# Plot Holes in World War II **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 22, 2012, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463 "2012-03-22T02:30:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![Sefton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@Sefton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sefton)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2018, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/281 "2018-05-09T12:09:08Z")
After the series ended, a spin-off was considered called [Operation Unthinkable](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Unthinkable). Probably a good thing it was never greenlit. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2018, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/282 "2018-05-09T23:27:29Z")
> [@Sunspace](#): > > I’m surprised there wasn’t one that could fly. > **[The Incredible Flying Tanks of WWII](https://gizmodo.com/the-flying-tanks-of-wwii-1526096981)** > > Given how devastatingly effective both newly-invented tank and airplane technologies proved during World War I, it was only a matter of time before enterprising military designers on both sides of the Atlantic thought to combine them into a flying... ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2018, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/283 "2018-05-10T00:53:11Z")
“Hey, let’s take a huge, multi-ton chunk of hardened steel and _ **make it fly!!!** _” Yeah, not ever the best idea. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![barath\_s](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/90ced4/32.png) [@barath\_s](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barath_s)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2018, 8:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/284 "2018-05-10T08:58:11Z")
The thing that gets me is that they have this completely dreaded set of [superweapons](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemical_weapons_in_World_War_I#History_of_poison_gas_in_World_War_I)in the prequel, things that cause 1.3 million causalties, stuff that everyone agrees was horrific. And they are hardly ever seen again !. The show almost completely skips out, opting to go instead for a different WMD, when all major parties had access to those previous ones… And don’t tell me they were banned before WW2 by international treaty, they were supposedly banned even before the prequel, and they still got used. It’s like building up a [superhero](https://www.cbr.com/overkill-15-ridiculously-overpowered-superheroes/), making him almost ridiculously overpowered, and then along comes the next episode and no mention is made of the previous strongest powers, going in a different directon instead. Or the time turner thing never being seen again. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2018, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/285 "2018-05-10T17:28:00Z")
Why have the Japanese, British and American helmets all be so similar at the start of “World War II”? They needed to be more visually distinct. The audience has to know who it’s looking at. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2018, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/286 "2018-05-10T17:30:26Z")
> [@barath\_s](#): > > It’s like building up a [superhero](https://www.cbr.com/overkill-15-ridiculously-overpowered-superheroes/), making him almost ridiculously overpowered, and then along comes the next episode and no mention is made of the previous strongest powers, going in a different directon instead. "Oh dear god, don’t call Superman into this. He’ll just wreck the entire damned city trying to ‘save’ it.’ 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2018, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/287 "2018-05-10T21:39:55Z")
The worst part for me was the Maginot line. Look, we criticized the freaking Empire for building a death star that had a convenient hole in it that could be used to blow up the whole thiing, and we’re supposed to believe that a great power would build an insurmountable barrier that the enemy could defeat by simply _driving around it_? That defies belief. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2018, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/288 "2018-05-10T23:47:52Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > The worst part for me was the Maginot line. Look, we criticized the freaking Empire for building a death star that had a convenient hole in it that could be used to blow up the whole thiing, and we’re supposed to believe that a great power would build an insurmountable barrier that the enemy could defeat by simply _driving around it_? That defies belief. Well in defense of that episode, there was a deleted scene that showed the German army going without sleep or rest for a week on amphetamine, moving faster than anyone thought was humanly possible. But the censors cut it. