# Please help with Latin **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 2, 2000, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356 "2000-05-02T15:01:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![zev\_steinhardt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/97f17d/32.png) [@zev\_steinhardt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zev_steinhardt)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2000, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/1 "2000-05-02T15:01:55Z")
I’m currently reading A Canticle for Leibowitz by Walter Miller Jr (and enjoying it too). The book has Latin interspersed all over it. While I can piece together some of it, I would really like to know the translations of the chapter names. They are: 1. Fiat Homo 2. Fiat Lux 3. Fiat Voluntas Tua Could Fiat mean “Act?” That would make #1 “Act of Man.” Lux? My first thought after coming up with my possible translation for #1 was God. However, that would have been Dei (or some other form of it). Could Lux be light? Number three has me totally lost. I’d really appreciate the help. Thank you. Zev Steinhardt ---
**Author:** ![missbunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/76d3ee/32.png) [@missbunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/missbunny)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2000, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/2 "2000-05-02T15:13:50Z")
“Fiat” means “let there be” in Latin. I know that Fiat Lux means “let there be light.” The other two I’m not sure about. ---
**Author:** ![Darkfox](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@Darkfox](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darkfox)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2000, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/3 "2000-05-02T15:20:07Z")
Ooooh! I love that book! It’s one of my favorites! Anyway: 1. Fiat Homo - “Let There Be Man” 2. Fiat Lux - “Let There Be Light” 3. Fiat Voluntas Tua - “Let Thy Will Be Done” ---
**Author:** ![zev\_steinhardt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/97f17d/32.png) [@zev\_steinhardt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zev_steinhardt)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2000, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/4 "2000-05-02T15:22:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\* > Ooooh! I love that book! It’s one of my favorites! Anyway: > > 1. Fiat Homo - “Let There Be Man” > 2. Fiat Lux - “Let There Be Light” > 3. Fiat Voluntas Tua - “Let Thy Will Be Done” > \*\* Thank you Darkfox. Considering what happens in Part II, Fiat Lux now makes alot more sense. Zev Steinhardt ---
**Author:** ![Dragwyr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dragwyr/32/2855_2.png) [@Dragwyr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dragwyr)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2000, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/5 "2000-05-02T16:03:32Z")
Well done, and remember: Semper ubi sub ubi! ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2000, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/6 "2000-05-02T16:26:12Z")
What is “De ilio do leo”? And as long as I’m asking, what’s “Semper ubi sub ubi”? ---
**Author:** ![Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/96bed5/32.png) [@Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patty_O_Furniture)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2000, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/7 "2000-05-02T16:40:51Z")
Reading more but enjoying it less? That’s because [everybody who speaks Latin is dead](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=23128). Honestly, if you’re enjoying the book _because of_ the occasional Latin phrase, then good for you! 😃 * * * Manual sig line #12 ---
**Author:** ![zev\_steinhardt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/97f17d/32.png) [@zev\_steinhardt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zev_steinhardt)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2000, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/8 "2000-05-02T16:43:34Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\* > Reading more but enjoying it less? That’s because [everybody who speaks Latin is dead](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=23128). > > Honestly, if you’re enjoying the book _because of_ the occasional Latin phrase, then good for you! 😃 > > * * * > > Manual sig line #12 > \*\* Actually, I’m enjoying the book because it’s an interesting story. The Latin just adds touches of realism to it. Zev Steinhardt ---
**Author:** ![pluto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f08c70/32.png) [@pluto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pluto)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2000, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/9 "2000-05-02T17:04:57Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\* > And as long as I’m asking, what’s “Semper ubi sub ubi”? > \*\* A Latin-English pun. Word by word it translates as “Always where under where”. Get it? Niles Crane used it in an episode of Frasier. ---
**Author:** ![bibliophage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bibliophage/32/7615_2.png) [@bibliophage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bibliophage)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2000, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/10 "2000-05-02T22:22:35Z")
Two of the three quotations are from the [Vulgate Bible of St. Jerome](http://bible.gospelcom.net/bible?language=Latin). For future reference, you can search for unfamiliar phrases and look up the verse in the English Bible. Fiat Lux=Let there be light (Gen. 1:3) Fiat Voluntas Tua=Thy will be done (Matt. 6:10) The phrase ‘fiat homo’ is found in the Confessions of St. Augustine. That may or may not be Miller’s the source. Speaking of Latin-English puns does anybody remember the exact Latin words to the following: Oh, see, Billy, see 'em go, Forty buses in a row. Oh, no, Billy, them is trucks. What is in 'em? Cows and dux. In Latin it’s made up of real words, but it’s utter nonesense. It runs something like: O sybili si emgo Fortibus es in naro O nobili demis trux Vatis enim Caus in dux. I used to have the exact Latin wording but I can’t find it now. As I recall, I looked up all the Latin words but couldn’t find some of them. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2000, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/11 "2000-05-02T22:37:59Z")
The way I read it long ago was: Civili derego, Fortibus in ero. Demes nobus, demes trux. Sewatis enim? Caus in dux. “See Willie, there they go, Forty buses in a row. Them is no buses, them is trucks. See what is in them? Cows and ducks!” How about another old fave, Caesar et iam forti, Brutus et erat. Caesar sic in omnibus, Brutus sic inat. I will post a translation if nobody gets it, but it’ll be more fun if you try it yourself first. 🙂 Kimstu ---
