# Pitting Steophan, and any of the other lying liars from the now-closed Kavanaugh thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 7, 2018, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604 "2018-10-07T12:02:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/21 "2018-10-07T14:26:21Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > That, OTOH, is a blatant lie on your part. Because you know you **can’t** know whether one of the gatherings on his calendar was the gathering in question. There is no record of any gathering that included Blasey (as she was known then). That’s not a lie, and if it’s not true I’d welcome correction. I’d be astonished if such a record exists and hasn’t been publicised, though. Look, if one person says something happened, but multiple others who should be able to support it do not, and there’s no record of it where one might reasonably expect it to be, there’s literally no reasonable way to believe it happened. It’s not been proven not to have happened, but that’s irrelevant. As a basic moral principle we should not expect people to prove their innocence, and certainly not to a stronger level of certainty than someone should prove their guilt. So, with no evidence other than Ford’s statement that the party and attack happened, Kavanaugh’s statement that it did not is enough that we should continue to consider him innocent. The many investigations into Kavanaugh’s background, and into the people alleged to have been there, have found nothing but denials that anyone remembers it. In a he said-she said situation, if you are being just, you take the side of the accused, and demand the accuser proves their claim. That, again, is basic morality, and something that people are throwing out here. It’s somewhat understandable why the strong partisans on the left are doing so - after all, the current right wing administration appears to care little for justice. But you also claim to be better than them, but are not showing it. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/22 "2018-10-07T14:29:24Z")
You mean if Muffy and P.J. and Stinky invited me to a party? Would I remember it? Shit, I’d have been stunned that they knew my fucking name! Hey, just ordinary kids, right? Sitting around, pounding some suds and pooling their allowances to rent a beach house for summer partying! We did that! Well, no, actually we were stoned and seeing if we could raise enough to get a pizza. Same difference. Scenes from the class struggle before we knew there was one. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/23 "2018-10-07T14:33:37Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Muffy and P.J. and Stinky Oh good, the class clown is here. Presumably no-one invited you to parties back then because you were already a tedious, self-congratulatory imbecile. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/24 "2018-10-07T14:39:11Z")
People engage **Steophan**? Why? He’s a perpetually dishonest fascist troll. He rarely or ever has _anything_ of value to offer any situation. I put him on ignore ages ago, and the only times I have ever regretted it was when I pressed “show post”. Seriously, fuck that guy. Stop responding to him and the board will be a better place. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/25 "2018-10-07T14:44:35Z")
Hey, gotta make allowances, we don’t know! Maybe the poor bastard is English? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/26 "2018-10-07T14:47:43Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > You mean if Muffy and P.J. and Stinky invited me to a party? Would I remember it? Shit, I’d have been stunned that they knew my fucking name! That would only happen if they knew I had a good-quality fake ID that showed I was of legal drinking age, so they could send me on beer runs. And then not talk to me afterward. But they mostly grew out of that phase, so I understand. Some didn’t, though. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/27 "2018-10-07T14:48:26Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > So, Hillary Clinton, then. Do you think she’s unfit to be president due to her support for her rapist husband and repeated attempts to silence his accusers? I assume you voted for Stein two years ago? > > Or were you more concerned with your side winning? > > I’ve no need to lie about you, that’s the thing. Your posts incriminate you by themselves, and you conveniently link to them. I’m not going to play your game and get angry in my own defence - do a Kavanaugh as it were - so you can claim my reaction makes me untrustworthy. I’ll just enjoy being right, and those that care can follow the links you provide and see that. The funniest thing is that you don’t even try to justify your lies about me. You never go to any effort or make any cites. You just throw out random false bullshit. Random false bullshit with confidence is still just random false bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/28 "2018-10-07T15:15:13Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > The funniest thing is that you don’t even try to justify your lies about me. You never go to any effort or make any cites. You just throw out random false bullshit. Random false bullshit with confidence is still just random false bullshit. The projection is strong with this one. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/29 "2018-10-07T15:25:25Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > There is no record of any gathering that included Blasey (as she was known then). That’s not a lie Yes it is. You cannot know that “There is no record of any gathering that included Blasey.” There are records of gatherings. How do you know she was not at any of those gatherings? You cannot know this. To say that there is no record of a gathering that she was at is a false assertion. