# Pizza as a vegetable? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 18, 2011, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341 "2011-11-18T14:34:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![FixMyIgnorance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7feea3/32.png) [@FixMyIgnorance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FixMyIgnorance)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/1 "2011-11-18T14:34:00Z")
What gives? I’m really not sure what’s going on here. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/2 "2011-11-18T14:37:03Z")
For those who are wondering, it’s about a new proposed [bill](http://www.foxnews.com/health/2011/11/17/pizza-as-vegetable-congress-proposes-new-school-lunch-bill/) to have pizza count as a vegetable in school lunches. Similar to the ketchup fiasco of the Reagen era. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/3 "2011-11-18T14:44:54Z")
Curse you, Frozen Pizza Lobby! ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/4 "2011-11-18T14:47:35Z")
Pizza as a vegetable? Ridiculous. Everyone knows that donuts are the best vegetables. ---
**Author:** ![colonial](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/34f0e0/32.png) [@colonial](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/colonial)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/5 "2011-11-18T14:51:36Z")
Anyone who doesn’t see the short, medium and long-term benfit of promoting good eating habits among our children is intellectually and morally dead. Republican shit like this is one of a vast number of reasons I finally saw the light and stopped voting for the motherfuckers. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/6 "2011-11-18T14:55:47Z")
Just to be clear, the current standard is 2 tablespoons tomato paste = 1 vegetable. The new standard being proposed is 8 tablespoons. Not sure I can get too worked about the difference. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/7 "2011-11-18T15:00:59Z")
This is an example of why places like Idaho shouldn’t get 2 senators. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc348/32.png) [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Flying_Dutchman)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/8 "2011-11-18T15:03:34Z")
Is this something the judiciary can rule on ? That is determine the intent of the legislation wrt the definition of a vegetable ? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/9 "2011-11-18T15:05:20Z")
Meh. I’m not much interested in having Congress tell us what our kids can eat. We have this thing called a “parent” for that. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/10 "2011-11-18T15:06:59Z")
> [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > Is this something the judiciary can rule on ? That is determine the intent of the legislation wrt the definition of a vegetable ? Not really. The pizza thing is a side issue. It’s not that pizza is a vegetable, but that you’d have to put 8 tablespoons of tomato paste on it to have it count, instead of 2 tablespoons. See my earlier post about the actual content of the bill. ---
**Author:** ![joebuck20](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/74df32/32.png) [@joebuck20](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joebuck20)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/11 "2011-11-18T15:08:27Z")
Don’t know about pizza, but here in the south mac & cheese qualifies as a vegetable. At least according to pretty much every BBQ joint, cafeteria and mom-and-pop diner I’ve been to down here. ---
**Author:** ![redtail23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/3e96dc/32.png) [@redtail23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/redtail23)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/12 "2011-11-18T16:18:42Z")
This isn’t about the evil gubmint tellin’ you what your kids can eat. It’s the ebil guvment deciding _what they’re willing to pay for_. Why should we be paying the rate for a “serving of vegetable” for 2 Tbs of tomato paste? Corporate handout, anyone? Vegetable servings are generally counted in half-cups or cups (depending on the veg). So all they’re doing is saying that you have to have an actual serving-size amount (8 Tbs = .5 cup) to count it as a vegetable. What’s the problem with that? I can’t see why the 2 Tbs of paste couldn’t be combined with other veggies on the pizza to equal a half-cup serving of veg. (Whether kids would actually eat the veggies or not is a different question. :p) ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/13 "2011-11-18T16:31:01Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Meh. I’m not much interested in having Congress tell us what our kids can eat. We have this thing called a “parent” for that. Parents have done a fine job as the obesity rates show. But parents are not at school. That is where lobbying pressure meets the school boards. If the school agrees that pizza is a vegetable , the deed is done. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/14 "2011-11-18T16:40:35Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Meh. I’m not much interested in having Congress tell us what our kids can eat. We have this thing called a “parent” for that. This is not so much about what our kids eat, as what our schools serve. If parents want their children to eat pizza, let them send it to school in a brown bag. We owe nothing to the frozen pizza lobby, and everything to kids and their parents to at least offer good food choices. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/15 "2011-11-18T16:46:47Z")
> [@redtail23](#): > > This isn’t about the evil gubmint tellin’ you what your kids can eat. > > It’s the ebil guvment deciding _what they’re willing to pay for_. Why should we be paying the rate for a “serving of vegetable” for 2 Tbs of tomato paste? Corporate handout, anyone? > > Vegetable servings are generally counted in half-cups or cups (depending on the veg). So all they’re doing is saying that you have to have an actual serving-size amount (8 Tbs = .5 cup) to count it as a vegetable. What’s the problem with that? > > I can’t see why the 2 Tbs of paste couldn’t be combined with other veggies on the pizza to equal a half-cup serving of veg. (Whether kids would actually eat the veggies or not is a different question. :p) Ok, but how many Tbs of tomatoes go into those 2 Tbs of tomato paste? Logically, we should be measuring raw ingredients. What’s the real difference between a cup of fresh spinach, and 1/2 a cup of cooked spinach that used to be 1 cup of fresh spinach? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/16 "2011-11-18T16:49:05Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > This is not so much about what our kids eat, as what our schools serve. If parents want their children to eat pizza, let them send it to school in a brown bag. We owe nothing to the frozen pizza lobby, and everything to kids and their parents to at least offer good food choices. If parents want their children to eat pizza, they can ask the schools to serve it. If they don’t, they can ask the schools not to. Schools have a hard enough time getting our kids educated. Let them decide what they think, acting _in loco parentis_, is best for the school and the kids. Alternatively, get the feds out of the local schools all together. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/17 "2011-11-18T16:51:57Z")
> [@joebuck20](#): > > Don’t know about pizza, but here in the south mac & cheese qualifies as a vegetable. At least according to pretty much every BBQ joint, cafeteria and mom-and-pop diner I’ve been to down here. Mac’n’cheese counts as a side dish. Now, vegetables are usually side dishes for meat eaters, but starches also count as side dishes. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/18 "2011-11-18T16:56:11Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > If parents want their children to eat pizza, they can ask the schools to serve it. If they don’t, they can ask the schools not to. Schools have a hard enough time getting our kids educated. Let them decide what they think, acting _in loco parentis_, is best for the school and the kids. If that were the case, we must conclude that many parents would prefer their children never eat at all, since they send them to school with no breakfast or lunch. Face it, if it weren’t for federally funded school lunches, many children would be malnourished, and would perform even worse in school. This is not about parents rights or local control. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/19 "2011-11-18T17:15:19Z")
Pizza as a vegetable works better for me than pizza as an animal or mineral. Even pepperoni pizza. Unless the whole crust of the pizza is one big piece of pepperoni. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2011, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341/20 "2011-11-18T17:16:55Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > If that were the case, we must conclude that many parents would prefer their children never eat at all, since they send them to school with no breakfast or lunch. No, we must not conclude that. > [@](#): > > Face it, if it weren’t for federally funded school lunches, many children would be malnourished, and would perform even worse in school. The money comes from the states in the first place. Let it stay in the states and let the states manage this. > [@](#): > > This is not about parents rights or local control. Of course it is. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pizza-as-a-vegetable/603341.md?page=2)