# Pitting SayTwo **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 27, 2020, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070 "2020-10-27T23:06:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/121 "2020-12-22T16:14:14Z")
> [@FigNorton](#): > > “Bringing up the religion analogy her response included pointing out that some Orthodox Jews would exclude a more secular Jew as a therapist - to them they are apostates and better to see a righteous Gentile than an apostate. And they are right that it might get in the way of developing a functional therapeutic relationship.” > > How the fuck anyone sees that as anything other than religious bigotry is beyond me. Yep, you managed to work in the two biggest dumbass argument tactics we see on these boards. “What you’re really saying is…” and “actually, you’re the REAL (bigot, criminal, whatever).” These are the twin mating calls of the slope-skulled paste-eating shitbird. Oh, and I forgot, having any kind of sincere opinion is “religious”, and having any kind of standards is “bigotry”. I can see how this would be threatening to a feckless dipshit like you. ---
**Author:** ![FigNorton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fignorton/32/5619_2.png) [@FigNorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FigNorton)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/122 "2020-12-22T16:15:09Z")
Ok, nutjob. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/123 "2020-12-22T16:25:05Z")
What a devastating zinger! Your comebacks are about as dumb as your posts. Keep it coming! ---
**Author:** ![FigNorton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fignorton/32/5619_2.png) [@FigNorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FigNorton)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/124 "2020-12-22T16:27:57Z")
Wasn’t a zinger so much as an announcement that you are incoherent and imagining up a bunch of weird stuff about what I’m saying so I don’t see what further communication will do. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/125 "2020-12-22T16:44:27Z")
> [@FigNorton](#): > > I don’t see what further communication will do. To be fair, it’s not as though any of your prior communication has had much value either. ---
**Author:** ![FigNorton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fignorton/32/5619_2.png) [@FigNorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FigNorton)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/126 "2020-12-22T16:46:56Z")
Oh, that’s being fair, is it? We got some nutjob denying that “apostates will never be my therapist” is bigotry, but let’s be fair and note I didn’t apologize for a mispeaking. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/127 "2020-12-22T17:06:29Z")
Since the response that this JAQing fuckwit deserves cannot be stated in the thread that he’s currently polluting with his willful ignorance, I think his comments need to be consistently referred here. > [@Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/932): > > Well, your entire argument is based on premises that establish ‘necessity’ in unscientific ways and shroud them in science. And in pretty shoddy science at that, as you keep throwing around the term ‘high-risk activities’ without any evidence at all that blanket curfews address those. It should be very patently obvious that two people sitting together in a restaurant are doing nothing demonstrably ‘riskier’ than they would be sitting in a home together or out shopping. You can take that as one … > [@Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/930): > > But of course, there are absolutely zero studies that show that closing bars at midnight do more to slow the spread than would, say, closing grocery stores. This is where reasoning needs to come in, and judgment, and strategy. All things that are sorely, sorely lacking throughout this whole ordeal. > [@Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/927): > > I’m not sure that’s either here or there, but one thing I do imagine is that those who want to get up close with someone and make out (or worse!) will find a way to do it, before or after 10 pm and inside a public place or not. > [@Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/925): > > There are many other things the decrease in cases could suggest as well. And some that make a whole lot more sense, too, like opening one’s eyes to the very clear patterns of peaks and declines over the course of four to eight weeks that appear…well, pretty much everywhere. And this continues to be the most anti-science theory that continues to get trotted out there – and by a doctor, not a teetotaling politician! It’s just ridiculous. There’s not a town with a Costco that isn’t having more o… > [@Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/917): > > The last ten days have not been kind to this point of view. In Los Angeles and elsewhere in the Golden State, a sense of anger with seemingly contradictory lockdown orders is growing along with [virus cases](https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2020/11/covid-19-un-normalizing-the-third-u-s-wave-of-the-pandemic.html), which are reaching new records across the state. It’s a major reversal of fate for the first U.S. state to impose a lockdown in March, a move hailed as a success that kept the state from experiencing a surge of infections and death like what happened in New York. Following the spring shu… > [@Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/914): > > I’m sure that would help too. But at the same time, Congress isn’t the one telling those businesses they must close. I’m reading there might be some legal backlash in California, with a court determining the state has not sufficiently demonstrated the benefits in closing those businesses. Will