# Please explain to me why Roman Polanski isn't a bad guy **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 31, 2014, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126 "2014-10-31T15:14:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/21 "2014-10-31T18:00:01Z")
> [@Roderick\_Femm](#): > > So you think he got a bum rap, and that he did not exercise the influence of a well-known movie director over a girl (yes, a girl) who at the age of 13 may not have good judgment, and that he did not give her drugs so she would be more compliant (thus making it look more like consensual sex to a medical exam). Have I got that right? Oh, and you also think that sex between adults and teenagers should generally be OK, perhaps unless the teenager is too innocent to know what sex is. Which is pretty much no-one. > > I’m going to go out on a limb here and guess that you don’t have a daughter. At least I hope you don’t. I have plenty of nieces and I’ve been a thirteen year old girl myself. Consent is consent and age shouldn’t be an excuse if someone consents to something that they should know is a bad idea. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/22 "2014-10-31T18:01:32Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > I have plenty of nieces and I’ve been a thirteen year old girl myself. Consent is consent and age shouldn’t be an excuse if someone consents to something that they should know is a bad idea. She didn’t consent. She said “no” over and over again. She was also given alcohol and drugs. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/23 "2014-10-31T18:10:00Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > She didn’t consent. She said “no” over and over again. She was also given alcohol and drugs. No, that is her version of what happened. She has never been cross-examined in court room over it, nor offered any evidence to support her claims. Polanski has said the sex was consensual. She said. He said. And innocent until proven guilty. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/24 "2014-10-31T18:29:06Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > No, that is her version of what happened. She has never been cross-examined in court room over it, nor offered any evidence to support her claims. Polanski has said the sex was consensual. She said. He said. And innocent until proven guilty. This is not an accurate portrayal of the events in the trial. Further, Polanski had far, far more incentive to lie than the victim – and Polanski doesn’t deny penetrating her. And Polanski pleaded guilty, which constitutes a legal admission of guilt. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/25 "2014-10-31T18:31:42Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > For one thing, some of us believe once a child is mentally capable of realizing what constitutes sexual activity statutory rape laws are ridiculous. And some people, i.e. you, believe that shaking a woman’s hand is literally the equivalent of rape. All I can say is I’m glad such people aren’t the one’s writing the laws. > [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > The alleged victim in the Polanski case was an aspiring actress with an ambitious stage mother and therefore had plenty of reason to want to barter sexual favors to Polanski or try to blackmail him. Let’s not blame the victim or anything. The way that 13 year old was dressing she was practically asking for it. > [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > I been reading stuff on the case for years and haven’t been able to find a report of a medical doctor finding the kind of body trauma that would be expected of forcible anal rape on this girl. If you’d actually been reading stuff on the case for years now, such as for example the court transcripts, you’d know that the rape was not forcible in any way, either vaginally or anally. When he was nearing the end of his business, Polanski asked if she was on the pill, and when she said she wasn’t he said that’s okay, I’ll finish in your ass. Even disregarding age as you’d like us to, she never gave consent, in fact repeatedly asked him to stop, and had been plied with champagne and Quaaludes. > [@spifflog](#): > > You didn’t just write what I think you wrote, did you? How can I know what you think I wrote? ---
**Author:** ![JesterX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/439d5e/32.png) [@JesterX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JesterX)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/26 "2014-10-31T18:55:12Z")
People defend Woody Allen too even though, from accounts given by his adopted daughter (NOT the one he married), what he did to her was just as despicable. Why they do it? My own theory is that people like to pretend they’re all about living by ideals and principles but for the most part, whether they realize it or not, people are really all about other PEOPLE. They judge the person or person-type BEFORE the act. People who fall into the individual’s favored person or person-type they can’t equate to bad acts. So they’ll either deny the person could have possibly done the act or, in Polanski’s case, try to justify or downplay it. