# Physicists Phreak Out. Pioneer Probes SLOWING DOWN! Newslink **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [January 31, 2008, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652 "2008-01-31T00:11:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/1 "2008-01-31T00:11:10Z")
The laws of Physics seem to be wrong. [http://planetary.org/programs/projects/pioneer\_anomaly/](http://planetary.org/programs/projects/pioneer_anomaly/) > [@](#): > > Something strange is happening in the outer reaches of our solar system. The Pioneer 10 and 11 spacecraft are not where they are supposed to be. These missions, launched in 1972 and 1973, have covered hundreds of millions of kilometers, heading toward the edge of our solar system. But something is holding them back. Each year, they fall behind in their projected travel by about 5,000 kilometers (3,000 miles). > > Jet Propulsion Laboratory scientist John Anderson and his colleagues have been searching for an explanation since 1980. But as of yet, they have found nothing conclusive; no spacecraft behavior or previously unknown property of the outer solar system can explain the deceleration of the Pioneer spacecraft. Scientists are being forced to consider the unthinkable: something may be wrong with our understanding of the laws of physics. An important line of inquiry will be to study mounds of Doppler (velocity) data and spacecraft status data (like temperatures) that have been unavailable to researchers—but that is about to change. OO-Kaaaaayyyy… ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/2 "2008-01-31T00:22:49Z")
[QUOTE=Bosda Di’Chi of Tricor] OO-Kaaaaayyyy… [/QUOTE] Just be glad it’s a “Pioneer Anomaly” rather than a “Deimos Anomaly.” The latter could doom us all! ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/3 "2008-01-31T00:24:48Z")
They probably just realized they left the bathwater running or something. ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/4 "2008-01-31T00:50:13Z")
It’s little anomalies like this that often lead to new laws of physics or the extension of the old ones into new realms. Maybe we can get flying cars or a new power source out of this… ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/5 "2008-01-31T00:52:43Z")
See? You can’t just write off FTL and the like because it doesn’t fit the laws of physics. _Physics_ doesn’t fit the laws of physics! ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/6 "2008-01-31T00:56:14Z")
They’re getting bogged down in the first few, softish layers of the sky dome. Wait until they hit the hard bit… ---
**Author:** ![beowulff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beowulff/32/542_2.png) [@beowulff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beowulff)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/7 "2008-01-31T01:35:43Z")
Just _wait_ until they hit the energy barrier at the edge of the Solar System… ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/8 "2008-01-31T02:09:23Z")
Obviously being pelted with cosmic rays. When it gets back, it wil be filled with people who can stretch incredible distances, turn invisible, burst into flame, and are surly, powerful, and covered with pottery shards. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/9 "2008-01-31T02:18:43Z")
[QUOTE=Bosda Di’Chi of Tricor] The laws of Physics seem to be wrong. [http://planetary.org/programs/projects/pioneer\_anomaly/](http://planetary.org/programs/projects/pioneer_anomaly/) OO-Kaaaaayyyy… [/QUOTE] :: lights cigarette, takes long drag, & exhales while stroking long-haird cat :: For the record, I have nothing to do with this. Even if I did, it would absolutely not part of any plan I have retrieve certain materials the probe in question may or may not have encountered on its mission. Even if it was part of such a plan, it’s certainly not because those materials are useful in any sort of long-distance mind control/weather domination/Nell McAndrews disrobing device I am building. And even if I were building such a device, it would not be for any sort of world conquest scheme. Anything you read to the contrary in the Daily Planet is a vicious lie, and anyone who repeats that libel shall be [del]stung tovdeath by mutant bees eaten alive by winged monkeys [/del] hearing from my lawyers. ---
**Author:** ![Kythereia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e8c25b/32.png) [@Kythereia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kythereia)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/10 "2008-01-31T02:33:54Z")
Wee Betelgeusian: “Look! It’s the human spacecraft!” Other wee Betelgeusian: “Can we go out and play, Dad? Can we can we can we?” Betelgeusian dad: “Oh, all right. But be back in time in for gnoosop or it’s the Death Ray for you!” ---
**Author:** ![Santo\_Rugger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Santo\_Rugger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Santo_Rugger)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/11 "2008-01-31T02:43:52Z")
> [@](#): > > Each year, they fall behind in their projected travel by about 5,000 kilometers (3,000 miles). Sounds like a miscalculation of initial velocity to me, and not a deceleration. An error of .5 mph would give this result. If it was a deceleration, the number would grow every year. ---
**Author:** ![A.R.Cane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ee7513/32.png) [@A.R.Cane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A.R.Cane)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/12 "2008-01-31T02:45:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Jet Propulsion Laboratory scientist John Anderson and his colleagues have been searching for an explanation since 1980. Well, Rod Serling died in 1975, maybe it just took them awhile to pick up on it. ---
**Author:** ![Apocalypso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@Apocalypso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apocalypso)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/13 "2008-01-31T03:11:54Z")
Dammit! :mad: I dunno if I should still plan on going ahead with my plans to have my body shot into space when I die… The theory is (or was) that eventually some alien civilization may happen upon it, track it down to this planet, come here and suck up all of our resources and use us for food. I realize this is a long shot, but what the hell. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/14 "2008-01-31T04:18:52Z")
[QUOTE=Santo Rugger] Sounds like a miscalculation of initial velocity to me, and not a deceleration. An error of .5 mph would give this result. If it was a deceleration, the number would grow every year. [/QUOTE] you’re assuming the deceleration is a constant - perhaps its sputniking? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/15 "2008-01-31T04:32:35Z")
Why would it decelerate, anyway? There’s no force there to act on it. ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/16 "2008-01-31T05:10:30Z")
[QUOTE=Really Not All That Bright] Why would it decelerate, anyway? There’s no force there to act on it. [/QUOTE] _How do we know?!?_ There could be… anything… out there in the cold and dark, far from the warmth of the sun. Anything. Even now, it could be plotting its return to the golden spaces of the Inner System, from which it was banished billions of years ago. We must be on guard. :: shades eyes :: I’ll be over here. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 5:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/17 "2008-01-31T05:33:05Z")
Laws? I’ve always thought of them more as guidelines. ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/18 "2008-01-31T05:37:03Z")
Here an interesting article from a few years ago. [13 things that do not make sense.](http://space.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=mg18524911.600) The Pioneer problems are item #8, although they say the probe was speeding up, not slowing down. ---
**Author:** ![mks57](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b9bd4f/32.png) [@mks57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mks57)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/19 "2008-01-31T06:34:08Z")
[QUOTE=Santo Rugger] Sounds like a miscalculation of initial velocity to me, and not a deceleration. An error of .5 mph would give this result. If it was a deceleration, the number would grow every year. [/QUOTE] I don’t think so. JPL’s Deep Space Network can make very accurate measurements of range (distance) and range rate (doppler/velocity) by transmitting a coded signal to the spacecraft that is retransmitted by the spacecraft. Sort of the radio version of a mirror. Comparing the transmitted and received signals allows the ground station to measure the round-trip propagation delay and doppler shift. The Pioneer spacecraft is too far way to do this today, but JPL should have a huge amount of ranging data from the time of launch until it was too far way for two-way radio communications. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2008, 6:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652/20 "2008-01-31T06:48:45Z")
Dark matter. That would be cool, to have it so close. Maybe a little black hole, too small to see? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/physicists-phreak-out-pioneer-probes-slowing-down-newslink/435652.md?page=2)