other faiths…but add them as well) Do we have you on the record as saying that all of the above dopers are **incapable of independent thought?** (This has nothing to do with attitudes towards gays or social policy…just strictly a theistic belief. You have equated theistic belief with an inability to independently think) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pharmacist-refuses-to-fill-prescription-for-abortion-pill-on-moral-grounds/227515.md?page=13)