# Plot Holes in World War II **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 22, 2012, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463 "2012-03-22T02:30:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/121 "2012-03-24T02:49:16Z")
[Jewish actress](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedy_Lamarr) escapes from fascist Austria, becomes a glamourous Hollywood star, and works on radio encryption in her spare time? Why didn’t they just name her Mary Sue? ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/122 "2012-03-24T05:24:50Z")
Then there was that short bit about them catching a Japanese spy transmitting morse code on the California coast because Lucille Ball thought she could hear morse transmissions being picked up by her fillings. Give me a break. ---
**Author:** ![audit1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ed8c4c/32.png) [@audit1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/audit1)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 5:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/123 "2012-03-24T05:29:23Z")
Did they really have to try to get the Trekkie audience by naming one of the carriers USS Enterprise? ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 9:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/124 "2012-03-24T09:29:15Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > You want far fetched? How about those [special bombs](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Chastise) that skipped (!) over the water order to blow up German dams? The attack was like something out of a science fiction movie. Heh, yeah. One attack plane at a time? Check. Dead straight and level through a storm of defensive fire? Check. Tiny target that you each get one chance to hit if you get to exactly the right place, time and speed? Check. All it was missing was the arch-villain in his night-fighter tailing each of the bombers as it goes in, and then the cynical gun-runner in his tricked-out armed DC3 coming over the horizon to blow the fighter off Gibson’s tail and yell “Yahoo! You’re all clear, kid!”. I swear I was _this_ close to throwing a brick through the TV. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/125 "2012-03-24T12:31:53Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > That was an early episode and they hadn’t really figured out yet where they were going with the series. It’s like how Spain and Manchuria and Czechoslovakia were all supposed to be major stories and they all ended up getting dropped. I heard that the writers deliberately introduced these plots, built them up, and then abandoned them deliberately because “real life often doesn’t have closure.” I don’t buy it. To me it just seems obvious they were making it up as they went along. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/126 "2012-03-24T12:53:43Z")
Ooooh, yeah, the whole pre-title credits intro thing with Manchuria. Just a little too neat to have the Japanese take the last emperor China and install him as the new puppet emperor of “Manchukuo,” wasn’t it? That should have warned me right then what a soap opera I was in for. (😕 Or maybe I’m thinking of _Tales of the Gold Monkey_? The two series had that “Flying Tiger” pilot crossover thing going.) ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/127 "2012-03-24T12:59:59Z")
Another thing that bugs me: why did they occasionally have the seemingly paranormal [“foo fighers”](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foo_fighter) popping up in the aerial episodes? They seemed completely out of left field and irrelevant to the plot, and I still haven’t heard any convincing explanation why the writers introduced them in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/128 "2012-03-24T13:18:21Z")
> [@audit1](#): > > Did they really have to try to get the Trekkie audience by naming one of the carriers USS Enterprise? Not just named after but the most decorated ship ofthe war to boot. ---
**Author:** ![wedgehed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8edcca/32.png) [@wedgehed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wedgehed)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/129 "2012-03-24T14:39:54Z")
They totally miscast the SS hierarchy. That Heydrich dude should have been in charge. He was the hard core, blond, strapping, personification of “the master race”. I feel they wasted this character by having him OD on car seat fabric. And, _puh-leeze_, they make the top dog of the SS a _Mr. Peepers_ wannabe. Yeah. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Levolor\_the\_Blind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/bc8723/32.png) [@Levolor\_the\_Blind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Levolor_the_Blind)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/130 "2012-03-24T15:12:32Z")
