# Plural Of 'Mouse' ( Computer)? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 2, 2022, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101 "2022-01-02T22:27:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 6:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/81 "2022-01-06T06:37:49Z")
> [@Schnitte](#): > > > [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > > > Normally in English a new use for a word that has an irregular plural is given a regular plural. > > Do you have examples for that? It’s hard for me to think of examples where a word with an irregular plural acquires a new use. The Merriam-Webster page on the plural of octopus (linked a few posts above) cites “octopus” as an example. It is used figuratively to mean any multi-branched thing. Several examples of this usage are given, in the plural. Merriam-Webster asserts that, whatever plural one might use for a multiplicity of eight-legged cephalopods, the plural for the figurative use is “octopuses”. (ETA: This, if I read right, coming from a time when “octopi” was still the usual accepted plural, I think.) The same page also notes that the Greek-ish plural “octopodes” is pronounced with the accent on the second syllable: oc-TOP-o-deez. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 8:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/82 "2022-01-06T08:15:42Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > In Hebrew, there is even a special plural form for things that come in pairs, roughly equivalent to saying in English “a pair of \_\_\_\_\_\_\_”. The use of “both” and “either” in English are remnants of the [Dual grammatical number](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_(grammatical_number)) that existed in Indo-European and persists to varying degrees in descendant languages. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/83 "2022-01-06T13:12:57Z")
Slovene, for example, still retains the dual number. Interestingly, things that naturally come in pairs, like hands or legs, typically get inflected in the plural, not the dual. ---
**Author:** ![Francis\_Vaughan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/francis_vaughan/32/3093_2.png) [@Francis\_Vaughan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Francis_Vaughan)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/84 "2022-01-06T13:34:40Z")
I remember a discussion about mouse types in the early 80’s. It was suggested that a foot operated mouse was actually a rat. Optical mice didn’t supersede ball driven mice, optical mice were around long before the Apple Lisa or Mac. They were however expensive. Mouse systems sold the default optical mouse for workstations. We bought one in early 1983. It was eye wateringly expensive. Many hundreds of dollars. Later when we bought out first Sun workstations (we bought a Sun-1, I still have it) and they came with Mouse Systems optical mice. That would have been about 1984. Even the later Sun 3 workstations did from memory. The Mouse Systems mice used a special mouse pad ruled with lines visible in optical and IR, so different LEDs and sensors could see horizontal and vertical lines. Interestingly they had two sensors, and could detect rotation of the mouse as well. Nobody ever used that capability. 3 buttons too. > **[Mouse Systems](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mouse_Systems)** > > Pages for logged out editors learn more > > > > Mouse Systems Corporation (MSC), formerly Rodent Associates, was founded in 1982 by Steve Kirsch. The company was responsible for bringing the mouse to the IBM PC for the first time. > Mouse Systems' optical mouse, wired to a Sun workstation and an Atari 400 running Missile Command, attracted many observers at the October, 1982 Mini/Micro '82 conference in Anaheim, attended by over 10000 people—and won a "best new product" award. ---
**Author:** ![Schnitte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/schnitte/32/9033_2.png) [@Schnitte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Schnitte)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/85 "2022-01-06T13:43:09Z")
Czech still has the dual for body parts that come in pairs. In addition, it uses, as I understand it, the genitive plural if the number you’re talking about is more than four, as any German who’s ever had to order beer during a party weekend in Prague can attest. You would ask for “four beers”, but “five of the beers”. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/86 "2022-01-06T16:06:23Z")
> [@Schnitte](#): > > In addition, it uses, as I understand it, the genitive plural if the number you’re talking about is more than four, as any German who’s ever had to order beer during a party weekend in Prague can attest. You would ask for “four beers”, but “five of the beers”. Polish does this, too, as do a lot of the Slavic languages. It can get really weird. Rather than going through it by memory, here’s the rules according to Wikipedia: > - The numeral _jeden_ (1) behaves as an ordinary adjective, and no special rules apply. It can even be used in the plural, for example to mean “some” (and not others), or to mean “one” with [pluralia tantum](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pluralia_tantum), e.g. _jedne drzwi_ “one door” ( _drzwi_ has no singular). > - After the numerals _dwa_ , _trzy_ , _cztery_ (2, 3, 4), and compound numbers ending with them (22, 23, 24, etc. but not 12, 13, or 14, which take _-naście_ as a suffix and are thus not compound numbers in the first place), the noun is plural and takes the same case as the numeral, and the resulting noun phrase is plural (e.g. _4 koty stały_ , “4 cats stood”). > - With other numbers (5, 6, etc., 20, 21, 25, etc.), if the numeral is nominative or accusative, the noun takes the genitive plural form, and the resulting noun phrase is neuter singular (e.g. _5 kotów stało_ , “5 cats stood”). > - With the masculine personal plural forms of numbers (as given in the [morphology](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_morphology#Numbers_and_quantifiers) article section), the rule given above – that if the numeral is nominative or accusative, the noun is genitive plural **and** the resulting phrase is neuter singular – applies to _all_ numbers other than 1 (as in _trzech mężczyzn przyszło_ , “three men came”), unless the alternative nominative forms _dwaj_ , _trzej_ , _czterej_ (for 2, 3, 4) are used (these take nominative nouns and form a masculine plural phrase). > - If the numeral is in the genitive, dative, instrumental or locative, the noun takes the same case as the numeral (except sometimes in the case of numbers that end with the nouns for 1000 and higher quantities, which often take a genitive noun regardless since they are treated as normal nouns). From [here](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_grammar#Numbers_and_quantifiers). So, yeah, it’s a pain in the butt. I grew up speaking Polish, but a lot of these rules have been lost in the time I’ve learned them. As a once-native speaker (I wouldn’t call my Polish quite native any more, even though it was the first language I learned), I never really thought of all these changes, but rather what sounded right, so I never really thought of as “four beers” and “five of the beers” so much as “four beers” and “five beers” but for some reason the word ending and verb changes. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/87 "2022-01-06T16:48:19Z")
