# Plot holes in Sherlock Holmes stories (wide open spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 20, 2019, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691 "2019-11-20T04:13:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/21 "2019-11-20T21:53:00Z")
> [@markn\_1](#): > > I believe there were a couple of stories where Holmes deduced the sex and even the character of a person based on their handwriting. Just finished listening to a dozen Holmes stories on audiobook. He also remarks on the structure of every shady character’s face. Must have been more “common knowledge” that cruel cheekbones lead to (or are caused by) a cruel temperament. ---
**Author:** ![txjim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f07891/32.png) [@txjim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/txjim)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2019, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/22 "2019-11-20T21:53:59Z")
_The Valley of Fear_ is stated to have taken place in 1888 and _The Adventure of the Final Problem_ in 1891 ([source](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_time_and_places_in_cases_of_Sherlock_Holmes)). Professor Moriarty was discussed in Valley of Fear (in fact, Holmes stated “You have heard me speak of Professor Moriarty?”) but in Final Problem, Watson had never heard of the man. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/23 "2019-11-21T00:35:24Z")
Or at least, Watson didn’t remember having heard of the man. I mean, really, could _you_ keep straight all of the details about the various criminals that Holmes is always prattering on about? ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/24 "2019-11-21T00:37:13Z")
> [@digs](#): > > Just finished listening to a dozen Holmes stories on audiobook. He also remarks on the structure of every shady character’s face. Must have been more “common knowledge” that cruel cheekbones lead to (or are caused by) a cruel temperament. That was a widely held belief, and in fact, considered to be a bit of cutting edge science. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/25 "2019-11-21T00:41:02Z")
> [@Horatio\_Hellpop](#): > > I can’t imagine Arthur Conan Doyle being even marginally aware of anything (excepting medical arcana, that’s what Watson was for) that Holmes wasn’t intensely aware of. Uh, he was portrayed as super ignorant of many topics. As a fully blown…sociopath, he only seems intelligent on topics that relate to criminal investigations. And some music and fighting. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/26 "2019-11-21T00:42:49Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > Uh, he was portrayed as super ignorant of many topics. As a fully blown…sociopath, he only seems intelligent on topics that relate to criminal investigations. And some music and fighting. Fighting is needed for criminal investigations (and so is disguise-wearing, something else Holmes is really good at). Music keeps Holmes’ mind occupied when there’s no good crime to fight (which happens from time to time). ---
**Author:** ![GMANCANADA](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gmancanada/32/2837_2.png) [@GMANCANADA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GMANCANADA)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/27 "2019-11-21T02:28:33Z")
After this post, I’m going have to go back through all the Holmes books again. As a side note for anyone who doesn’t have the time to read a physical book. Almost all the books are considered public domain now. I was able to download them (and many other classic authors) as free audio books from Librivox. I listen when I drive or cycle. [https://librivox.org](https://librivox.org) ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/28 "2019-11-21T02:36:16Z")
> [@GMANCANADA](#): > > After this post, I’m going have to go back through all the Holmes books again. > > As a side note for anyone who doesn’t have the time to read a physical book. Almost all the books are considered public domain now. I was able to download them (and many other classic authors) as free audio books from Librivox. I listen when I drive or cycle. > > [https://librivox.org](https://librivox.org) I rarely hear professional-quality narration on libravox. The free audiobooks from the library (using Overdrive software) have the Dr. Watson from the Jeremy Brett Sherlock series reading them. Or you can get Simon Prebble (the quintessential old-school Brit narrator). How are the books being read by Stephen Fry? He reads all of them. One of my students joined Audible and chose that for her free book… 65 hours’ worth! ---
**Author:** ![GMANCANADA](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gmancanada/32/2837_2.png) [@GMANCANADA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GMANCANADA)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/29 "2019-11-21T02:55:17Z")
@digs - I agree 100%, some of the readers are embarrassingly bad. The good news is that pretty much every book (Holmes or otherwise) has multiple readers. I do a preview to see if I like the reader before I download. For Sherlock I found a reader “David Clarke”, a deep voiced Brit. Very professional sounding, I believe he’s a church minister. Best reader I’ve found on Libravox. If you select the readers name, it will show you all the books they’ve read. > **[LibriVox](https://librivox.org/the-adventures-of-sherlock-holmes-version-4-by-sir-arthur-conan-doyle/)** > > LibriVox ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 11:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/30 "2019-11-21T11:08:06Z")
It’s been years since I’ve read these, so I don’t remember which story is which… But… I’ve seen it mentioned that the stories vary as to where Watson took that Jezail bullet. Early in the series (specifically, in Watson’s narration of his own backstory), he was shot in his shoulder. Later in the series, it’s mentioned somewhere that it was in his leg. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/31 "2019-11-21T11:49:43Z")