be interesting to follow. > [@Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/912): > > Here’s an article about some of the effects in San Francisco. Thomas personally laid off 52 employees at her two Cow Hollow establishments, Rose’s Cafe and Terzo, and she said other restaurants in the city let go of tens of thousands of workers. She wishes the city had chosen to follow the state’s lead and this would have given restaurants at least two additional weeks to operate, resulting in at least an extra $1,300 in the pockets of minimum wage workers. “It was unfortunate that it had t… > [@Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/903): > > Some parents in LA are unhappy with they see as uneven application of science. Ferrer said that before issuing the latest regulations, health officials “went back and forth for many days” about how to handle reports from local parks departments about crowding, children playing without masks and the difficulty of sanitizing playground equipment. Tara Kirk Sell, a researcher at the Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security who has focused on risk communication and misinformation during the pan… > [@Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/902): > > Here’s an article that touches on some of those same ideas. It also, to me, continues to paint a picture of a situation – in LA County, at least, but I suspect many other places are not too different – where the public health experts are, again, just flailing. Throwing one thing after another at it, and nothing seems to be working. The article explores some of the possible reasons why. > [@Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/893): > > My problem is that there doesn’t seem to be any science behind it. There’s reasoning behind it, yes I know. A certain type of reasoning, and lots of it. But no data and no studies. No evidence. You know, like ‘here’s how UFOs work’. > [@Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/890): > > Whether he’s right or wrong, he’s certainly not the only one susceptible to bias. (And anyone who doesn’t recognize his or her own is only confirming that for the rest of us.) I’m going to go ahead and put curfews and closing golf courses in that same bucket as flying saucers. > [@Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/888): > > I suspect it’s the good people of your state who will have problems with that. Of which I am not one. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/128 "2020-12-22T17:10:03Z")
And might I suggest, for those heroically patient enough to respond in that thread - which is important, because lurkers might be reading it - that there’s the option of just linking all his comments to here and responding here. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/129 "2020-12-22T17:23:33Z")
And some more. I think we can do without the previews. [Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now) - #871 by SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/871) [Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now) - #869 by SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/869) [Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now) - #868 by SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/868) [Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now) - #865 by SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/865) [Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now) - #861 by SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/861) [Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now) - #858 by SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/858) [Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now) - #854 by SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/854) [Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now) - #852 by SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/852) [Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now) - #848 by SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/848) [Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now) - #845 by SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/845) [Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now) - #843 by SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/843) [Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now) - #833 by SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/833) [Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now) - #831 by SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/831) [Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now) - #828 by SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/828) [Am I missing something here? (re: reopening of bars, etc... now) - #826 by SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-missing-something-here-re-reopening-of-bars-etc-now/922356/826) ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/130 "2020-12-22T18:01:41Z")
You seem very upset. Maybe you should try calming the fuck down. ---
**Author:** ![Tfletch1](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tfletch1/32/5340_2.png) [@Tfletch1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tfletch1)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/131 "2020-12-22T18:02:39Z")
Loves how he accusing others of being unscientific. Hey @SayTwo, what’s your profession? ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/132 "2020-12-22T18:57:47Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > You seem very upset. ¿pɐǝɥ sıɥ oʇ pǝɥsnɹ sɐɥ poolq ǝɥʇ sdɐɥɹǝd ---
