# Pit-Bull dogs, the law and families. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 15, 2010, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pit-bull-dogs-the-law-and-families/529014 "2010-02-15T00:07:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 3\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2010, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pit-bull-dogs-the-law-and-families/529014/101 "2010-02-24T18:04:23Z")
> [@BrandonR](#): > > So I don’t think pit bulls require “proper training,” just the kind of leadership and discipline that everyone should give their dog in the first place. Cesar Milan’s pack of pit bulls show they can be as calm and submissive as any other breed, no problem. Yeah, that’s more or less what I meant–“proper training” is something every dog should get, it’s just marginally more dangerous to neglect it as a function of how large and strong a dog is (which puts pits in the middle of the pack in the “improper but well-meaning training” risk pool–let me tell you about the lab/mastiff cross that didn’t get to eat my face solely because I reacted appropriately to its aggression upon first meeting. Short version: knowing in your gut that “now is the appropriate time to dominance-roll this particular dog” is the difference between “getting attacked by a gigantic formerly-abused monster” and “hey, \, looks like she’s my dog now”. Seriously, that dog went from full-on no-shit territory defense to “oh shit, sorry boss” in the space of ten minutes–not a typical result, granted, but one I was willing to live with so long as she continued to sleep in her crate.) ---
**Author:** ![DragonAsh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/db5fbb/32.png) [@DragonAsh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DragonAsh)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2010, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pit-bull-dogs-the-law-and-families/529014/102 "2010-02-24T18:18:34Z")
I gotta say - after witnessing the train wreck that was the other thread it’s downright alarming at how civilized this thread has been… I agree 100% that proper training is required of every dog. While I don’t necessarily agree 100% with how Cesar works, I do think that every dog requires a pack leader - and yeah, when a dog flips out because it doesn’t have a leader to put him in his place, the bigger/stronger the dog, the more likely a minor problem turns into a major problem with nasty consequences. This focus on owner education - and letting potential pitt/rott owners understand the greater responsibilities involved with owning a dog that needs a strong owner and the greater risks they run if they aren’t ready/willing/able to be that kind of owner…that, I think, will do more than anything in both reducing pit/rott dog bite deaths and will help improve the breed’s image in the publics’ eye. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2010, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pit-bull-dogs-the-law-and-families/529014/103 "2010-02-24T21:21:13Z")
> [@DragonAsh](#): > > I gotta say - after witnessing the train wreck that was the other thread it’s downright alarming at how civilized this thread has been… > > I agree 100% that proper training is required of every dog. While I don’t necessarily agree 100% with how Cesar works, I do think that every dog requires a pack leader - and yeah, when a dog flips out because it doesn’t have a leader to put him in his place, the bigger/stronger the dog, the more likely a minor problem turns into a major problem with nasty consequences. > > This focus on owner education - and letting potential pitt/rott owners understand the greater responsibilities involved with owning a dog that needs a strong owner and the greater risks they run if they aren’t ready/willing/able to be that kind of owner…that, I think, will do more than anything in both reducing pit/rott dog bite deaths and will help improve the breed’s image in the publics’ eye. _nods_ I can’t disagree with any of this, really. I think the fundamental disconnect is that even if pits and rotts are far and away the worst fatal biters, realistically, it’s a vanishingly small percentage of dogs who do this. The biggest issue and the one I think that is not going to go away is that the tough guys are always going to want their tough dogs, and there’s not a lot of good ways to legislate around that–breed-specific bans are either too broad or don’t work, in my experience. (my “favorite” is an acquaintance who has a wolf hybrid that is registered as a German Shepherd/Husky cross due to the local ordinance prohibiting wolf hybrids.) I’d amend your “potential pit/rott owners” with “potential medium-to-large dog owners”–as I said, the closest I’ve personally come to a violent attack from a dog was from a black lab/mastiff cross (two very typically gentle and family-friendly breeds). Similar to my wife and her experience with the Great Dane at work. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pit-bull-dogs-the-law-and-families/529014.md?page=5)