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/30 "2018-10-07T15:37:56Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > The funniest thing is that you don’t even try to justify your lies about me. You never go to any effort or make any cites. You just throw out random false bullshit. Random false bullshit with confidence is still just random false bullshit. Stop. Engaging. With. Him. Once you’ve established that he’s willing to lie his ass off for no apparent reason, _that’s it_. Why continue? There is _no merit_ in continuing. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/31 "2018-10-07T15:44:59Z")
I’m Pitting his worthless ass. I’ll do it my way. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/32 "2018-10-07T15:49:47Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Yes it is. > > You cannot know that “There is no record of any gathering that included Blasey.” There are records of gatherings. How do you know she was not at any of those gatherings? You cannot know this. To say that there is no record of a gathering that she was at is a false assertion. Then show me the record of a gathering she was at. If, as you claim, it exists, it should be easy. ---
**Author:** ![Bookkeeper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bookkeeper/32/281_2.png) [@Bookkeeper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bookkeeper)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/33 "2018-10-07T16:03:08Z")
How many of Kavanaugh’s calendar notes mention females at all? Possibly he didn’t note it because none were specifically invited, it was just assumed that some would be brought along, and it didn’t matter who. I wonder if Kavanaugh had no memory of the incident not because it never happened or because he blacked out, but because parties like this, with lots of drinking, much the same group of boys, a girl or two, and going off into a room for sex, consensual or not, were so common that they all ran together in his memory, and the memories of Judge and the others. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/34 "2018-10-07T16:03:16Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Yes it is. > > You cannot know that “There is no record of any gathering that included Blasey.” There are records of gatherings. How do you know she was not at any of those gatherings? You cannot know this. To say that there is no record of a gathering that she was at is a false assertion. Perhaps he meant to say, "There is no documentary record _in evidence_ of any gathering that included Blasey. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/35 "2018-10-07T16:07:22Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > Then show me the record of a gathering she was at. If, as you claim, it exists, it should be easy. You’re claiming that the intersection of gatherings she was at, and gatherings of which there is a record, is empty. You cannot know whether this is true. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/36 "2018-10-07T17:06:24Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![emcee2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7bcc69/32.png) [@emcee2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emcee2k)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/37 "2018-10-07T18:18:05Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > You’re claiming that the intersection of gatherings she was at, and gatherings of which there is a record, is empty. > > You cannot know whether this is true. So your evidence that it did happen is that there’s no evidence that it didn’t happen? ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/38 "2018-10-07T19:06:35Z")
> [@emcee2k](#): > > So your evidence that it did happen is that there’s no evidence that it didn’t happen? That is his claim, and amazingly he’s still making it despite there being actual evidence it didn’t happen. He’s veering quickly into “not even wrong” territory. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/39 "2018-10-07T19:29:59Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Rolling tape: > Well, looks like you’re lying again - about something I just said. I’m _so_ surprised. > That’s a lie too, of course. There’s absolutely zero evidence that this party did not happen. You know this. You know that participants’ failure to remember a small, informal get-together that happened 36 years ago is not 'evidence…that the alleged party did not happen." > > Yep, you’re as persistent a liar as Kavanaugh is. Congratulations. Wait, that doesn’t mean that Steophan is getting sat on the supreme court now too, does it? Crap, I’ll be in my closet. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2018, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604/40 "2018-10-07T19:32:05Z")
Doubt. Lose doubt, and you lose your mind. Is there doubt, here? Of course, question is whether we make a decision in the presence of doubt, or just shrug our shoulders and make what may be a huge mistake. Because he has to be innocent until proven guilty, so we can place enormous power in his hands? And what if we are wrong, what if its all true? “Oopsy Daisy!” ain’t gonna get it. Course, if he is the living embodiment of truth and justice, well, OK, then. I have my doubts. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-steophan-and-any-of-the-other-lying-liars-from-the-now-closed-kavanaugh-thread/822604.md?page=3)