# Pitting the Washington Post for glorifying ignorance and stupidity **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 24, 2014, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371 "2014-10-24T17:43:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/81 "2014-10-25T00:47:48Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > This is an excellent example of the philosophy that guides liberals. > > When is anyone actually fairly held responsible for their inability to control themselves? > > You know what my first bookcase was? It was a couple of planks scrap lumber with cinderblock separating them, junk my dad got for free from a construction project. > > My friends had real bookcases. I had that. > > But our outcomes should be the same, right? They bought bookcases on a whacky credit plan; I had planks. But they should be rescued from their desire to have good stuff. Right? I was wondering when the Horatio Alger bullshit was going to start flying. I wish it hadn’t come from you, **Bricker**. Ok. We won’t rescue people from their poor decisions. Their “inability to control themselves.” What’s your endgame? Are we now in the business of “teaching them a lesson?” What if they cannot learn that lesson? Or cannot learn it in the way we want to teach it? What then? Fuck them? Let them stay in poverty and stupidity, raise their kids in poverty and stupidity, create all new generations of stupidity and poverty? Seriously, help me out here. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/82 "2014-10-25T00:57:03Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Like i said above, if you took this women and explained how much more she would be paying for the sofa and she STILL decided to take it, what would you do? what should we do in that situation? I’d do the same thing I’d do with anyone who consistently makes a bad decision. Get the hell away from them before they suck me into their madness. But the piece isn’t an indictment against isolated individual or a single store. It’s exposing an societal problem. The bad decisions of a couple with questionable intelligence and the fall-out from unethical business practices both have a way of spreading out to the entire community. It’s in the community’s best interests to find a way to keep these things in check. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/83 "2014-10-25T01:21:34Z")
Let’s get something straight, this isn’t about the freedom of the poor to get ripped off. This is about the freedom to make a buck off of someone else’s misfortune. The question here is not about the freedom to make bad decisions, it’s about the existence of a particular efficient way of transferring money from the pockets of the poor (and our servicepeople) and putting it in the hands of a particular business owner. The market serves the people, not the people the market, and in this country we’ve put some common sense limits on the market where it shows a net benefit for society. We do not allow price gouging in emergencies. We do not allow outrageous interest rates. We do not allow for monopolies. We do not allow misleading advertising. I would guess your average American is protected by law from a large number of predatory practices. Some people have found a loophole, and due to people’s desperation, it happens to be a profitable. I think it makes sense to close the loophole. Not because I am a freedom hater or I want to make decisions for the poor, but because I want to live in a society where people get a fair deal for their buck. I spent two years in China, where it’s the wild west in terms of consumer goods, and I am damn happy that in the US I can generally expect to get what I am expecting when I make a purchase and I will be protected from scams and rip-offs. I believe this is a benefit to our country as a whole. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/84 "2014-10-25T01:29:31Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > Let’s get something straight, this isn’t about the freedom of the poor to get ripped off. This is about the freedom to make a buck off of someone else’s misfortune. The question here is not about the freedom to make bad decisions, it’s about the existence of a particular efficient way of transferring money from the pockets of the poor (and our servicepeople) and putting it in the hands of a particular business owner. > > The market serves the people, not the people the market, and in this country we’ve put some common sense limits on the market where it shows a net benefit for society. We do not allow price gouging in emergencies. We do not allow outrageous interest rates. We do not allow for monopolies. We do not allow misleading advertising. I would guess your average American is protected by law from a large number of predatory practices. > > Some people have found a loophole, and due to people’s desperation, it happens to be a profitable. I think it makes sense to close the loophole. Not because I am a freedom hater or I want to make decisions for the poor, but because I want to live in a society where people get a fair deal for their buck. I spent two years in China, where it’s the wild west in terms of consumer goods, and I am damn happy that in the US I can generally expect to get what I am expecting when I make a purchase and I will be protected from scams and rip-offs. I believe this is a benefit to our country as a whole. Good point, but once you close that loop hole and someone who is poor needs a loan to fix their car to go to work, but nobody lends them money, what is your solution? ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/85 "2014-10-25T01:46:40Z")
