# Please explain this aspect of the paleo diet **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 21, 2016, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242 "2016-10-21T14:48:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/1 "2016-10-21T14:48:08Z")
Please let’s not devolve into if paleo is healthy or not or the whole “calories-in vs calories-out” debate. I just want to focus on this one aspect. According to Paleo, cheese is bad while fruit in moderation is good and one of the big reasons is that cheese has lactose - a sugar. But running some numbers a POUND of swiss cheese has one-third the sugar of a single apple. If the issue were sugar, cheese is absurdly low in sugar. So the “Holy fuck!!! It has sugar!!!” just does not make sense. Yes apples have fiber and vitamins but cheese has protein. Searching around there are other things mentioned: dairy promotes leaky gut, dairy is made to promote growth so it is an anti-dieting food, we are physically not made to deal with other species milk, etc. and maybe there is some truth to those but it still comes across as woo until I see an actual scientific study showing what causes “leaky gut” and the effect on your body or that milk causes unnatural growth and fattening and that it is not the hormones dairy farmers are adding to the cows diets. So what’s the truth behind cheese and paleo? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/2 "2016-10-21T14:57:35Z")
Cheese did not exist as part of the human diet during Paleolithic times. Is there any other rational needed besides that? ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/3 "2016-10-21T15:02:14Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Please let’s not devolve into if paleo is healthy or not or the whole “calories-in vs calories-out” debate. I just want to focus on this one aspect. > > According to Paleo, cheese is bad while fruit in moderation is good and one of the big reasons is that cheese has lactose - a sugar. But running some numbers a POUND of swiss cheese has one-third the sugar of a single apple. If the issue were sugar, cheese is absurdly low in sugar. So the “Holy fuck!!! It has sugar!!!” just does not make sense. > > Yes apples have fiber and vitamins but cheese has protein. Searching around there are other things mentioned: dairy promotes leaky gut, dairy is made to promote growth so it is an anti-dieting food, we are physically not made to deal with other species milk, etc. and maybe there is some truth to those but it still comes across as woo until I see an actual scientific study showing what causes “leaky gut” and the effect on your body or that milk causes unnatural growth and fattening and that it is not the hormones dairy farmers are adding to the cows diets. > > So what’s the truth behind cheese and paleo? Paleo isn’t some scientific plan, it’s a behavioral code, like veganism. The entire thing is an assertion, it doesn’t have to make sense. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/4 "2016-10-21T15:07:08Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > Paleo isn’t some scientific plan, it’s a behavioral code, like veganism. The entire thing is an assertion, it doesn’t have to make sense. Sure it makes sense. We didn’t have science in Paleo times, but we sure had behavior. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/5 "2016-10-21T15:15:57Z")
In Paleo times people ate whatever they could find. The true Paleo Diet would be to eat anything. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/6 "2016-10-21T15:16:56Z")
> [@Amateur\_Barbarian](#): > > Sure it makes sense. We didn’t have science in Paleo times, but we sure had behavior. Yeah, but the science behind eating a paleo diet isn’t proven. It is an assertion, “We will be healthier if we eat what we evolved to eat” that isn’t proven. And aside from that, the things paleo people eat aren’t the same things in the same ratios as what we ate back then. It’s useful, I think, as a rule that makes it hard to get fat. If you limit yourself to the set of food, you’ll probably be eating fairly healthy, as compared to McDonalds every day. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/7 "2016-10-21T15:20:17Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > Yeah, but the science behind eating a paleo diet isn’t proven. It is an assertion, “We will be healthier if we eat what we evolved to eat” that isn’t proven. And aside from that, the things paleo people eat aren’t the same things in the same ratios as what we ate back then. > > It’s useful, I think, as a rule that makes it hard to get fat. If you limit yourself to the set of food, you’ll probably be eating fairly healthy, as compared to McDonalds every day. And it may be based on[faulty assumptions](http://theplate.nationalgeographic.com/2015/09/11/ancient-oat-discovery-may-poke-more-holes-in-paleo-diet/)about what their diet was back then. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/8 "2016-10-21T15:23:17Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > Yeah, but the science behind eating a paleo diet isn’t proven. Well, neither is that behind most fad/fringe diets - at best, most are based on skimpy research translated from an obscure journal. I know the OP didn’t want to get into a debate about the validity, but I think the answer goes right to the point of “what’s valid here, anyway?” But, like, humor alert. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/9 "2016-10-21T15:27:12Z")
