# Pitting the media's unconcealed glee for Martha Stewart in prison. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 11, 2004, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591 "2004-10-11T06:09:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2004, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591/61 "2004-10-12T22:03:29Z")
**Larry Mudd** summarized my thoughts pretty well. I personally am strangely gleeful over her humiliation. Frankly, I felt much more sympathy for Dahmer – he really was a poor sick fuck. Was Martha a cook as well as a, er, … decorator? I just had this flash on Matha giving Jeffery tips on food preparation (yes I know he’s dead). ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2004, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591/62 "2004-10-12T22:52:21Z")
**Boyo Jim** , I’m glad to see there’s someone else who had sympathy for Dahmer. I felt sorry for him, too…but every time I tell someone that they look at me like I’ve lost my mind. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2004, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591/63 "2004-10-13T00:23:07Z")
> [@Starving Artist](#): > > **Boyo Jim** , I’m glad to see there’s someone else who had sympathy for Dahmer. I felt sorry for him, too…but every time I tell someone that they look at me like I’ve lost my mind. I think this merits its [own thread.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=5360424#post5360424) ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2004, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591/64 "2004-10-13T00:46:29Z")
> [@pepperlandgirl](#): > > I think that people hate her for the same qualities (being a bitch) they’d admire in a man. I am so sick of hearing that. No, if a man had the same qualities that lead me to call Martha Stewart a bitch, I would not admire him. I would call him such names as-jerk, prick, asshole, major asshole, shmuck, putz, and so forth. I dislike Martha because I see her as manipulative, emotionally cold and distant, and pathologically obssessed with every detail. Many people have said it in jest, I say it in seriousness-it just ain’t healthy to be that fixated on centerpieces and pie crusts. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2004, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591/65 "2004-10-13T00:56:11Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > I am so sick of hearing that. So am I! How this notion ever took hold is beyond me. I would call a man who acted like that an asshole. And there are plenty of them. I’ve said this for years. It’s a fallacy that reprehensible behavior is tolerated and/or admired in a man but condemned in a woman. This notion is vestigal debris from the women’s rights movement, which I was (and am) in favor of. But that doesn’t mean I won’t condemn nonsense just because it comes from a movement I support. ---
**Author:** ![Marsie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/34f0e0/32.png) [@Marsie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marsie)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2004, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591/66 "2004-10-13T00:56:22Z")
> [@Kobaltblu](#): > > I’m with you on this one, Diogenes. I don’t understand it either. > And I agree. Media critics have noted the stain of misogyny in her treatment. > I recall reading a list of the most abusive and hated senior management in business. This was quite a few years a go, and the list was virtually all men. The CEO of Simon & Schuster publishing house was noted for taking perverse pleasure in embarrassing and humiliating his staff and editors. There are businessmen aplenty who degrade and humiliate their company’s people all over the nation, and plot ways to cut their benefits and security while obtaining bonuses for themselves. Documentarian Michael Moore has made a career out of filming these assholes. But do they get the vitriol that was saved up for Martha Stewart? Or even Leona Helmsley? Dominic Dunne wrote in his column for Vanity Fair magazine that he was taken aback by the amount of public hatred. A close friend of his called him and said, “I hope she gets 20 years!” > This isn’t to say that Martha Stewart committed no wrongdoing. She did, according to the law. And it isn’t to say that she was perfectly nice to everyone. There are enough stories out there, some starting to border on being urban myth. But she isn’t being punished for being a bitch. > The media, which has to sell ink and paper and airwave time rehashes stories using more and more simplistic methods. It’s easy to create a story when you have a clearly defined villainess. So much easier to sell someone’s humiliation. She isn’t being punished for being a bitch, but everyone is delighted in her punishment because she is a bitch… ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2004, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591/67 "2004-10-13T00:59:55Z")
And btw, **pepperlandgirl** , my last post wasn’t mean to to be a slam on you. I was speaking of the notion in general. Many good people have heard it and taken it to heart. I just meant to voice my opposition to it in the main, and no offense was intended toward you. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Lissa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lissa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lissa)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2004, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591/68 "2004-10-13T01:15:09Z")
> [@beagledave](#): > > What a ridiculous statement. > > There are PLENTY of folks who “cheered” when the John Gottis, Jeffrey Dahmers and other freaks got incarcerated. I phrased that badly. What I meant was that people are gleefully revelling in Martha’s misery simply because they don’t like her, or have a delight in seeing the “mighty” fall. While people are glad when a violent felon is incarcerated, it usually isn’t treated as something that’s funny or amusing, because we focus on the pain of the victims. People seem to like the idea of Martha being humiliated and brought low, not because she hurt people, but because they think she’s a bitch. ---
