# Pink Floyd - The Wall **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 5, 2003, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pink-floyd-the-wall/217090 "2003-12-05T04:02:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Kingu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ce7236/32.png) [@Kingu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kingu)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pink-floyd-the-wall/217090/1 "2003-12-05T04:02:03Z")
I recently saw the movie for _The Wall_ for the first time, and I had a few questions. What exactly do the crossed hammers symbolize? The best that I can figure is power and/or manipulation, because they show up in “The Show” scenes, and also during some of the animation, the school teacher turns into a hammer. Is “The Show” merely his imagination? That wasn’t the impression that I received when I listened to the album, but that seems to be what the movie portrays. (It also says this on the summary on the back of the DVD.) Is Vera Pink’s wife? I would think so, myself. That’s all for now. ---
**Author:** ![Chimpsmack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eb9ed0/32.png) [@Chimpsmack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimpsmack)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pink-floyd-the-wall/217090/2 "2003-12-05T04:45:07Z")
The hammers symbolize several things. I can certainly see power/manipulation, as you mentioned, but I think they are primarily intended as symbols of the power to ‘crush’ individuality. \*Does anybody here remember Vera Lynn? Remember how she said, That we would meet again, Some sunny day. Vera! Vera! What has become of you? Does anybody else in here feel the way I do? \* Vera is not Pink’s wife. Vera is a reference to a singer admired by many of the British soldiers during WWII. The name of her most popular song, _We’ll Meet Again_, is even referenced in the lyrics. ---
**Author:** ![Chimpsmack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eb9ed0/32.png) [@Chimpsmack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimpsmack)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pink-floyd-the-wall/217090/3 "2003-12-05T04:49:06Z")
AFAIK, Pink’s wife isn’t named throughout the movie. Eleanor David is even credited as ‘Pink’s Wife’ on IMDB. > **[Pink Floyd: The Wall (1982) - IMDb](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0084503/fullcredits)** > > Pink Floyd: The Wall (1982) cast and crew credits, including actors, actresses, directors, writers and more. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 5:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pink-floyd-the-wall/217090/4 "2003-12-05T05:01:45Z")
I doubt that there’s a “correct” answer for these questions so much as (the more interesting question anyhow) what these things were to you, to me, or to another listener. The hammers? Hammers are an old and often-used symbol of authoritarianism, enforcement, coercion. And they looked like Nazi marching of the stiff-legged variety (hammers don’t have knees). Good visual shorthand for a feeling and an attitude. The Show? On one level, the concert; on another level, life itself. “I wanna go home, take off this uniform and leave the show”. Vera? Naw, I don’t think of Vera as his wife or even his girlfriend. Either he didn’t have one or was so estranged and non-intimate with her that it was a sham. All his attempts to have a girlfriend don’t work (“Mama’s gonna check out all your girlfriends for you, Mama won’t let anyone dirty get through”; “Hey you, out there…can you feel me? …But it was only a fantasy, the wall was too high as you can see”). Even his deliberate attempts to break free by finding a “dirty girl” don’t work (“What a fabulous room! Wanna take a bath? Want some? Huh? …What’re you watching?”). I see Vera as a long-ago girlfriend or crush (“remember how she said that she would come again some sunny day”), something to point to as the last time he felt like things were right with him and women? There’s a huge whole subplot in The Wall about sexual identity and virility and homophobia – explicitly, worrying that being insufficiently in league with the hammer-people, the yelling people, the coercive ones, means that he’s a faggot (“Are there any queers in the theatre tonight? Get them up against the wall! There’s one in the spotlight, he don’t look right to me”) And he has to go on trial ( a trial in which the judge is an aggressive asshole, literally an asshole, furious with him and ready to shit on him) at the conclusion of which, after the wall comes down, it is described as “some mad bugger’s wall”. So I think “Vera” was this sad reminscent moment of “gee does anyone remember once there was this girl and she liked me and things seemed promising”. Followed by the wry and brassy “Bring the Boys Back Home”. ---
**Author:** ![Frank\_2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8c91f0/32.png) [@Frank\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank_2)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pink-floyd-the-wall/217090/5 "2003-12-05T15:14:35Z")
If by “The Show” you mean the concert scenes from _In the Flesh?_ and _In the Flesh_, I took those to be a slightly twisted view of Pink’s actual concerts. To him, they aren’t concerts at all but him preaching and barking at the audience and them blindly following him (the faceless, identical masses). As **Chimpsmack** mentioned, Vera was a popular British singer during WWII whose songs had an optimistic feel. After the war, her popularity dwindled. During side 3 (_Is There Anybody Out There?_ to _Comfortably Numb_) Pink searches for who he really is and why he built his wall. _Vera_ is about remembering dreams and hopes (Vera and her songs) and the letdown when they fail (WWII, Vera’s lost popularity). My guesses anyway. Here is a very extensive [analysis of the movie and the album.](http://home.mchsi.com/~ttint/) ---