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2018, 11:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/289 "2018-05-12T11:40:01Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > We mentioned tokenism earlier - the lady riveters, the Black airmen, and so on - but did anyone spot a really glaring example from one of the early episodes? Not long after the outbreak of war, there’s this English guy demanding to be “re-enlisted” to the R.A.F. as a fighter pilot despite being, if you please, a double [amputee](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_Bader). That’s right - he’s had both his legs cut off. And, of course, in due deference to the differently able community, he’s got to be not just _a_ fighter pilot but a brilliant one, an inspirational leader, and eventually to be spotted, if you’re paying attention, leading the victory flypast in London after Germany’s been defeated. > > Technical hint, guys: fighter planes also have _control pedals_. :smack: Don’t forget the other example of pathos-oriented tokenism. The guy who helps break all the German codes is a closeted gay man. Goes to all the trouble of essentially inventing modern computers and then is essentially written out after the war for his sexuality. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 8:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/290 "2018-05-13T08:46:21Z")
And of course they had to figure out how to get a beautiful starlet into the movie, but come on! We’re supposed to believe that Hedy Lamarr was some kind of communications genius? You might as well cast Denise Rogers as a scientist. ---
**Author:** ![Atomic\_Alex](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atomic_alex/32/175_2.png) [@Atomic\_Alex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atomic_Alex)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/291 "2018-05-13T17:53:09Z")
> [@barath\_s](#): > > The thing that gets me is that they have this completely dreaded set of [superweapons](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemical_weapons_in_World_War_I#History_of_poison_gas_in_World_War_I)in the prequel, things that cause 1.3 million causalties, stuff that everyone agrees was horrific. > > And they are hardly ever seen again !. The show almost completely skips out, opting to go instead for a different WMD, when all major parties had access to those previous ones… > > And don’t tell me they were banned before WW2 by international treaty, they were supposedly banned even before the prequel, and they still got used. > > It’s like building up a [superhero](https://www.cbr.com/overkill-15-ridiculously-overpowered-superheroes/), making him almost ridiculously overpowered, and then along comes the next episode and no mention is made of the previous strongest powers, going in a different directon instead. > > Or the time turner thing never being seen again. Well they kind of wrote themselves into a corner with the ‘Atomic Bomb’, in the mini-series semi-sequel _“The Cold War”_ they had to come up with another ultimate-weapon, instead of using a little imagination they just went the Death Star route, “Hey lets make it bigger and better!”, so we end up with a Super-A-Bomb, called ‘The Hydrogen Bomb’. There aren’t enough roll-eyes smilies in the world. :rolleyes: Though admittedly the episode _‘The Cuban Factor’_ was pretty tense and watchable, the series big-bad guy backing down in the end was rather convenient and out of character though. I guess they didn’t have the budget to depict a full-on war or something. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/292 "2018-05-13T18:03:41Z")
> [@Atomic\_Alex](#): > > Though admittedly the episode _‘The Cuban Factor’_ was pretty tense and watchable, the series big-bad guy backing down in the end was rather convenient and out of character though. I guess they didn’t have the budget to depict a full-on war or something. Having the President’s attorney general be his kid brother was a bit unbelievable too. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/293 "2018-05-13T18:18:31Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > I see WWII as more of an epic bloody Marx Brothers film, with the Keystone Cops thrown in. Now that this was bumped, I need to mention one bit of poetic justice that was shown after the end credits of WWII. > **[The Time Groucho Marx Did the Charleston on Hitler's Grave](https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/30567/time-groucho-marx-did-charleston-hitlers-grave)** > > © Bettmann/CORBIS > > Groucho Marx is unmatched in wit and humor. But one of his most poignant moments wasn’t remotely funny, nor was it caught on camera like so many of his one-liners and zingers. > > During the summer of 1958, Groucho and his You Bet... > [@](#): > > Groucho had been very close to his mother - she was instrumental in launching her sons’ careers - and wanted Melinda to see Dornum, Germany, where her grandmother had been born. When they got to the little town of less than 5,000 people, the group wandered into a pub to inquire as to the whereabouts of the city cemetery. Dornum wasn’t exactly a tourist hotspot, so the locals were understandably curious about the visitors from the U.S. When Groucho explained, he found that no one in the pub had heard of the famous Marx Brothers. After going through a couple of his routines, he left with new fans and directions to the cemetery just down the hill. > > Though the group arrived at the Dornum Cemetery in good spirits, that quickly dissolved when they discovered that the entire Jewish section had been utterly destroyed. Though they went to the church on the grounds to locate burial records for Groucho’s grandparents and other relatives, the records were nowhere to be found. > > Several days