# Please list what you think are the most important Natural Rights... **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 7, 2016, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954 "2016-11-07T15:17:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/41 "2016-11-08T19:15:27Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Yes, and I remember _your_ well researched and comprehensive list from the other thread-“Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness”, and your demand that I accept them as Natural Rights before the discussion could continue. I did nothing of the sort. \*"Here’s what I believe: “We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.” Note "among these ". Do you accept these as natural rights?"\* So, again,are you going to refuse to give your own list, refuse to accept _any_ rights as natural? Do you or do you not accept the Founding Fathers partial list of " Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness." as part of a list a natural rights? It is a simple question. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/42 "2016-11-08T19:18:35Z")
Answer already given. Sorry you don’t like it. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/43 "2016-11-08T19:26:00Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Answer already given. Sorry you don’t like it. “I don’t even know what natural rights are yet, which should be evident by the questions I am asking.” ??😕 Ok, but you do know the Declaration, the Founding Fathers. yes? So,\*\* Do you or do you not accept the Founding Fathers partial list of " Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness." as part of a list a natural rights? It is a simple question.\*\* ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/44 "2016-11-08T19:26:55Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I think a common definition would be “Natural rights are those that are not dependent on the laws or customs of any particular culture or government, and therefore universal and inalienable (i.e., rights that cannot be repealed or restrained by human laws).” For clarity’s sake, is everyone working off of this definition, or another one? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/45 "2016-11-08T19:27:58Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > “I don’t even know what natural rights are yet, which should be evident by the questions I am asking.” ??😕 > > Ok, but you do know the Declaration, the Founding Fathers. yes? > > So,\*\* Do you or do you not accept the Founding Fathers partial list of " Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness." as part of a list a natural rights? It is a simple question.\*\* You have stated that it is part of your list, and I accept that. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/46 "2016-11-08T19:30:45Z")
“Liberty” and “The Pursuit of Happiness” are vague broad phrases which can encompass pretty much everything people have already mentioned in the thread. If you believe you have a natural right to those two things, and your life, you already believe you have a lot of narrow specific rights, like freedom of speech or freedom to travel. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/47 "2016-11-08T19:31:53Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > You have stated that it is part of your list, and I accept that. Wow. I mean, honestly, I thought at least those rights were be a given for any American. Those were easy, the ones without any argument or debate. Part of our heritage. But you wont even commit to those. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/48 "2016-11-08T19:37:01Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Wow. I mean, honestly, I thought at least those rights were be a given for any American. Those were easy, the ones without any argument or debate. Part of our heritage. > > But you wont even commit to those. ☹ _Maybe_ I am on the fence when it comes to the concept of “Natural Rights”, even though I might support the concepts of “Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness”. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/74df32/32.png) [@The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Devil_s_Grandmother)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/49 "2016-11-08T21:05:43Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Does this imply a natural right to force others not to pollute the air and/or water? Yes. Please don’t shit in my well. Freedom of my body/life: I can do what I like with my body, but others may not kill / rape / poison / photograph me. Up to and including the most pain-free death I can afford. I get to have reasonable clean food and water to put in my body. I can have kids or not. I can travel and live where I want/can afford. Freedom to be left alone. Freedom to worship or not as I please. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_R.Mortiss](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim_r.mortiss/32/142_2.png) [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_R.Mortiss)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/50 "2016-11-08T21:19:58Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > My top one is freedom of bodily autonomy – everyone (adults of sound mind) has (or should have) the right to control who and what has access to their body, and can rescind such access at any time and for any reason. Does this include the right to sell your organs? Because that is a right that is frowned upon (if not outright banned) by many governments. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/51 "2016-11-08T21:26:24Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Great. I want a new BMW. > > I will be taking one, inasmuch as I have a natural right. Captain Disingenuous strikes again! ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/52 "2016-11-08T22:03:57Z")
In most situations, the concept of natural rights are those things that philosophers have posited to be rights that **should** afforded to all human beings or _human rights_. That governments should grant to its citizens. But aren’t necessarily so. As humans we are only afforded the rights from which those in power grant us. If these are natural rights they should not be able to be taken away. Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness can and has never been granted to many people in the world, therefore how can it be a natural right? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/53 "2016-11-08T22:29:42Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Great. I want a new BMW. > > I will be taking one, inasmuch as I have a natural right. No, you have the freedom\* from\* want. Not _to_ want. And of course the word “want” is a different meaning as used here: > **[Oxford Languages | The Home of Language Data](https://languages.oup.com/)** > > Explore Oxford Languages, the home of world-renowned language data. _literary [no object] Lack something desirable or essential. ‘you shall want for nothing while you are with me’_ ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2016, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/54 "2016-11-08T23:50:48Z")
The freedom to defend yourself. The freedom to own property. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/55 "2016-11-09T00:05:00Z")
> [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](#): > > Does this include the right to sell your organs? Because that is a right that is frowned upon (if not outright banned) by many governments. Tricky… One traditional limitation on bodily autonomy is self-mutilation. You can’t just go to a doctor and ask to have your (healthy) arm cut off. This would seem to be one of those “natural rights” which we limit for the good of society; ditto for rules against suicide. (Part of the origin of these rules is the notion that the citizen owes military service to his liege. One of the early definitions of the word “mayhem” was damaging someone to the degree that they could not serve under arms for the King.) (Also, organ selling is seen as disruptive to small-d democracy. It would mean that rich guys could survive injuries or diseases that would kill poor people. That flies against many people’s sense of justice. It would also undermine voluntary organ donation: why should I donate bone marrow when I can get paid for it? This works against societal unity, and some of us don’t like it.) ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 7:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/56 "2016-11-09T07:05:31Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > The freedom to own property. Would this natural right force others to sell property to you if they didn’t like the way you looked or worshiped? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/57 "2016-11-09T12:53:37Z")
> [@The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](#): > > Yes. Please don’t shit in my well. How large is your “well”? It seems to be a libertarian claim that people should be able to do whatever they want on their own land. How can a “Natural Right” to clean air and clean water coexist with this, since people do not live in closed environmental systems and, sooner or later, others water and air will mix with yours. To enforce your “Natural Right”, would you not have to create a “Natural Restriction” on the rights of others? ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/58 "2016-11-10T01:13:33Z")
Even (most) libertarians usually concede that they can’t use their private property in ways that affect their neighbors. They would admit that they can’t play music REAALLYYY LOUD on their property, or pour dangerous chemicals into the stream that runs from their land onto a neighbor’s land. Part of their reasoning is simple “golden rule” practicality: they wouldn’t want their neighbors doing stuff like that to them. (The small moiety of libertarians who are actual anarchists don’t make even that much of a concession. Fortunately, there are very few of that kind of wild-eyed fanatical extremist.) ---
**Author:** ![dunkleosteus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dunkleosteus/32/9331_2.png) [@dunkleosteus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dunkleosteus)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/59 "2016-11-11T16:01:14Z")
Right to Life Ownership of your own body Freedom of belief Right to a fair trial Freedom of speech [except hate speech] I can’t think of anything else. I don’t agree with “the right to be a dick”. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954/60 "2016-11-11T22:25:49Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Would this natural right force others to sell property to you if they didn’t like the way you looked or worshiped? Of course not. Part of the ability to own things is the ability to chose not to dispose of something. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/please-list-what-you-think-are-the-most-important-natural-rights/770954.md?page=4)