**Author:** ![NYR407](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bbe5ce/32.png) [@NYR407](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NYR407)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pink-floyd-the-wall/217090/6 "2003-12-05T15:41:40Z")
I think you are all missing the point with “Vera”. Pink was questioning the lyrics of Vera’s song “We’ll meet again” to the loss of his father to WWII. Think of it like: Vera, what happened? You said we (me and my father) would meet again. He was looking for comfort in the fact the he was not the only one who lost a loved one to the war. It was one of the issues/bricks that built his “Wall” He felt alone growing up w/o a father (remember the park scene) and frightened by his over protective mother. ---
**Author:** ![NYR407](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bbe5ce/32.png) [@NYR407](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NYR407)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pink-floyd-the-wall/217090/7 "2003-12-05T15:44:01Z")
Sorry forgot to add, that is why it is followed by “Bring the Boys Back Home. Don’t leave their children alone”. Obviously the “boys” are the soldiers. ---
**Author:** ![Small\_Clanger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9fc348/32.png) [@Small\_Clanger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Small_Clanger)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2003, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pink-floyd-the-wall/217090/8 "2003-12-05T15:46:16Z")
Hammers = oppression - hence the Nazi connection Vera = Vera Lyn (spelling?) singer of We’ll Meet Again, There’ll be Bluebirds over the White Cliffs of Dover and other wartime songs. Sorry to bust your theory **AHunter3** , you got the right vibe tho’ I think the show is like **Frank #2** says, Pink’s perception of an actual show. He’s basically nuts at that point (not a new Floyd theme) and on top of that he’s been doped up to get him onstage. They should’ve brought the flying pig in for the concert scene. ---
**Author:** ![BrandyFine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrandyFine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrandyFine)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2003, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pink-floyd-the-wall/217090/9 "2003-12-06T00:20:11Z")
What great nightmare fuel. The hammers goosestepping, the carnivorous vaginas, the maggots. My question would have to be just how terrified of women someone had to be to think some of that stuff up. ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2003, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pink-floyd-the-wall/217090/10 "2003-12-06T00:36:52Z")
Regarding the fascism connections, it’s worthwhile to recall that the idea for The Wall came to Roger Waters after he spit in a fan’s face at the end of the Animals tour. The incident repulsed him so much that he (a) started thinking about performing with a wall between himself and the audience and (b) started contemplating what is was within himself that led to the spitting incident. Throw in the connections to the death of Waters’ father during WWII, the psychology of large crowds like those at rock concerts, and the growth of neo-fascist groups in England in the late 70s, and the fascism references seem rather fitting. ---
**Author:** ![HPL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3da27b/32.png) [@HPL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HPL)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2003, 7:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pink-floyd-the-wall/217090/11 "2003-12-06T07:19:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by minty green \* > \*\*Regarding the fascism connections, it’s worthwhile to recall that the idea for The Wall came to Roger Waters after he spit in a fan’s face at the end of the Animals tour. The incident repulsed him so much that he (a) started thinking about performing with a wall between himself and the audience and (b) started contemplating what is was within himself that led to the spitting incident. Throw in the connections to the death of Waters’ father during WWII, the psychology of large crowds like those at rock concerts, and the growth of neo-fascist groups in England in the late 70s, and the fascism references seem rather fitting. \*\* I read an interesting take on it that somewhat supplments that. That with the completion of the wall, he sees himself emotionally cut off from the rest of humanity. With that kind of attitude, there is a kind of intolerance and nazism is an extreme of intolerance. Add to that the view that a rock concert is in many way similar to a political speech, and you have some interesting little thinks that lead up to Pink’s mental fantasizing of himself as a leader with the power of blind obeince and a willingness to do whatever he controls under his command, during his catatonia in his hotel room.