**Author:** ![handy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5a626/32.png) [@handy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handy)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2000, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/12 "2000-05-02T22:53:00Z")
Or Kim, just visit [ask.com](http://ask.com) & search for latin dictionary. There are a few on the net. ---
**Author:** ![moriah](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b2d939/32.png) [@moriah](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/moriah)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2000, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/13 "2000-05-02T23:31:44Z")
Darkfox translated: > [@](#): > > **1. Fiat Homo - "Let There Be Man"** Hate to quibble\*, but “Let there be man” would be “Fiat Vir.” “Homo (hominis)” means “human(ity)”. ## Pax in terra hominibus voluntatis.\*\* \*_actually, I love to_ \*\*_Peace on earth to people of good will._ ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2000, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/14 "2000-05-03T03:29:42Z")
We always figured that our (Catholic prep school) cafeteria used the Latin for “He knows the Faith” as its motto. Fidem scit. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Angel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d26b3c/32.png) [@Johnny\_Angel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Angel)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2000, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/15 "2000-05-03T04:48:29Z")
**moriah** wrote: > [@](#): > > Hate to quibble\*, but “Let there be man” would be “Fiat Vir.” “Homo (hominis)” means “human(ity)”. But you know that `man' can be used to mean `mankind.’ So, there’s nothing to quibble. In fact, my understanding is that `man' meaning `mankind’ is etymologically unrelated to `man’ meaning ‘a male person.’ They are not _homonyms_. Well, one is a _homonym_ and the other is a _virnym_. But they are _homophones_, not to be confused with _homophomes_, which are _anti-homos_, or _hominis avunculara_ which are _homo’s aunties_. ---
**Author:** ![bibliophage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bibliophage/32/7615_2.png) [@bibliophage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bibliophage)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2000, 9:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/16 "2000-05-03T09:48:54Z")
**Johnny L.A.** : > [@](#): > > \*\* > What is “De ilio do leo”? > \*\* It looks a little like Portuguese but it’s not. I suppose it really is Latin. I need more information. What is the source of the quotation? What is the context? Is “ilio” capitalized? “De Ilio” means from Troy or about Troy. “Do” is I give, I send, or I put. “Leo” is lion, but it must be the subject of the sentence (or the one spoken to). Put it all together and you get something like “I, the lion, send [news?] from Troy.” Doesn’t make a hell of a lot of sense to me. Are you sure you didn’t make a typo? Context. I need context! ---
**Author:** ![bibliophage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bibliophage/32/7615_2.png) [@bibliophage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bibliophage)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2000, 10:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/17 "2000-05-03T10:51:39Z")
I may be barking up the wrong tree, but “De Ilio doleo” makes a lot more sense. It can be translated “I grieve for Troy.” I searched the _Aeneid_ for this phrase but came up empty. ---
**Author:** ![SDP](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@SDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SDP)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2000, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/18 "2000-05-03T12:15:27Z")
> [@](#): > > De ilio do leo Err, umm, well, that makes no sense, due to a variety of features, not the least of which is that I don’t think the word “ilio” exists (personal knowledge and a quick check of an online dictionary…I could look in an unabridged one that I have at home here, but I’m too lazy). What you have right now…I mean, I can’t translate it because it doesn’t make sense…“About (ilio) I give…” and fit lion in there somewhere, where it is neither the subject nor the object of anything…just…sitting there. However, were you to say “De illo doleo” it would make perfect sense. “I am sad about that.” For the interested, fiat is the 3rd person singular subjunctive form of the verb facere, meaning to do or make, but in the subjunctive it has the new meaning of “become,” ergo, fiat lux, let there be light, etc., as has already been answered. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2000, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/19 "2000-05-03T12:19:41Z")
“De ilio do leo” is from a “coat of arms” or a “heraldic” shield for a ship in the U.S. 7th Fleet. I’m assuming the ship was CLG-5 _USS Oklahoma City_, but I’m not sure. I haven’t seen the shield in many years, so I’m not sure of the spelling; but I _think_ it’s right. I was never taught Latin, so I was guessing that “ilio” had something to do with the ilium, part of the pelvis, so I thought it might be something like “The loin of the lion”; but that seems somewhat rude to hang on a Naval vessel. The _Oklahoma City_ was the flagship for the 7th Fleet when my dad was Communications Officer aboard her. Maybe the “send news” idea has something to with communicating with the fleet? (Still, “The loin of the lion” has a nice ring to it. :D) ---
**Author:** ![SDP](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@SDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SDP)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2000, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-help-with-latin/18356/20 "2000-05-03T22:12:41Z")
**Johnny L.A. scripsit:** > [@](#): > > I was never taught Latin, so I was guessing that “ilio” had something to do with the ilium, part of the pelvis, so I thought it might be something like “The loin of the lion”; but that seems somewhat rude to hang on a Naval vessel. This will teach me to trust a cheesy online dictionary over a nice, real life, unabridged one. Ilio would in fact be the dative/ablative of ilium, meaning “hipbone.” Now, how this fits in I’m not sure…because it still doesn’t make any sense to me. We have “I give,” “about a/the hipbone,” and “a/the lion,” keeping in mind that lion cannot be an object of anything, as it is in the nominative case. I don’t understand how you would put those words together to make an intelligible sentence. “De illo doleo,” and “De Illio doleo” both make sense…but if it really is “De ilio do leo,” I’ve got to believe that either the people who wrote that weren’t the best Latin scholars around, or else I’m just an idiot…hopefully the former.