Physician, heal thyself. You’ve jumped down my throat twice in this thread for shit you were wrong about. Most people who do that offer apologies rather than more insults.
Polerius, just so you know, the next post I read from you will be the one that answers my points from several pages back. If I seem nonresponsive, it is because I am following your lead.
Hey december, when willyou get the name right? You’re just being an ass right now.
There doesn’t seem to have been any problem for anyone to communicate the fact of the attack, so I doubt that “speaking freely” was an issue. If you are suggesting that Bush should have started picking out targets to nuke, and needed to be able to discuss that, doesn’t that strike you as a trifle premature? We are talking about nine minutes here. And, as has been pointed out a couple of dozen times, there is no impediment to Bush getting the information “directly and immediately” in the classroom than anywhere else. And Bush was just as “engaged in the process” where he was for nine minutes as he would have been running down a hallway or something.
Actually, the “you” was a generic address of all the reflexive Bush-bashers on the SDMB, not any particular knee-jerk knucklehead.
But my prediction of their reaction is completely accurate. Bush is going to be attacked no matter what he does. Fast reaction = going off half-cocked - Bush is bad. Measured response = doing nothing - Bush is bad. Repeat ad infinitum.
Sorry, you’re just wrong here. I didn’t think you would act as idiotically as the 2sense person, but…
:shrugs:
Regards,
Shodan
Wrong, huh?
First episode – not having seen Bowling for Columbine, I was unaware of the bank/gun thing, hence your reference confused me. Surely even you can see that, to one unaware of the scene, a comment like that would appear bizarre, to say the least? (And I notice you never did answer Otto’s evisceration of that bit o’ crap from you, eh?) You and two other posters enlightened me. I noted my enlightenment with a joke, and then a thanks to This Year’s Model for a link somewhat more balanced than yours – which I also acknowledged, by the way. Were you looking for a grovel?
Second episode – I stand by what I said. Your reply to Polerius arrived after I’d previewed and just before I sent my comment about lack of response. When I read your post, I addressed your lame attempt to cobble up some way of answering his analogy. Polerius and I both pointed out the fallacy of your argument. You haven’t come back with diddly-squat on that. If you don’t want snarky backhands, don’t dish them out.
Funny thing, Lib – I’d venture to say there aren’t many people on this board who regard me as a hair-trigger drama queen with a propensity to insult first and obfuscate later. Can you say the same?
Okay then. Ignore my last post.
If you want specific points addressed, I would suggest you bring them up again. With so many pages of discussion, it’s not clear which points you are referring to.
This is what I did with the teacher analogy. Since no one answered it the first time I asked, I repeated the question by itself, to clarify which exact point I thought needed to be addressed.
Although frankly I don’t see the point of continuing this discussion any more.
I’m not going to convince you, and you sure as hell aren’t going to convince me.
I find it rather disturbing, actually, that two groups can have such drastically different interpretations of such a simple event, with each side thinking the other side must be nuts for believing what they believe. (Well, at least I think you guys are nuts; I only assume you think the same of us)
Hopefully with time both sides will digest what the other side said, and one of us 6 years from now might say “a-ha, that xxx was right!”
Right, because all Bush needed to know at that time was stated to him in the three seconds that he was whispered to. And not like Bush couldn’t have been using that time to make phone calls to, say, Cheney or somebody.
Well, no, I wasn’t saying a word about picking nuclear targets, but thanks foe showing up the total bullshit of your argument by tossing this garbage around.
Huh, I didn’t say anythign about “running down a hallway.” I just suggested that being outside the classroom and away from the children would be a better position for Bush to have been in, rather than sitting on his ass reading about a goat.
Actually, it’s shitty communication to use “you” in the plural when one is engaging a specific person. Leads to confusion, you see.
Wow, is this like What If?, where you have the power to view alternate dimensions to see how events would have played out differently? Because you’re really wasting your gifts on a message board.
OK, let’s try this again. Sitting on his ass with a blank look on his face, picking up a children’s book after being advised of the attack and reading along for 7-9 minutes is not a “measured response” which could be mistaken for “doing nothing.” It is in actual fact doing nothing.
Suuuuure. And everyone was completely, 100% clear that this was the only information that was ever going to be forthcoming. Three seconds. That’s all it takes for the President of the United States to get all available information, verify that it is 100% correct, and then instantly decide how to respond to the largest terrorist attack in US history. Three seconds, then things better start happening right now. :rolleyes:
I know, but it’s fun.
On the other hand, I was able to predict with complete accuracy how you would characterize what Bush was doing for nine minutes. I said you would post that
And sure enough, you chimed right back with the predicted response:
Damn, I better get in touch with Randi.
