# Picture of Moskva **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion\ **Created:** [April 19, 2022, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024 "2022-04-19T00:56:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/1 "2022-04-19T00:56:13Z")
Is this really the Moskva? It looks like a freighter to me. If so, it was seriously shot up. > **[‘We need answers’: relatives seek Moskva warship’s missing crew](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/apr/18/moskva-warship-need-answers-relatives-missing-crew-russia)** > > As Russia suppresses information about its sinking, some share details of what they have found out ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/2 "2022-04-19T00:59:00Z")
It’s her. Hanger deck plainly visible aft. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/3 "2022-04-19T01:00:24Z")
That picture is taken from the stern and the smoke is obscuring the bridge and the missile tubes. Also worth noting that it’s a ship from the 70s and didn’t exactly look menacing to begin with. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/4 "2022-04-19T01:02:51Z")
It was the lack of missile tubes that I wondered about. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/5 "2022-04-19T13:34:06Z")
Is it just me, or is the idea that people are demanding answers about “missing crew” from a ship that was hit by missiles and then subsequently sunk, just sort of ludicrous? I mean, I know their families are hurting and pissed that their sons were in harm’s way in this “special operation”, but on a ship in the ocean, there are really two places you can be when missiles hit and sink it- rescued or dead. There’s not really any question of where those missing guys are, unlike say… shot down aircrew. ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/6 "2022-04-19T13:39:21Z")
You can see the missile tubes in that photo. They’re partially obscured by the smoke, but at the left of the image near the bow there are diagonal lines that are clearly the anti-ship missile tubes that are prominent in peacetime photos of the ship. ---
**Author:** ![Heracles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/heracles/32/487_2.png) [@Heracles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Heracles)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/7 "2022-04-19T13:50:44Z")
(never mind) ---
**Author:** ![ASL\_v2.0](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asl_v2.0/32/3525_2.png) [@ASL\_v2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASL_v2.0)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/8 "2022-04-19T13:54:01Z")
> [@bump](#): > > I mean, I know their families are hurting and pissed that their sons were in harm’s way in this “special operation”, but on a ship in the ocean, there are really two places you can be when missiles hit and sink it- rescued or dead. The demand for answers about “missing crew” isn’t coming from reports that sailors are missing, I suspect, but rather from assurances that sailors are “totally not missing, totally not dead, and completely alive,” but then the conversation goes something like: Family: “Oh, that’s so great to hear! Can I talk to him?” Spokesperson: “Sure. In due time. But of course you know he is one of a very select group of four hundred crewmen who are being kept under a very strict communications blackout.” Family: “Why?” Spokesperson: “Reasons satisfactory to the state.” Family: “But my friend, Tatyana, just heard from her husband and he said–” Spokesperson: “Any further inquiries or disturbances on your part may result in imprisonment for up to fifteen years. Good day.” Or whatever the party line is. That’s the sort of response (less my entirely imagined, though perhaps ultimately accurate, threat of a prison sentence) that actually could be plausible for some period of time under certain conditions, but at some point, like when it seems like the story is out and the time for secrecy is well past, the premise begins to wear thin, leading to people “demanding answers about ‘missing crew’ from a ship that was hit by missiles and then subsequently sunk,” but which for days the government was claiming was _totally not hit by missiles_ and _totally under tow to a safe port_ and if it did sink was _totally due to an ammo explosion and a storm, but rest assured everyone is safe…_ ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/9 "2022-04-19T14:40:25Z")