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/27 "2014-10-31T18:57:58Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > This is not an accurate portrayal of the events in the trial. Further, Polanski had far, far more incentive to lie than the victim – and Polanski doesn’t deny penetrating her. And Polanski pleaded guilty, which constitutes a legal admission of guilt. He pleaded guilty because that is how plea bargains work (i.e., you can’t get the deal and still maintain a plea of innocence). And the charge he plead guilty to was having sex with an underage female which at the time might have been sheevy (though even that’s debatable in the circumstances of an aspiring actress agreeing to a private photo shoot with a major Hollywood producer), but it wasn’t the lynch mob offence it is now after so many people have decided teenagers are completely incapable of making decisions or having criminal impulses. There is simply too much of the alleged victim’s story that doesn’t make sense if she were actually raped including the fact that she wants to “forgive” and put this all behind her. ---
**Author:** ![JesterX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/439d5e/32.png) [@JesterX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JesterX)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/28 "2014-10-31T19:05:33Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > He pleaded guilty because that is how plea bargains work (i.e., you can’t get the deal and still maintain a plea of innocence). And the charge he plead guilty to was having sex with an underage female which at the time might have been sheevy (though even that’s debatable in the circumstances of an aspiring actress agreeing to a private photo shoot with a major Hollywood producer), but it wasn’t the lynch mob offence it is now after so many people have decided teenagers are completely incapable of making decisions or having criminal impulses. There is simply too much of the alleged victim’s story that doesn’t make sense if she were actually raped including the fact that she wants to “forgive” and put this all behind her. Don’t you think if she REALLY wanted to put this behind her and lied about it, wouldn’t she recant the lie? She’s never recanted. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/29 "2014-10-31T19:12:52Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > but it wasn’t the lynch mob offence it is now after so many people have decided teenagers are completely incapable of making decisions or having criminal impulses. That’s not what this is about. This is about a woman who says she was raped. She says that the man penetrated her in multiple orifices, which he doesn’t deny, and that she said no multiple times. She said she resisted at first but then stopped resisting due to fear and a hope that she would be able to go home soon. She has shown no reason to not be trusted, while Polanski has. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/30 "2014-10-31T19:37:24Z")
> [@Dissonance](#): > > His 8 1/2 month pregnant wife was carved up by the Manson family; I imagine such an event could fuck up a person. At the risk of being whooshed, I don’t agree. I could understand severe grief, depression, a withdrawal from activities in life, etc. But I’ve never seen someone say “God, I miss my wife and unborn child every day. I think I’ll go have anal sex with a 13 year old to ease the pain.” ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/31 "2014-10-31T20:03:33Z")
> [@Dissonance](#): > > If you’d actually been reading stuff on the case for years now, such as for example the court transcripts, you’d know that the rape was not forcible in any way, either vaginally or anally. When he was nearing the end of his business, Polanski asked if she was on the pill, and when she said she wasn’t he said that’s okay, I’ll finish in your ass. Even disregarding age as you’d like us to, she never gave consent, in fact repeatedly asked him to stop, and had been plied with champagne and Quaaludes. How is that not forcible, if she repeatedly said no and asked him to stop? ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/32 "2014-10-31T20:11:45Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > That’s not what this is about. This is about a woman who says she was raped. She says that the man penetrated her in multiple orifices, which he doesn’t deny, and that she said no multiple times. She said she resisted at first but then stopped resisting due to fear and a hope that she would be able to go home soon. > > She has shown no reason to not be trusted, while Polanski has. Everything about her actions that day raise red flags to me and indicate she shouldn’t be trusted. Why was she there alone? She couldn’t drive herself there. Her mother had to have deliberately left her there alone. Why didn’t she or her mother report the alleged rape immediately? Why didn’t her mother immediately take her to a medical doctor to gather evidence of the alleged rape? Or at the very least to begin the process of STI testing? They didn’t have the morning after meal in the 1970s, but people did know about sexual transmitted infections. ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/33 "2014-10-31T20:17:21Z")