**Author:** ![beagledave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6de8d8/32.png) [@beagledave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beagledave)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2004, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591/69 "2004-10-13T12:12:21Z")
> [@Lissa](#): > > I phrased that badly. > > What I meant was that people are gleefully revelling in Martha’s misery simply because they don’t like her, or have a delight in seeing the “mighty” fall. While people are glad when a violent felon is incarcerated, it usually isn’t treated as something that’s funny or amusing, because we focus on the pain of the victims. So you compared (in your earlier post) the reaction of people to Stewart’s incarceration with the reaction of people to the incarceration of violent criminals even though (as you take pains to explain here ) they really aren’t the same thing of thing? Why did you make a comparison like that in the first place? > [@](#): > > People seem to like the idea of Martha being humiliated and brought low, not because she hurt people, but because they think she’s a bitch. Wow…kind of hard to explain the public fascination with Peewee Herman’s arrest for a “victimless” crime or Hugh Grant and the hooker. or George Michael getting a hummer in the john. or what the hell…[knock yourself out](http://www.thesmokinggun.com/mugshots/index.html). Yeah it’s only because they’re all powerful women being shamed back into their rightful place. Oh, wait… ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2004, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591/70 "2004-10-13T12:45:44Z")
> [@beagledave](#): > > Wow…kind of hard to explain the public fascination with Peewee Herman’s arrest for a “victimless” crime > > or Hugh Grant and the hooker. > > or George Michael getting a hummer in the john. > > or what the hell…[knock yourself out](http://www.thesmokinggun.com/mugshots/index.html). > Yeah it’s only because they’re all powerful women being shamed back into their rightful place. > Oh, wait… You have the nerve to deride Lissa for making what you claim is an apples and oranges comparison, then do the same thing yourself. There was public interest over George Michael, Hugh Grant and company, but no NEARLY the same level of vindictiveness, nothing LIKE the same level of glee. You’re trying to make it appear as if “interest” were the same thing as “gleeful malevolence” and I’m just not buying it. ---
**Author:** ![beagledave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6de8d8/32.png) [@beagledave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beagledave)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2004, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591/71 "2004-10-13T13:36:56Z")
> [@Evil Captor](#): > > You have the nerve to deride Lissa for making what you claim is an apples and oranges comparison, then do the same thing yourself. There was public interest over George Michael, Hugh Grant and company, but no NEARLY the same level of vindictiveness, nothing LIKE the same level of glee. You’re trying to make it appear as if “interest” were the same thing as “gleeful malevolence” and I’m just not buying it. Are we pitting MEDIA coverage (like the OP title suggests) or Joe/Jane SixPack’s reaction? If the former, there has been plenty of media coverage of the examples listed. The Stewart example is a bit different because of the LENGTH of the episode…and the involvement of the feds. There have not been a LOT of non violence related long court trials for other house hold name celebs. Stewarts case was part of a larger case…and involved pre trial motions and appaeals that kept it in the news longer. But certainly Herman and the other cases have had plenty of coverage and glee/laughs from some folks. I would submit that the media is fascinated with ANY household name (especialy one with distinct personas like Herman or Stewart) and a brush with the law. If you’re talking about JoeJane SixPack’s reaction…it seems from reading this thread that the reactions and feelings are pretty varied. Some people think she is a mean bitch. Some people apparently don’t like the “message” that she seems to be sending about homemaking. Some people (like me) have no real feelings about her as a person. So. I assume that it’s ok to have “glee” or make jokes regarding Stewart’s arrest/jail time (since plenty of jokes and glee are associated with the other folks) …it’s just NOT okay for Joe/Jane SixPack to do so with “malevolence”? ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591/72 "2004-10-14T01:01:10Z")
> [@Larry Mudd](#): > > Of course, I’d secretly like to have rough sex with her and know that she’d never stand for it. But that’s just a tiny part of it. "I think she’s freakin’ hot. I’ve got a _baaad_ case of Martha Stewart … I don’t care what mundane stupid minutia thing she’s doin’ – _sounds so sexy._ ‘Today, we’re going to make a lovely… bundt cake. You can make any flavor you desire. Watch as I knead the dough with my strong, long fingers. Here we have one already hot and fresh and steaming from the oven. As I carefully ladle the icing over the top and it oozes down the side… It’s a _ **good** _ thing.’ YESSSS! … “You think Martha’s a lesbian? I shouldn’t say it … but I think she’s a big old tramp in from the garden, with her boots still on, throw you across the bed, make you call her daddy dyke top, that’s what I think. Oh, yeah! Bend you over the antique roll top desk, pull your panties down and SPANK YOU A LITTLE! ‘How do you make eggs fluffy??! **kshhh** HOW???!!’” - Suzanne Westenhoefer ---
**Author:** ![missbunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/76d3ee/32.png) [@missbunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/missbunny)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591/73 "2004-10-14T14:29:36Z")
> [@](#): > > Her magazine features write-ups on crap like $200 baby shoes. It absolutely does not nor has it ever featured anything of the sort. You must not have ever read an issue. Or are confusing her magazine with Baby Vogue or somesuch. If you want to rag on the magazine, at least get the facts straight. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2004, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591/74 "2004-10-14T21:31:49Z")
Perhaps he’s thinking of Oprah’s magazine. There is always lots of high-priced stuff in it. Disclaimer: This is not a slam against Oprah. I think she’s done a lot of good for a lot of people. But there is a lot of high-priced but relatively useless stuff in it. I mean really, what use is an $800 cashmere jumpsuit? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-medias-unconcealed-glee-for-martha-stewart-in-prison/268591.md?page=3)