Possibly a nitpick, but “The Adventure of the Blue Carbuncle” has a small problem in that the sole defining characteristic of a carbuncle is that it is red. Also (spoiler alert), the gem is found in the crop of a goose…but geese don’t have crops. Not one of Sir Arthur’s finest stories. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/32 "2019-11-21T12:12:11Z")
Is that really the _sole_ defining characteristic of a carbuncle? Any red stone is a carbuncle, and no stone of any other color is? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/33 "2019-11-21T12:22:24Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Is that really the _sole_ defining characteristic of a carbuncle? Any red stone is a carbuncle, and no stone of any other color is? Yes. It usually refers to a garnet, but not exclusively; one quickly-found definition reads: “a bright red gem, in particular a garnet cut en cabochon”. The Wikipedia definition, taken from the _Dictionary of Gems and Gemology_, is “any red gemstone, most often a red garnet”. If it ain’t red, it ain’t a carbuncle. ---
**Author:** ![kitap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b9e5f3/32.png) [@kitap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kitap)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/34 "2019-11-21T12:35:09Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > It’s been years since I’ve read these, so I don’t remember which story is which… But… > > I’ve seen it mentioned that the stories vary as to where Watson took that Jezail bullet. Early in the series (specifically, in Watson’s narration of his own backstory), he was shot in his shoulder. Later in the series, it’s mentioned somewhere that it was in his leg. I read an article or something somewhere once that hypothesized that Watson was actually shot in the ass but due to it being the Victorian era he had to make up a different place where he was shot, and just forgot where he wrote the wound was located from story to story. ---
**Author:** ![MrAtoz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@MrAtoz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrAtoz)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/35 "2019-11-21T13:13:30Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Yes. It usually refers to a garnet, but not exclusively; one quickly-found definition reads: “a bright red gem, in particular a garnet cut en cabochon”. The Wikipedia definition, taken from the _Dictionary of Gems and Gemology_, is “any red gemstone, most often a red garnet”. > > If it ain’t red, it ain’t a carbuncle. Doyle seems to have been vaguely aware of that. From the story itself, from Holmes’s own mouth: “[the stone] is remarkable in having every characteristic of the carbuncle, save that it is blue in shade instead of ruby red.” Yes, I know, this amounts to saying that it’s just like a carbuncle, except for the only way that matters. But what are you gonna do? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/36 "2019-11-21T13:35:22Z")
> [@MrAtoz](#): > > Doyle seems to have been vaguely aware of that. From the story itself, from Holmes’s own mouth: “[the stone] is remarkable in having every characteristic of the carbuncle, save that it is blue in shade instead of ruby red.” > > Yes, I know, this amounts to saying that it’s just like a carbuncle, except for the only way that matters. But what are you gonna do? Gripe about it on the internet, like I do about everything else. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/37 "2019-11-21T16:49:52Z")
> [@MrAtoz](#): > > Doyle seems to have been vaguely aware of that. From the story itself, from Holmes’s own mouth: “[the stone] is remarkable in having every characteristic of the carbuncle, save that it is blue in shade instead of ruby red.” > > Yes, I know, this amounts to saying that it’s just like a carbuncle, except for the only way that matters. But what are you gonna do? It’s a bit like talking about a red sapphire. Sapphires can be any color, except that the red variety is called a ruby. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/38 "2019-11-21T18:09:42Z")
[_The Adventure of the Speckled Band_](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Adventure_of_the_Speckled_Band) struck me as being weirdly contrived, even by Doyle standards. And not just the usual mumbo jumbo like the snake, a “swamp adder”, being known to Holmes as the deadliest snake in India when no snake by that name exists there. So this snake, goes thru a ventilator. Skinnies down a fake bell cord. Goes right to the intended victim. Attacks and kills the victim\*. And then suitably retreats. The magically venomous snake, of course, being successfully brought back from India and kept alive for at least 8 years. Right. Plus all the other plot magic about who is where at the right time which the Big Bad should know and yet doesn’t alter his planning. - Succeeded once. Would have succeeded a 2nd time if Holmes hadn’t been there. And went right back to the ventilator and killed the Big Bad. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/39 "2019-11-21T18:16:40Z")
> [@ftg](#): > > The magically venomous snake, of course, being successfully brought back from India and kept alive for at least 8 years. Being kept in a safe, no less. No wonder it was pissed off. ---
**Author:** ![markn\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@markn\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markn_1)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2019, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691/40 "2019-11-21T18:48:12Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > I’ve seen it mentioned that the stories vary as to where Watson took that Jezail bullet. Early in the series (specifically, in Watson’s narration of his own backstory), he was shot in his shoulder. Later in the series, it’s mentioned somewhere that it was in his leg. Regarding simple inconsistencies, of which there are many, one glaring one is in _The Man with the Twisted Lip_, in which Watson’s wife calls him “James”. The “Haimish” explanation is ingenious but it’s certainly not what Doyle had in mind; it was just a mistake. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-sherlock-holmes-stories-wide-open-spoilers/843691.md?page=3)