Regards,
Shodan
I have absolutely no fucking clue on god’s green earth what point you’re trying to make. See, I suggested sarcastically that three seconds was not enough time to transmit the information to Bush that he needed to decide on a course of action, which is why he should have gotten off his ass and gone out of the classroom and started getting the information. But Bush apparently thought that it was more important to find out how “My Pet Goat” came out. You’re actually agreeing with me that Bush did not have the information he needed to decide on a course of action, yet somehow you think parking his ass with a kiddy book was a better course of action than doing something to get the information he needed.
Which I guess is why you left out the part where I suggested that he start making calls, for example to Dick “the prez told me it’s OK to shoot them down even though I never actually talked to him” Cheney. I guess because that didn’t fit into your bizarre need to mischaracterize (at best) or flat-out lie about (at worst but considering how dishonest you’ve been so far, probably the truth) what I said.
No, you lying dumbfuck, I didn’t say that Bush’s “measured response” was no response. I said that his lack of response was no response. Doing nothing is a non-response. Sitting on your ass reading about a fictional goat while a city burns is a non-response. The only way his response could have been any more “non” would have been if he actually fell asleep. I don’t understand why you’re so wedded to the bizarre notion that sitting dazed while airplanes are barreling out of the sky into buildings is “measured” as opposed to “nothing.”
This is in response to me. I just saw it, sorry.
Oh, I’m way partisan. However, I never could stand “WJC” as a person and yes, I WOULD have been just as upset with him as with Bush. But as much as I’d like to smack Clinton upside the head for several reasons (being a horny idiot and wannabe Republican among them), I don’t think he would have just sat there for all that time. Neither would he have “jumped up and rushed out” like a maniac. He would have acted presidential in such a situation. Unlike idiot boy.
It’s so funny. I can’t believe people are tying themselves into knots trying to find a way to defend Bush on this particular issue.
This part at least is clear.
Look, I suspect this is a lost cause. You, in common with a lot of the more determinedly silly Dopers, are absolutely adamant that, whatever Bush did, it was wrong. Wrong, wrong, wrong. No matter what, it was wrong.
But, for the record, that is the point I am making. And the fact that you instantly respond by doing exactly what I said you were doing means that you were really doing it.
I realize that you want to be seen as being fair-minded, and condemning Bush for not doing something. But you aren’t. You may not want to think of yourself as a mindlessly knee-jerk partisan, but that is pretty much exactly what you are being.
Sorry about that.
Regards,
Shodan
Well, you gotta give them time, Shodan. We are not used to persons like yourself, innocent of any agenda and only posting in clear-eyed and unvarnished candor. They fail to understand that you come to unstinting and voluminous approval of GeeDubya (Praise the Leader!) by a relentless adherence to reason and logic.
He was installed as Commander in Chief by five of the ablest jurists ever to grace the Supreme Court. In his judgement, the most important, the most urgent course of action was to sit right there and finish that story! You can rest assured that when the Enemies of Freedom heard that! they were sorely vexed that they could not send The Leader into a panic, running about willy-nilly seeking intelligence reports, issuing authorizations, and just generally running about needlessly!
Boy! Sure showed them a thing or two!
As President he knew he knew he had people who would bring him the information on the attack.
But the only way he could get the full low-down on what that there goat was up to was to find out for himself.
God damn it- you lefties are always banging on about how dim the Glorious Leader is but the first time he shows any spark of intellectual curiosity you’re all over his case.
:rolleyes:
I am a Bush hater. I hate his politics. I hate his administration. I would vote for the proverbial ham sandwich rather than voting for Bush.
That said: I reacted with compassion rather than incredulous contempt when I learned of his actions during the 911 attacks. I understand the urge to armchair quarterback, and I definitely indulge in it myself from time to time. I think the man was shocked, just like the rest of us, and I can’t begrudge him 9 minutes of apparent obliviousness while (I suspect) he was trying to pull his shit together.
I think it was very human.
Agreed, and that’s what I also mentioned in an earlier post.
But, I find it hilarious when people try to make it seem like what he did was a well-reasoned response, that he intentionally stayed there to “project calm”, or other silly reasons they can cook up, instead of just saying “yes, he *should * have gotten up, earlier, but given the circumstances, you can’t blame him that much”
Yeah, I think the “intentionally stayed there to project calm” is some pretty nasty spin.
The man was gobsmacked, just like the rest of us.
Unlike, say, your writing.
You’re a filthy fucking liar, and a fucking stupid one at that. See, when you tell filthy lies about me, you really should tell your filthy lie about something that isn’t exposed as a filthy lie by posts in the same thread where your filthy lie is told.
And speaking of exposing your filthy fucking lie, allow me to expose again your filthy fucking lie:
So why don’t you try knocking off telling your filthy fucking lie?
Another filthy fucking lie. Well, really the same filthy fucking lie told again. Perhaps in homage to the late Ronald Reagan, whose spokesman set the standard for the last two and a half decades of Republican honesty by stating “if you tell the same story five times, it’s true.”