He drugged and raped a seventh grader. Of course he’s a scum. Seventh graders are not physically or emotionally ready for six. Good grief. My eldest is going to be twelve in less than two months. She’s a child. Anyone who doesn’t get this should stay away from kids under seventeen. _Very_ far away. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/34 "2014-10-31T20:20:02Z")
> [@LavenderBlue](#): > > He drugged and raped a seventh grader. Of course he’s a scum. Seventh graders are not physically or emotionally ready for six. Good grief. My eldest is going to be twelve in less than two months. She’s a child. Anyone who doesn’t get this should stay away from kids under seventeen. _Very_ far away. Anyone that’s going use a seventh grader’s testimony without legal cross-examination or physical evidence backing up their claims to sentence another person to prison time should stay away from the legal process. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/35 "2014-10-31T20:23:05Z")
> [@spifflog](#): > > I have a hard time understanding why Hollywood types (and to a lesser extent athletes) get a pass on personal behavior. It’s the way human psychology works; high status people are treated far more leniently and tolerantly by society. The definition of “high status” might change, but the attitude doesn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/36 "2014-10-31T20:28:12Z")
> [@JesterX](#): > > People defend Woody Allen too even though, from accounts given by his adopted daughter (NOT the one he married), what he did to her was just as despicable. > > My own theory is that people like to pretend they’re all about living by ideals and principles but for the most part, whether they realize it or not, people are really all about other PEOPLE. It’s really neither here nor there but I’ve always had a bit of cognitive dissonance over the fact that Mia Farrow is one of Polanski’s defenders ( or was, can’t speak to her current opinions ). ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/37 "2014-10-31T20:34:32Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > For one thing, some of us believe once a child is mentally capable of realizing what constitutes sexual activity statutory rape laws are ridiculous. Some of us also believe the world was created in six days, and all the species in the world fit on board a big boat. 1. There’s a lot of evidence that having sex at a very young age is bad for you. A 13 year old girl’s body is not set up to deal well with pregnancy, for one thing, and there’s some interesting evidence from hamster studies that early sexual debut may lead to subsequent physical and psychological problems. Given that, it makes a lot of sense to want to protect overly young teenagers (we can debate about what ‘overly young’ should mean here, but 13 certainly qualifies) from sex, whether or not they want to have sex or not. 2. Children are taught to obey adults, and the ability to say ‘no’ is something that you gradually acquire through your teenage years. You can certainly make a case that the age of consent of 18 is too high, but whatever the optimal age is, I’m sure it’s closer to 18 than to 13. 3. She didn’t concent, so this is all irrelevant anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/38 "2014-10-31T20:35:49Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > It’s really neither here nor there but I’ve always had a bit of cognitive dissonance over the fact that Mia Farrow is one of Polanski’s defenders ( or was, can’t speak to her current opinions ). Mia Farrow seems like a fairly unpleasant individual, which of course doesn’t make her wrong about Woody Allen’s sexual abuse. Joseph Stalin was right about some things too (for example, about the Nazis). ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/39 "2014-10-31T20:37:28Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > Anyone that’s going use a seventh grader’s testimony without legal cross-examination or physical evidence backing up their claims to sentence another person to prison time should stay away from the legal process. Anyone who thinks that a handshake is rape and but a thirteen year old being repeatedly penetrated against her will isn’t should stay away from jury duty. ---
**Author:** ![Sr\_Siete](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6de8d8/32.png) [@Sr\_Siete](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sr_Siete)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126/40 "2014-10-31T20:38:57Z")
He took a 13 year old girl and raped her while she pleaded with him to stop. Whoever defends this guy is absolutely clueless or as much a monster as him. And sure, people can change, but the fact that he never manned up and faced justice doesn’t say anything good about the guy, [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-explain-to-me-why-roman-polanski-isnt-a-bad-guy/703126.md?page=3)