We have many good laws that prevent people from to their own disadvantage. If we didn’t then only the most crafty and evil of us would prosper. When I mindlessly click “I agree” to the terms and conditions of the 58th update to adobe acrobat, I want to be able to be confident that I didn’t just sign away my kidney. When someone claims to be a Nigerian prince and takes away my grandma’s saving I want that person prosecuted even if it was her own fault that she fell for such an old scam. If I’m buying a house I want some redress if it turns out that it was build over a nuclear waste dump. While the theory such lenders achieve optimality under the auspices of the free market, it is widely recognized that the theoretical benefits of a free market exchange assumes perfect knowledge by both parties. When one of the party has no idea what they are getting into, then those benefits disappear, and what you are left with is the strong preying on the weak. Whether or not these practices should be made illegal, I stand by my original comment. If your business model is based on convincing people who don’t know any better to do things that are not in their best interest, than you are a shitty person running a shitty business. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/86 "2014-10-25T01:47:25Z")
> [@Drunky\_Smurf](#): > > I agree. These assholes should do background checks on everyone to make sure they don’t do business with the poor and stupid so they don’t make their lives worse. Oh, wait but then you would call them racist for discriminating against the poor minorties. They don’t need to run background checks. They know that only the poor and/or stupid will ever enter their shop because the others have zero reason to do so. And they’re preying on those poor and/or uneducated. Squeezing every penny they can from those who have the less. You wonder how they can sleep at night. ---
**Author:** ![CairoCarol](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cairocarol/32/3825_2.png) [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/87 "2014-10-25T01:49:03Z")
> [@Chetumal](#): > > From the article: > > "Abbott headed to Wal-Mart looking to spend as little as possible on groceries. She grabbed a 12-pack of ramen **(SUGAR)**, some hot-dog buns **(MORE SUGAR**) and bumped into a friend, Rachel Bryant, in the Halloween aisle. > > “You look tired,” Bryant said. > > “My **sugar** levels are out of whack,” Abbott said." > > Bolding mine. > > :smack: > [@Chetumal](#): > > From the article: > > "Abbott headed to Wal-Mart looking to spend as little as possible on groceries. She grabbed a 12-pack of ramen **(SUGAR)**, some hot-dog buns **(MORE SUGAR**) and bumped into a friend, Rachel Bryant, in the Halloween aisle. > > “You look tired,” Bryant said. > > “My **sugar** levels are out of whack,” Abbott said." > > Bolding mine. > > :smack: More than the bolding is yours - you have added words to the quote, not merely bolded a few things - and your first addition is factually wrong. Ramen is unhealthy indeed, but not because it contains “sugar.” It’s pretty hypocritical for you to criticize someone else’s food choices when you can’t even get that really basic fact right. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/88 "2014-10-25T01:50:44Z")
> [@Sicks\_Ate](#): > > Quote: > I don’t like that this happened any more than anyone else, but this guy and people like him are the stupid shits who keep these places in business. And the heroin addict is the guy who keeps the heroin dealers in business. Doesn’t mean it’s ethical to deal heroin. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/89 "2014-10-25T01:53:00Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > When one of the party has no idea what they are getting into, then those benefits disappear, and what you are left with is the strong preying on the weak. But what do you do if one party DOES know what they are getting into, and they still decide to do it? ---
**Author:** ![CairoCarol](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cairocarol/32/3825_2.png) [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/90 "2014-10-25T01:56:13Z")
(er, sorry about the double quote above.) Dunno how it happened but I can’t edit it out.) ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/91 "2014-10-25T02:02:49Z")
Except in this case, the only party who really understands what they’re getting into is the fucking furniture store. As I said before, this woman is obviously an idiot who doesn’t understand what she’s getting into, and the proof is that she agreed to the fucking furniture store’s terms. Even if you explained to her what she was getting into, and she signed her name to a paper certifying that she understood what she was getting into, it’s obvious she doesn’t. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/92 "2014-10-25T02:08:28Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > That’s addressed (sort of) in the article. The woman in question said she tried to save up, but “daily expenses” consumed her stash. > > The question “what are you going to do when ‘daily expenses’ mean you can’t make the payments to the rent-to-own store” doesn’t seem to have occurred to her, more’s the pity. > You don’t think the fact that she is spending three times as much as she should on things she doesn’t need is contributing to her poverty? Someone once posted a link to a “ten reasons poor people stay poor” that I found very instructive, wrt impulse control. It’s difficult to put oneself in the shoes of someone poor and without serious perspective to ever get out of poverty. I wouldn’t swear I would display much impulse control in this situation. I’ve been poor at times, but briefly, and never envisioned I would stay this way. I think this changes everything. Coincidentally, I happen to really need a new sofa now, but due to temporary issues, I can’t afford one at the moment, and in fact, I’m sitting on the floor at this very instant, as suggested by a poster. But I don’t expect to stay sofa-less for long. If I expected to not have a sofa until my retirement and death, and to still be sitting on the floor at 70, maybe I’d be unreasonable too. Not really the topic, though. The issue here is sharks who are preying on the weakest (whether this is due to character flaws or bad luck). ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/93 "2014-10-25T02:12:13Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > Except in this case, the only party who really understands what they’re getting into is the fucking furniture store. > > As I said before, this woman is obviously an idiot who doesn’t understand what she’s getting into, and the proof is that she agreed to the fucking furniture store’s terms. Even if you explained to her what she was getting into, and she signed her name to a paper certifying that she understood what she was getting into, it’s obvious she doesn’t. so in your view, no matter what this woman did, it wasn’t her fault? ---
