# Pitting crappy action movies and killing families **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Tags:** netflix, movies\ **Created:** [October 13, 2024, 10:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710 "2024-10-13T10:18:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2024, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/41 "2024-10-17T23:21:47Z")
I mean, _the art_ in his books is often excellent. The stories? Not to my taste. Same with Garth Ennis. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2024, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/42 "2024-10-17T23:45:13Z")
> [@FluffyBob](#): > > Ive had an aversion to graphic novels ever since someone tried to sing their praises of Frank Miller to me way back when. I mean, The Dark Knight Returns is pretty darn good and it was a major contributor to Batman getting treated seriously as a gritty noir-inspired character after decades of the campy Silver Age Adam West version, but even at that early stage of his career there’s a lot of uncomfortable “liberals are naive and soft on crime” subtext, and as his career went on he became increasingly right-wing and misogynistic, and his comics more one-dimensional. 300 (despite making a fun action movie) is borderline white nationalist propaganda, All-Star Batman and Robin is so bizarre you’d think it was meant to be a parody, and the less said about Holy Terror the better. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2024, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/43 "2024-10-17T23:47:33Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > All-Star Batman and Robin is so bizarre you’d think it was meant to be a parody, Was that the “I’m the Goddamn Batman” version? ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2024, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/44 "2024-10-17T23:51:47Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > Was that the “I’m the Goddamn Batman” version? Indeed. [![](https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEivdoM8DKOt5saVSo8qIWXhks8GQDFhZ0e0FaeTe30NfUIf4f2tuAX8LZ2WrS8fQXMcucM9xPUBiFheGKttLz2sGNsUqPE1EnHLaAYBmartzrJfVozFrqLcHrPt_SWO-sAIGxvrdhYMezZu/s400/Dense+Retarded+Goddamn+Batman.jpg) ](https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEivdoM8DKOt5saVSo8qIWXhks8GQDFhZ0e0FaeTe30NfUIf4f2tuAX8LZ2WrS8fQXMcucM9xPUBiFheGKttLz2sGNsUqPE1EnHLaAYBmartzrJfVozFrqLcHrPt_SWO-sAIGxvrdhYMezZu/s400/Dense+Retarded+Goddamn+Batman.jpg) I recall reading one review ages ago where the writer refused to acknowledge that the God Damn Batman was Bruce Wayne at all, and insisted on referring to him as a hobo named Crazy Steve who stole a costume off Bruce’s clothesline. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2024, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/45 "2024-10-18T02:17:27Z")
That _ **can’t** _ be mainstream canon! ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2024, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/46 "2024-10-18T02:26:42Z")
It’s not. The All-Star books were self-contained canon. _All-Star Batman_ had no relation to any other DC book, including _All-Star Superman_. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2024, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/47 "2024-10-18T02:42:32Z")
The All-Star version of Batman is a bizarre caricature of everything the character stands for. He deliberately runs down and murders cops in the Batmobile, practically kidnaps Dick Grayson (age 12), tortures him and forces him to catch and eat rats for sustenance, tries to beat up Alfred when he catches him sneaking Dick food (and Alfred absolutely refusing to take his shit is one of the few good bits in the series), and has sex with Black Canary on a public street in the rain right after they both kill a bunch of petty crooks. I really don’t know where Miller’s head was. IIRC, the series was left unfinished after the delays between issues got longer and longer and DC refused to let him write Batman in a Muslim-hunting 9/11 revenge fantasy that ultimately became his absolute worst work, the above mentioned Holy Terror. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2024, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/48 "2024-10-18T02:54:11Z")
Upon checking, that’s now officially considered alternate universe Earth-31. ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2024, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/49 "2024-10-18T19:21:12Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > would probably be a serial killer if he didn’t have an outlet. Technically, he _was_ a serial killer. He was just a _sanctioned_ serial killer. I’m glad that never happens in real life. /s ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2024, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/50 "2024-10-18T20:22:03Z")
> [@FluffyBob](#): > > Rorschach’s ‘you’re locked in here with me’ bit is a popular meme. Your commentary is one of the few acknowledgements I have seen that Rorshach and his buddies were dangerous psychopaths no better than the villians they opposed. Rorshach is probably my favorite character from the series but not because I think he’s good or righ, but because he’s just a well written and complicated character. I don’t remember if it’s in the comic, but the movie had a scene where Nite Owl basically tells Rorshach to knock it off with his bullshit. Rorschach doesn’t get angry, but instead thinks for a moment and says something like, “I know it’s hard being my friend sometimes. Thank you.” Getting back to the OP. Yeah, I’m with you, revenge for dead family members is just a cheap, easy way for the writers to justify the actions of the protagonist. But you can take a trite plot device and still make a decent movie out of it. The probably isn’t the premise, it’s the execution. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2024, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/51 "2024-10-18T20:36:19Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > Rorshach is probably my favorite character from the series but not because I think he’s good or righ, but because he’s just a well written and complicated character. I agree. I found it fascinating how I started off hating the character, but ended up being sad when he was killed. All the while knowing he was still the same right wing nut job no-shades-of-grey\* psychopath. \*He got upset at the bad guy with cancer (name escapes me) because he was taking Laetril. Not because it was junk, but because it was illegal. It was hurting no one. That’s a moral absolutist for you! ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2024, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/52 "2024-10-18T21:02:33Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > the bad guy with cancer (name escapes me) Moloch. “You know the cancer you get better from? That ain’t the kind I got.” ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2024, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/53 "2024-10-18T21:13:18Z")
Rorschach knows he’s screwed up, too. The very sad part where he runs into his landlady with her little kids and calls her a whore. She says “Please, not in front of them. They don’t know.” And he just looks so crushed, because his mother was a sex worker too, and he hated her, and attacked other kids who mentioned it. And for a moment he’s just a guy. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2024, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/54 "2024-10-22T22:13:09Z")
The acclaimed and recommended manga and anime _Vinland Saga_ has a revenge subplot. The author says he’s interested in the themes of life, death, and love. No vigilantism though, as the Vikings didn’t exactly operate under the rule of law. I’ve been reading the ongoing manga for over a decade and find Makoto Yukimura’s POV persuasive and not at all conventional. [![](https://takamakiokerar.wordpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/ef669b2c42dc6d0a24bfdbc80c6be60a.jpg) ](https://takamakiokerar.wordpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/ef669b2c42dc6d0a24bfdbc80c6be60a.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2024, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/55 "2024-12-19T06:22:56Z")
Isn’t that a Doors album cover? ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2024, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710/56 "2024-12-19T18:04:47Z")
Caption contest: Being the youngest of four brothers meant wearing all hand-me-downs. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-crappy-action-movies-and-killing-families/1008710.md?page=2)