I agree with the posters who think the whole “atomic superweapon ends the war” ending was just weak. I mean we have this big build up to an invasion of Japan and they just… end it. Kind of like the fourth season of Babylon 5. To be fair, I read somewhere (sorry no cite) that the series was losing viewers and “the suits” had decided to cancel, so maybe this was the best end they could give it. I think it reached its peak in the Stalingrad and Kursk episodes (I know some people rave about Bagaration, but I’m just _meh_.) Kursk, particularly was freakin’ epic. Anyway, I remember reading some spin-off novels back in the seventies (the titles escape me). One was about an invisible American destroyer and the other about Germans going to the moon. Sci-fi, obviously, and very cheesey. Were these ever canon? The last, Google shows me, is being made into a movie. What, has the copyright expired on the war and anyone can use the characters? ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/131 "2012-03-24T16:01:54Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > You argue very skilfully - it’s just that I think you’re making a mistake if you assume these writers could write their way out of a bowl of alphabet soup. 😃 > > I wonder if you noticed a couple of things that were quite subtly handled (yeah, blind squirrel and all that)? The writers would have us believe that the P-51 didn’t really get legs until the _British_ put one of their own engines in it. Later (sorry, I don’t have your faithful recall of episode numbers and titles! 😛 ) we get those same _British_ thinking of putting a kick-ass gun in the Sherman - the conversion was called “Firefly”. I haven’t yet spotted the English name in the credits, but I wonder how he managed to slip that past the rest of the team. You’re thinking of Episode 3.04, “Europe Ablaze.” I kind of liked the device of the clever British coming up with neat little innovations that the hero gets to use. It was, I thought, a clear tribute to the Q character in James Bond films, with the Americans playing the role of Bond. And in fairness, they’re consistent; it’s not just in “Europe Ablaze,” but also Episode 1.12, “Enigma,” and 1.06, “Their Finest Hour,” where they talk about radar. I agree there’s just too much of this “Wesley/Geordi come up with a magical technical fix to the problem” stuff; someone already mentioned Episode 2.11, “Dambusters.” But for most of the series it was kind of set up that way, with the two sides coming up with these little incremental advantages. In a way that was kind of one of the plot drivers, and that was cool. How many shows have the adversaries winning with their BRAINS, rather than just brawn and sheer luck? Not many. But when the Americans used this “Atomic bomb” thing, that just nuked my suspension of disbelief, because it didn’t fit the pattern of the show; rather than another incremental advantage it’s just “well, now we can blow up whole cities. The show’s over, folks.” I think they were worried the show was going to be cancelled - it looked really expensive to make - and so they just slapped a quick ending on. It’s too bad. I know a guy who knew the producer’s assistant, and he got be an unshot script for what would have been Episode 6.01, “Olympic.” It was about them invading Japan. It was fucking epic. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/132 "2012-03-24T16:04:19Z")
I bet. They could have probably milked the Ninja meme for a couple years at least. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/133 "2012-03-24T16:23:37Z")
They could have at least made the “atomic bomb” plot device halfway believable by having it be a race between the Allies and the Axis to be the first to develop one, with America just barely in time, what with the whole “Nazi superweapons” thing. At a minimum I expected that Hitler would detonate the first prototype in Berlin and go out in a gotterdammerung blaze of glory. But to have it turn out that the Nazis were never even close, because Hitler didn’t believe in “Jewish physics”? ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/134 "2012-03-24T17:36:59Z")
Anyone else feel the “desperate improvisation by plucky British” card was overplayed to exhaustion? Someone mentioned the business with the torpedo biplanes :rolleyes: already, but what about one of the few episodes I can remember by name, “Chariots Afire” (oh please). It was [all about](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St_Nazaire_Raid) denying the Germans use of a big French dock on the Atlantic coast. Fine, a seaborne raid, lots of flashes, bangs, men rushing ashore, demolition sequences and impressive-looking models getting blown up in an interesting fashion, I’ve no quarrel with that. Only the writers plainly decided that it would be much too straightforward like that, so, if you please, what we’re going to have is a Lend-Lease destroyer gutted, stuffed with explosives, rammed into the dock gates, while the supporting commandos come ashore from launches. Wooden launches with petrol engines. They’re floating Ronsons that go up if you look at them funny. I mean, this is all meant to be going down in the mid 20th century, am I right? I literally :smack: ed at the part where Admiral Karl Dönitz inspects St Nazaire the day before the raid and actually asks about plans for an enemy commando raid, only to be told “Oh, that would never happen, Herr Admiral - it would be far too dangerous for them to try”. Cliche much, scriptwriters? I suppose if you like that kind of thing, loads of boats blowing up in flames in the teeth of what look like hundreds of coastal gun emplacements and the sight of this wrecked ship with the bomb aboard waiting to blow while the commandos are scurrying around demolishing anything in sight, it’s all right, but you get tired of watching the death-toll mounting like it was a Bloons game, and the closing credits solemnly informing us that five Victoria Crosses were awarded, two of them posthumous, along with 80-odd other medals, was just blatant heart-string tugging. I mean, seriously, who trains up an elite strike force only to see more than a quarter of it buy the farm and another third taken prisoner? ---