later, Groucho had his chauffeur take their party of five to East Berlin, declaring he wanted to see the remains of the bunker where Hitler committed suicide. Judith Dwan Hallet, now 70, recalls that the mood had very much changed. Whereas Groucho had been passing the time between towns by singing and stopping the car to demand that the gang get out for silly photo ops, the ride to East Berlin was somber. > > When they arrived, Hallet said, it was as if the war had happened the day before. Nothing had been cleaned up or repaired; piles of rubble made the landscape look positively post-apocalyptic. The ruins of the Führerbunker were about 20 feet tall, but Groucho climbed to the top and proceeded to perform what Hallet called “a frenetic Charleston, for at least a minute or two, in a gesture of defiance.” ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/294 "2018-05-13T18:56:53Z")
> [@SecretaryofEvil](#): > > I liked: > > “the Soviet strongman whose name means “Man of Steel” in Russian (seriously, between calling the strongman “Man of Steel” and the Frenchman “de Gaulle”, whoever came up with the names for this thing ought to be shot).” The other Allied leaders have pretty fancifully heroic names too. Come on, Churchill, the “Church on the Hill”? Roosevelt, the “Field of Roses”? Even more implausible is name of the leader of the invasion of France from England, Eisenhower, the “Iron Hewer.” This is especially so in view of the fact that a Norman knight named [Taliaferro,](https://johnsonfamily.talldude.net/bartholomew-taliaferro-228/genstory/68/bartolomeo-taliaferro-possible-origins) which means the same thing, was a hero of the Norman Conquest when the invasion went the other way 900 years earlier. A completely implausible coincidence. Give me a break. The Bad Guys had names that were obviously intended to be ironic: Adolf, “The Noble Wolf,” Benito, “The Blessed,” Hirohito, “Abundant Benevolence.” ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2018, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/295 "2018-05-15T22:20:02Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > “Hey, let’s take a huge, multi-ton chunk of hardened steel and _ **make it fly!!!** _” > > Yeah, not ever the best idea. 😛 My God, they would have had to call it a Flying Fortress. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/296 "2018-05-16T00:11:06Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > The other Allied leaders have pretty fancifully heroic names too. Come on, Churchill, the “Church on the Hill”? Roosevelt, the “Field of Roses”? > > Even more implausible is name of the leader of the invasion of France from England, Eisenhower, the “Iron Hewer.” This is especially so in view of the fact that a Norman knight named [Taliaferro,](https://johnsonfamily.talldude.net/bartholomew-taliaferro-228/genstory/68/bartolomeo-taliaferro-possible-origins) which means the same thing, was a hero of the Norman Conquest when the invasion went the other way 900 years earlier. A completely implausible coincidence. Give me a break. > > The Bad Guys had names that were obviously intended to be ironic: Adolf, “The Noble Wolf,” Benito, “The Blessed,” Hirohito, “Abundant Benevolence.” Several decades ago, a fellow named Stewart Robb wrote an analysis of the names in “World War II” (in an essay called “Letter From A Higher Critic”) which made some of the points you make above. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/297 "2018-05-16T04:43:42Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > Having the President’s attorney general be his kid brother was a bit unbelievable too. Not to mention hiring a top Nazi scientist to head his farfetched, technologically impossible “Apollo Program.” ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/298 "2018-05-16T05:40:57Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > Several decades ago, a fellow named Stewart Robb wrote an analysis of the names in “World War II” (in an essay called “Letter From A Higher Critic”) which made some of the points you make above. Thanks for reminding me of the name of the story and the author. I think I read that in an anthology decades ago but couldn’t recall the name. IIRC The point of the story was of historians arguing thousand of years in the future whether or not WWII was a historical event or mythical. One of them contended it was obviously mythical because of all the evidently made-up names. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2018, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/299 "2018-05-16T13:00:35Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Thanks for reminding me of the name of the story and the author. I think I read that in an anthology decades ago but couldn’t recall the name. > > IIRC The point of the story was of historians arguing thousand of years in the future whether or not WWII was a historical event or mythical. One of them contended it was obviously mythical because of all the evidently made-up names. No problem. It came up on the board earlier [Help me find this Science Fiction short story - Cafe Society - Straight Dope Message Board](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=476861) (I was the friend of Wendell’s who identified it offline, which eventually led me to rejoin the board). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463.md?page=14)