**Author:** ![Lemmytheseal2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/82dd89/32.png) [@Lemmytheseal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemmytheseal2)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/94 "2014-10-25T02:16:04Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > This is an excellent example of the philosophy that guides liberals. > > When is anyone actually fairly held responsible for their inability to control themselves? > > You know what my first bookcase was? It was a couple of planks scrap lumber with cinderblock separating them, junk my dad got for free from a construction project. > > My friends had real bookcases. I had that. > > But our outcomes should be the same, right? They bought bookcases on a whacky credit plan; I had planks. But they should be rescued from their desire to have good stuff. Right? Anecdotes aren’t data, and besides, why do you want to punish children, and anybody else who is wrapped up in a household like this, with little say in the matter? This is just like the reluctance to, for example, approach sexuality like the Dutch do. They have rock-bottom rates of abortion, STD’s, and unplanned pregnancies, which results in substantial savings, but they achieve this by beginning medically-accurate sex ed at age thirteen, and through a single-payer health system. They don’t approach sex (or drugs) as some fraught moral issue, but rather as just another matter of public health where results matter more than (religious) principles. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/95 "2014-10-25T02:17:04Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > This is an excellent example of the philosophy that guides liberals. > > When is anyone actually fairly held responsible for their inability to control themselves? > > You know what my first bookcase was? It was a couple of planks scrap lumber with cinderblock separating them, junk my dad got for free from a construction project. > > My friends had real bookcases. I had that. > > But our outcomes should be the same, right? They bought bookcases on a whacky credit plan; I had planks. But they should be rescued from their desire to have good stuff. Right? I’m honestly not sure what point you are trying to make with this. 😕 I see that you made a choice of responsible aestheticism, while your friends bought nice things on credit, but I’m failing to see how outlawing usury would make this situation worse. Is it that you happy that your friends ended up paying say $500 in interest payments on a cheap set of book cases, so that your superior responsibility was rewarded and your friends were properly punished for their hubris? While if the loans they got were illegal they would have been just as happy as you, which would be unfair? Were your friends happy that they spent $500 on interest payments rather than having bricks and boards like you did and you regret your decision are worried that moderating the laws will make the poor suffer like you did? Help me out here. ---
**Author:** ![Lemmytheseal2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/82dd89/32.png) [@Lemmytheseal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemmytheseal2)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/96 "2014-10-25T02:20:05Z")
With all that said, I do understand the temptation to scorn the stupid; I mean, I still really want to get revenge on everybody who ever laughed or giggled when I used big words in class. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/97 "2014-10-25T02:23:59Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > Speaking of assholes, I am baffled as to why you feel it is so important to present yourself as one on these boards. Judge sentenced him to community disservice. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/98 "2014-10-25T02:51:59Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > Schools should do more to prepare young people to be reasonably smart consumers. It’s not easy though if your target group drops out of school in 9th grade. That wouldn’t be enough. Our whole economy is based on spending–even spending money we don’t have–and thus a culture of consumption permeates our existence. This issue is much bigger than multiplying numbers, or making laws about business practices. Yes, having that sofa, as **even sven** notes, is really the only key to normalcy in this world. Everyone needs normalcy, even the poor, at any cost, and so the poor are often paying the higher cost. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/99 "2014-10-25T02:57:37Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > If I expected to not have a sofa until my retirement and death, and to still be sitting on the floor at 70, maybe I’d be unreasonable too. It wouldn’t be the prospect of never having a couch that would drive me towards bad decisions. It would be the absence of all the other nice things in addition to not having a couch. No nice clothes. No nice car. No nice home. No nice anything. And I’d be reminded of this every time I turned on the TV. I could do away with my couches right now and not suffer a bit because I’ve got plenty of other symbols of success and normalcy. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2014, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371/100 "2014-10-25T03:12:42Z")
> [@LavenderBlue](#): > > If you can’t buy new, buy thrift store, Craigslist and yard sale. There’s nothing shameful in that kind of intelligent frugality. I can afford to pay new and I still happily shop that way. It’s good for the environment and your budget. It’s also very easy to find such sales online or with a cheap copy of Friday’s local paper. No kidding. My wife and I end up getting about half of our sons’ (6 mos and 3 yrs) clothes at local consignment sales and shops. And I could easily afford to buy all the clothes brand new, but it’s just flat-out stupid, when young children outgrow them so rapidly, financially capable or not. Nobody ever said you need or deserve new stuff, and if you can’t afford it, it’s a flat-out poor choice to not go that route. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pitting-the-washington-post-for-glorifying-ignorance-and-stupidity/702371.md?page=6)