# Please explain the Christian fascination with Christmas **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 23, 2004, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-the-christian-fascination-with-christmas/281300 "2004-12-23T06:31:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2004, 7:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-the-christian-fascination-with-christmas/281300/41 "2004-12-26T07:04:02Z")
We cannot forget that, when the inconsitencies, anachronisms, shoehornings of OT prophecies, fictions needed to move the story along (census? what census?), and incorporations of elements of Zoroastrianism (the Maji and their gifts) have been glossed over and the best parts of Luke and Matthew have been combined with a bunch of additions and expansions that got made up–I mean, _revealed_ ;)–over the millenia, it is a most excellent origin story. It has Superman’s origin beat all to hell, even the one with Marlon Brando. ---
**Author:** ![rfgdxm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c0e974/32.png) [@rfgdxm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rfgdxm)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2004, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-the-christian-fascination-with-christmas/281300/42 "2004-12-26T07:30:36Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > We cannot forget that, when the inconsitencies, anachronisms, shoehornings of OT prophecies, fictions needed to move the story along (census? what census?), and incorporations of elements of Zoroastrianism (the Maji and their gifts) have been glossed over and the best parts of Luke and Matthew have been combined with a bunch of additions and expansions that got made up–I mean, _revealed_ ;)–over the millenia, it is a most excellent origin story. It has Superman’s origin beat all to hell, even the one with Marlon Brando. That census part probably deserves its own thread. How could some Roman emperor have ordered such a bizarre census that would have resulted in many people having to travel great distances, yet it not be mentioned in any contemporaneous history of the time? ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2004, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-the-christian-fascination-with-christmas/281300/43 "2004-12-26T15:45:05Z")
Who said that the Christmas story had to make sense or hang together like some sort of alibi? IMO, the writers of Jesus’ birth wanted to make several points–to state the obvious, there is alot of truth in fiction. Discrediting the animal managment by sheperds, the census of ancient times and the astronomical events of the night sky do not change the message one bit. Personally, I don’t want or need “proof” that the accounts are factual. I don’t need the birth of the Messiah to be literally true in all detail. The actual events are at bottom, unknowable. The mystery is not in the timing, the sequence of events, the movement of stars–I bet there wasn’t a census at that time, that no star moved out of it’s established position, that most inns had a spare room, that the sheperds were walking home from the local, that the wise men came from both East and West… The mystery is why the baby was sent in the first place. (IMO) But the rest makes a great story, that continues to get our attention each year. ---
**Author:** ![WeRSauron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f19dbf/32.png) [@WeRSauron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WeRSauron)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2004, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-the-christian-fascination-with-christmas/281300/44 "2004-12-26T20:03:15Z")
Thanks, y’all! Your comments have been helpful and insightful. 🙂 So far, to me, the best description of what Christmas is supposed to celebrate and that lends its celebration any merit whatsoever is the following quote by **Polycarp** : > [@Polycarp](#): > > And Christmas was historically the major feast of the Incarnation – the idea that the Word of God, through Whom all things were made and without Whom nothing was made, the active force that motivated the prophets, took on human life and form and became as one of us, living among us as one of us, even becoming a helpless baby, for our sakes. That concept, of God acting to reunite Himself and mankind by making Himself into one of us, sharing the human and divine natures, is key to the whole idea of what Jesus did. Commemorating the Incarnation of God, for His merciful purposes, is certainly a very good thing. At the Midnight Mass I went to, most of the hymns and, indeed, even the homily focused on Jesus Christ, His value to us, and His work for humanity. The ever-present cutesy motifs of a baby’s birth were kept to a minimum. This was to celebrate/commemorate the Incarnation of God, the birth of the King. This really put Christmas into perspective for me. I guess some Christians, myself included, make the error of overemphasizing one aspect of Jesus’ life at the expense of others. As wonderful and important the Atonement, Passion, Resurrection, Ascension, etc., are, it is also very important to realize the Incarnation, Pentecost, and other events commemorated - the entirety of Jesus’ ministry and life is a whole, not just three or thirty-three years building up to certain events. WRS - Joy to the World! ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2004, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-the-christian-fascination-with-christmas/281300/45 "2004-12-27T16:51:03Z")
> [@eleanorigby](#): > > Who said that the Christmas story had to make sense or hang together like some sort of alibi? _ **I** _ never would but if you were to go over each contradiction and point that can be demonstrated to be nonsensical (I’m not talking about or false, like that census, with one of our more openminded Bible-literalist pals they would would prefer that it did. People like you who look for the higher meaning have an easier time of it. However, I will warns you that the fundamentalists are right and that slope is slippery. You risk becoming like me, a person who is fond of the stories, the philosophy, and the symbolism but who doesn’t much care what, if any of it, is true. I feel better after going to church and that’s good enough for me. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2004, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-the-christian-fascination-with-christmas/281300/46 "2004-12-27T16:53:02Z")
Ooops! Incomplete thought! (I’m not talking about theological falsehood but that which is historically false) ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2004, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-the-christian-fascination-with-christmas/281300/47 "2004-12-27T17:14:11Z")
> [@WeRSauron](#): > > Thanks, y’all! Your comments have been helpful and insightful. 🙂 > > So far, to me, the best description of what Christmas is supposed to celebrate and that lends its celebration any merit whatsoever is the following quote by **Polycarp** : > Commemorating the Incarnation of God, for His merciful purposes, is certainly a very good thing. > > At the Midnight Mass I went to, most of the hymns and, indeed, even the homily focused on Jesus Christ, His value to us, and His work for humanity. The ever-present cutesy motifs of a baby’s birth were kept to a minimum. This was to celebrate/commemorate the Incarnation of God, the birth of the King. This really put Christmas into perspective for me. > > I guess some Christians, myself included, make the error of overemphasizing one aspect of Jesus’ life at the expense of others. As wonderful and important the Atonement, Passion, Resurrection, Ascension, etc., are, it is also very important to realize the Incarnation, Pentecost, and other events commemorated - the entirety of Jesus’ ministry and life is a whole, not just three or thirty-three years building up to certain events. > > WRS - Joy to the World! _Nunc dimittis servum tuum, Domine, secundam verbum tuum…_🙂 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-the-christian-fascination-with-christmas/281300.md?page=2)