**Author:** ![Knowed\_Out](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/knowed_out/32/7380_2.png) [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/133 "2020-12-22T19:01:57Z")
> [@FigNorton](#): > > Here’s the quote so you can see HMS is being something of a nutjob: > > “Bringing up the religion analogy her response included pointing out that some Orthodox Jews would exclude a more secular Jew as a therapist - to them they are apostates and better to see a righteous Gentile than an apostate. And they are right that it might get in the way of developing a functional therapeutic relationship.” > > How the fuck anyone sees that as anything other than religious bigotry is beyond me. I haven’t read the original thread, so this is just a random stranger reacting to a few lines of text. It appears to me someone is illustrating a divide between Orthodox and secular Jews in a therapeutic setting. Considering how religious differences can potentially set off wars, it seems wise to recognize potential conflict in a setting where conflict wouldn’t do either the therapist or patient any good. I don’t see any example of religious bigotry. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/134 "2020-12-22T19:03:51Z")
> [@FigNorton](#): > > Wasn’t a zinger so much as an announcement that you are incoherent and imagining up a bunch of weird stuff about what I’m saying so I don’t see what further communication will do. That’s a lot of effort just to say you’ve run out of things to say. You should delete your post and run away again, like when I caught you out pushing your opinion as fact in that COVID thread. Easier for you, and much more entertaining for everyone else. ---
**Author:** ![FigNorton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fignorton/32/5619_2.png) [@FigNorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FigNorton)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/135 "2020-12-22T19:40:35Z")
Seriously? Wars between religious Jews and secular Jews? But the devout Christian is ok? I give up. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/136 "2020-12-22T20:26:42Z")
Its also worth noting that at each and every single posting this fuckstick called Saytwo has made, they have all been refuted, every single point this idiot has made or claimed or hinted at, or inferred, or slyly purported in a roundabout way. You can look at every one of those links and immediately after find a full refutation. When you examine the persistance of this poster it is difficult to come up with any conclusion that this individual fits the Troll word very well. Not a Troll in the conventional sense, not at all, an individual with an agenda - attempting to drag others into their world. It makes me think of scammers who send out material that is roundly condemned by the vast majority of rational folk, but one in every thousand viewers will be intrgued by what at first seem to be credible alternative points of view, and they will be drawn in - for most of us Saytwo is just an irritating noise, but I worry for the few who might be dragged into their world, and groomed little by little into a very different world. Dragged into a world of Conspiracy theories and into a more sinister agenda. In this I give @Saytwo no space whatsoever and make no allowances, the position this poster holds is not one of honest debate or iqnuiry, it has other motives and may well be dangerous to the well being of others - there is nothing benign about this poster. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/137 "2020-12-22T20:32:33Z")
> [@casdave](#): > > there is nothing benign about this poster. Even without speculating on motivation, the topic he’s so concerned to spread disinformation about means the _effect_ is certainly not benign. Perhaps I should have made clear, by the way - I was not linking all the posts here because I think anyone needs go and read them, eveyone one of his “points” has been refuted numerous times. I just wanted to make sure that if any lurker is reading that other thread, there is not just a refutation that abides by the etiquette of that subforum, but also a link at the bottom of every one of his posts back to this Pit thread. ---
**Author:** ![Knowed\_Out](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/knowed_out/32/7380_2.png) [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/138 "2020-12-22T20:39:28Z")
> [@FigNorton](#): > > Seriously? Wars between religious Jews and secular Jews? But the devout Christian is ok? I give up. Silly Fig. I didn’t say the religious and secular Jews were at war. You do understand they have their differences, don’t you? Like a devout Christian and a layperson? ---
**Author:** ![FigNorton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fignorton/32/5619_2.png) [@FigNorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FigNorton)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/139 "2020-12-22T20:55:20Z")
Yes they have differences. And anyone is free to make religious decisions based on those differences, percieved or real. That doesn’t give anyone a get out of jail card for bigotry. ---
**Author:** ![echoreply](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/echoreply/32/3641_2.png) [@echoreply](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/echoreply)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2020, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070/140 "2020-12-22T23:13:59Z")
> [@FigNorton](#): > > Seriously? Wars between religious Jews and secular Jews? But the devout Christian is ok? I give up. If you think of it as a difference between somebody who is a devout follower of a religion compared to somebody who is not a devout follower of a religion, then it makes much more sense. The particular religion is not important, but understanding how a religion can be central to a person’s life is. Am I bigoted for not wanting a therapist who talks to me about my relationship with god? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-saytwo/924070.md?page=8)