> [@bump](#): > > Is it just me, or is the idea that people are demanding answers about “missing crew” from a ship that was hit by missiles and then subsequently sunk, just sort of ludicrous? > > I mean, I know their families are hurting and pissed that their sons were in harm’s way in this “special operation”, but on a ship in the ocean, there are really two places you can be when missiles hit and sink it- rescued or dead. There’s not really any question of where those missing guys are, unlike say… shot down aircrew. The crew are either rescued or dead, but it might be an issue whether the Russian Navy knows what happened to everybody, yet. Maybe some survived in lifeboats, others got picked up by boats or helicopters, some got taken to hospitals, some reported back to the Navy, etc. Even with the best intentions, in a chaotic situation like that it would take a while to find out what happened to everyone, and to get all that information into one place. Of course, I don’t assume the Russian Navy has the best intentions. They’ve shown that they’ll lie and be secretive, but they might not know the truth, either. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/10 "2022-04-19T15:30:54Z")
I wonder how much is pure cussedness on the part of the Russian navy, and how much is a military secret. The Allies didn’t release information about ship losses in WWII, as I recall. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/11 "2022-04-19T20:39:40Z")
Not strictly relevant to the current events, but some people have found the _Moskva_ on Google Maps: https://www.google.com/maps/embed?pb=!1m18!1m12!1m3!1d1397.1903977594325!2d33.55397318103871!3d44.62284494051287!2m3!1f0!2f0!3f0!3m2!1i1024!2i768!4f13.1!3m3!1m2!1s0x0%3A0x1c312fd8de55ded7!2zNDTCsDM3JzIxLjkiTiAzM8KwMzMnMTYuMyJF!5e1!3m2!1sen!2sus!4v1650400388855!5m2!1sen!2sus That’s some remarkably detailed imagery. The image copyright says 2022, though I don’t know if it’s actually from this year. It’s docked in Sevastopol. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/12 "2022-04-19T21:26:24Z")
I think I see their problem. The ship has a big red target on it for where to hit it with a missile! Bad planning. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/13 "2022-04-19T21:29:47Z")
After all, they are Godless communists. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/14 "2022-04-19T21:37:53Z")
Capitalist spies, comrade! ---
**Author:** ![Pardel-Lux](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pardel-lux/32/20182_2.png) [@Pardel-Lux](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pardel-Lux)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/15 "2022-04-19T21:44:41Z")
I have two links for you. The first one states that Google Maps has un-blurred Russian military bases: > **[Satellite images of all strategic points of Russian Federation have been...](https://censor.net/en/news/3334945/satellite_images_of_all_strategic_points_of_russian_federation_have_been_opened_in_google_maps_photos)** > > 18.04.22 14:35 - Strategic objects of the Russian Federation on maps: Satellite images of all strategic points of Russian Federation have been opened in Google Maps. PHOTOS. The Google Maps mapping service demonstrates all strategic objects of the... The second one quotes Google claiming that they never have blurred those images: > **[Correction: Google has not changed its blurring policies in Russia](https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/04/google-maps-stops-obscuring-russian-military-bases-in-satellite-images/)** > > The satellite images may be a boon to open source intelligence analysts. They do blurr US military installations, of course. But feel free to explore the rest of the world, there are some interesting pics there for sure. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/16 "2022-04-19T21:54:43Z")
It was actually the comment section at the second link where I found that 🙂 . I considered posting the background info, but given that Google denies any change, I figured it wasn’t really worth mentioning. Still, now that it’s widely known that Russian military installations aren’t actually censored, more people may explore around and find interesting things. ---
**Author:** ![Ponderoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ponderoid/32/19221_2.png) [@Ponderoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponderoid)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2022, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/17 "2022-04-20T16:14:16Z")
If Google’s denials are true, I wonder where the idea that the sites used to be censored came from. Malware and/or Russian hackers doing a subtle man-in-the-middle attack to blur out the pics as seen on the viewer’s end? ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2022, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/18 "2022-04-20T16:31:08Z")
Surely Google would have spotted that. Perhaps Google is lying to confuse the Russians and/or escape reprisals. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2022, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/19 "2022-04-20T23:31:20Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > The ship has a big red target on it for where to hit it with a missile! Bad planning. “Bummer of a birthmark, Hal.” ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2022, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024/20 "2022-04-20T23:49:33Z")
Ah, Far Side, how I miss you. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/picture-of-moskva/963024.md?page=2)