**Author:** ![Atomic\_Alex](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atomic_alex/32/175_2.png) [@Atomic\_Alex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atomic_Alex)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/135 "2012-03-24T18:25:04Z")
I don’t know, while I enjoyed the series I couldn’t really suspend disbelief regarding the whole ‘Hitler’ character. I mean if you’re going for cartoonish over-the-top supervillianary at least get someone that _looks_ the part. Or perhaps it was concious irony on the writers part, I mean could they have found anyone who was _less_ like a supposed leader of the blonde-haired blue-eyed Aryan master-race? Roosevelt was interesting but I thought they played up the emotional heart-string tugging with the constant hints about his ill-health and subtle references to his wheelchair a little too much, whoever played the Churchill character looks like he had a lot of fun though with his rousing speeches and providing some occassional comic-relief. Stalin was kind of cool but its just a pity that they killed him off, I would suggest thats a significent reason why the sequel got cancelled. Although the comedy mini-series ‘Kruschev Does America’ had its moments. ---
**Author:** ![Rick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9f8e36/32.png) [@Rick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/136 "2012-03-24T19:17:31Z")
The entire thing about the Japanese not setting their depth charges to go off deep enough until a member of the US Congress mentioned this fact, and the Japanese then started setting their depth charges deeper causing more sub losses it just crazy. That could never happen in real life. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/137 "2012-03-24T19:17:33Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > You’re thinking of Episode 3.04, “Europe Ablaze.” > > I kind of liked the device of the clever British coming up with neat little innovations that the hero gets to use. It was, I thought, a clear tribute to the Q character in James Bond films, with the Americans playing the role of Bond. And in fairness, they’re consistent; it’s not just in “Europe Ablaze,” but also Episode 1.12, “Enigma,” and 1.06, “Their Finest Hour,” where they talk about radar. > > I agree there’s just too much of this “Wesley/Geordi come up with a magical technical fix to the problem” stuff; someone already mentioned Episode 2.11, “Dambusters.” But for most of the series it was kind of set up that way, with the two sides coming up with these little incremental advantages. In a way that was kind of one of the plot drivers, and that was cool. How many shows have the adversaries winning with their BRAINS, rather than just brawn and sheer luck? Not many. > > But when the Americans used this “Atomic bomb” thing, that just nuked my suspension of disbelief, because it didn’t fit the pattern of the show; rather than another incremental advantage it’s just “well, now we can blow up whole cities. The show’s over, folks.” > > I think they were worried the show was going to be cancelled - it looked really expensive to make - and so they just slapped a quick ending on. It’s too bad. I know a guy who knew the producer’s assistant, and he got be an unshot script for what would have been Episode 6.01, “Olympic.” It was about them invading Japan. It was fucking epic. All those tech jumps really were ripped off from E.E. “Doc” Smith anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/138 "2012-03-24T19:28:53Z")
We mentioned tokenism earlier - the lady riveters, the Black airmen, and so on - but did anyone spot a really glaring example from one of the early episodes? Not long after the outbreak of war, there’s this English guy demanding to be “re-enlisted” to the R.A.F. as a fighter pilot despite being, if you please, a double [amputee](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_Bader). That’s right - he’s had both his legs cut off. And, of course, in due deference to the differently able community, he’s got to be not just _a_ fighter pilot but a brilliant one, an inspirational leader, and eventually to be spotted, if you’re paying attention, leading the victory flypast in London after Germany’s been defeated. Technical hint, guys: fighter planes also have _control pedals_. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/139 "2012-03-24T20:04:10Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > We mentioned tokenism earlier - the lady riveters, the Black airmen, and so on - but did anyone spot a really glaring example from one of the early episodes? Not long after the outbreak of war, there’s this English guy demanding to be “re-enlisted” to the R.A.F. as a fighter pilot despite being, if you please, a double [amputee](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_Bader). That’s right - he’s had both his legs cut off. And, of course, in due deference to the differently able community, he’s got to be not just _a_ fighter pilot but a brilliant one, an inspirational leader, and eventually to be spotted, if you’re paying attention, leading the victory flypast in London after Germany’s been defeated. > > Technical hint, guys: fighter planes also have _control pedals_. :smack: Wow, I missed that episode, but it actually sounds pretty cool and amazing the way they pulled it all off. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2012, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463/140 "2012-03-24T20:34:27Z")
I hated when they invaded North Africa at “Casablanca,” as a blatant product plug for the movie. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plot-holes-in-world-war-ii/616463.md?page=8)