> [@Amateur\_Barbarian](#): > > Well, neither is that behind most fad/fringe diets - at best, most are based on skimpy research translated from an obscure journal. > > But, like, humor alert anyway. Heh. My bad. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/10 "2016-10-21T16:34:27Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Please let’s not devolve into if paleo is healthy or not or the whole “calories-in vs calories-out” debate. I just want to focus on this one aspect. > > According to Paleo, cheese is bad while fruit in moderation is good and one of the big reasons is that cheese has lactose - a sugar. But running some numbers a POUND of swiss cheese has one-third the sugar of a single apple. If the issue were sugar, cheese is absurdly low in sugar. So the “Holy fuck!!! It has sugar!!!” just does not make sense. > > Yes apples have fiber and vitamins but cheese has protein. Searching around there are other things mentioned: dairy promotes leaky gut, dairy is made to promote growth so it is an anti-dieting food, we are physically not made to deal with other species milk, etc. and maybe there is some truth to those but it still comes across as woo until I see an actual scientific study showing what causes “leaky gut” and the effect on your body or that milk causes unnatural growth and fattening and that it is not the hormones dairy farmers are adding to the cows diets. > > So what’s the truth behind cheese and paleo? AFAIK “paleo” is all about avoiding manufactured foods. Cheese (and bread) would be “manufactured” because it takes significant work to make them, more than simply cooking them. ---
**Author:** ![Tapiotar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3be4f8/32.png) [@Tapiotar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tapiotar)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/11 "2016-10-21T17:06:51Z")
There are also different types of sugars, and your body copes them differently. Sucrose, fructose, dextrose, lactose, whatever, that the body converts into usable glucose. Most adults are lactose intolerant to some degree, except for some lucky ones of northern European descent, and that intolerance makes it worth avoiding. For some Paleo people, the fruits to eat are the ones lower in fructose, like berries, and to avoid fruits high in fructose, like apples. Part of the problem with scientific assessment of any diet is that different body types respond differently. One man’s meat is another’s poison, and all that. Even the same person can eat different foods at different times of life. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/12 "2016-10-21T17:08:30Z")
Some of have evolved since paleolithic days. [From a recent study](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/speaking-of-science/wp/2014/10/21/ancient-europeans-were-lactose-intolerant-for-the-first-4000-years-they-made-cheese/) by Daniel Bradley, Trinity College, Dublin: > [@](#): > > “Ireland is the place in the world with the highest concentration of lactose tolerance,” Bradley said, “and undoubtedly that’s to do with a heavy reliance on drinking unprocessed milk in pre-history, and a culture focused on dairying.” > > Previous research had estimated that this variation must have cropped up about 7,000 years ago or more, when evidence of cheese-making became abundant. But Bradley and his colleagues didn’t find the variation in their Hungarian DNA samples until 3,000 years back. > > So it could be that the presence of milking wasn’t enough to spur genetic change, and that populations had to rely heavily on dairy before individuals adapted to tolerate it in abundance. Although I’ve been warned to avoid mentioning “calories-in vs calories-out”, I’d suggest that our ancestors spent more time hunting & gathering than working desk jobs with internet access & streaming Netflix on the couch… ---
**Author:** ![Ponch8](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ponch8/32/9883_2.png) [@Ponch8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponch8)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/13 "2016-10-21T17:10:26Z")
In paleo times most people were dead by age 35. Why would you want to live like they did? ---
**Author:** ![quimper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/7c8e57/32.png) [@quimper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/quimper)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/14 "2016-10-21T17:25:24Z")
> [@Amateur\_Barbarian](#): > > Sure it makes sense. We didn’t have science in Paleo times, but we sure had behavior. I laughed 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Poysyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Poysyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Poysyn)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2016, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/15 "2016-10-21T20:56:25Z")
I know my trainer says no cheese due to high saturated fats (so, the BAD fats) ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2016, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/16 "2016-10-24T13:38:21Z")
> [@Ponch8](#): > > In paleo times most people were dead by age 35. Why would you want to live like they did? And most of those people died in childbirth or infancy. Subtract out violence and disease, and it’s not at all certain that modern people are healthier, diet and lifestyle-wise. Of course, more to your point, it’s not at all certain that “paleo” people were healthier, either. It’s a hopeful guess on the part of its proponents. ---
**Author:** ![Trancephalic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trancephalic/32/380_2.png) [@Trancephalic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trancephalic)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2016, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-this-aspect-of-the-paleo-diet/769242/17 "2016-10-24T21:04:55Z")
Most of our protein was from insects anyways. You don’t see any Paleo-bros chowing down on a nice, fat cockroach.