Octopus is a word with multiple plurals. Mouse just has one normally. The parallel would be if, say, thief didn’t go to thieves but to thiefs or wife didn’t go to wives but to wifes. As in if “work husbands” were paralleled by regularizing it as “work wifes,” which Google says it occasionally is. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/88 "2022-01-06T17:01:33Z")
> [@Francis\_Vaughan](#): > > The Mouse Systems mice used a special mouse pad ruled with lines visible in optical and IR, so different LEDs and sensors could see horizontal and vertical lines. I remember having one of these as a kid for our old Mac. Not only did it have a grid on the pad, but it was reflective like a mirror. I remember having to clean the pad a few times to make sure the mouse kept working. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/89 "2022-01-06T17:02:26Z")
Honestly, I find it hard to believe that this thread has gone on as long as it has. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/90 "2022-01-06T17:11:02Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > (ETA: This, if I read right, coming from a time when “octopi” was still the usual accepted plural, I think.) [octopus - Wiktionary, the free dictionary](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/octopus#:~:text=The%20Oxford%20English%20Dictionary%20lists,and%20that%20octopi%20is%20incorrect). - _Sources differ on which plurals are acceptable: [Fowler’s Modern English Usage](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fowler%27s_Modern_English_Usage) asserts that “the only acceptable plural in English is [octopuses](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/octopuses#English) ”, while [Merriam-Webster](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merriam-Webster) and other dictionaries accept octopi as a plural form. The [Oxford English Dictionary](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxford_English_Dictionary) lists octopuses , octopi , and octopodes (the order reflecting decreasing frequency of use), stating that the last form is rare. The [online Oxford dictionary](https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/octopus) states that the standard plural is octopuses , that octopodes is still occasionally used, and that octopi is incorrect._ > **[Dictionary.com | Meanings & Definitions of English Words](https://www.dictionary.com/)** > > The world's leading online dictionary: English definitions, synonyms, word origins, example sentences, word games, and more. A trusted authority for 25+ years! ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/91 "2022-01-06T17:32:25Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > it was always Octopuses, never octopi. [Historically, the first plural to commonly appear in English language sources, in the early 19th century, is the latinate form “octopi”; followed by the English form “octopuses” in the later half of the same century.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octopus) ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/92 "2022-01-06T18:30:00Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > Octopus is a word with multiple plurals. Mouse just has one normally. Octopus is a word with multiple plurals. Or multiple plurales? Multiple plurali? Multiple pluralz? Mouse just has one normally, but multiple plurali abnormally. > [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Honestly, I find it hard to believe that this thread has gone on as long as it has. Srsly! This thread has 91 posti already! Or 91 pestodes (pronounced pes-TOAD-eez)? Postae? The traction that this thread has acquired is, in itself, evidence of the multiple normal and abnormal pluralae of mousae that at least some people (peoples? persons? personae?) accept. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/93 "2022-01-06T18:41:28Z")
> [@Francis\_Vaughan](#): > > Later when we bought out first Sun workstations (we bought a Sun-1, I still have it) Side-topic question: What CPU processor was in the Sun-1 workstation? Was it the Intel 80386 (circa late 1980s or so)? Or something earlier than that? ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/94 "2022-01-06T18:48:28Z")
I have a similar keyboard from [Kinesis](https://gaming.kinesis-ergo.com/edge/). I love it to pieces. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/95 "2022-01-06T20:54:03Z")
That cite is from the cite that list Octopi as legit, so I have my doubts. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/96 "2022-01-06T21:03:28Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > I have my doubts. So you don’t trust any cite that lists Octopi as a legitimate term for evidence that Octopi was the original plural form of Octopus? That’s pretty unassailable I guess. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/97 "2022-01-06T21:06:41Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > That cite is from the cite that list Octopi as legit, so I have my doubts. The source that “octopi” dates to the 19th Century appears to be [Origins of the Specious](https://www.google.com/books/edition/Origins_of_the_Specious/hsu47CBwJPUC?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=octopi) rather than Merriam-Webster. > many people believe “octopi” is classier than “octopuses.” This misconception dates back to the 19th century. (You might say it’s got legs.) NB: the author prefers “octopuses”. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2022, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/98 "2022-01-06T22:39:09Z")
Sorry, you can’t embed media items in a post. the big Oxford shows the earliest known use of a plural to be Octopuses. ---
**Author:** ![Francis\_Vaughan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/francis_vaughan/32/3093_2.png) [@Francis\_Vaughan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Francis_Vaughan)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2022, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/99 "2022-01-07T01:24:37Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > What CPU processor was in the Sun-1 workstation? Motorola 68000. In the Sun-1 I’m pretty sure it was the basic 68000. Sun-2 was 68010, and Sun-3 was 68020. Sun had to roll their own MMU in the Sun-1 and Sun-2. The Sun-1 could be upgraded to a Sun-2 by swapping the CPU card. Sparc didn’t come until Sun-4. There was a 80386 Sun, but it only lasted one model. It came out late in the game, as a side product. It was never part of the main line up. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2022, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101/100 "2022-01-07T01:42:30Z")
> [@Francis\_Vaughan](#): > > There was a 80386 Sun, but it only lasted one model. It came out late in the game, as a side product. It was never part of the main line up. I worked for a company (possibly THE company) that tried to develop an engineering/CAD/CAM workstation around the nascent 80386 Sun workstation, running some version of Unix and X-windows, circa 1987-1988. We never got it out the door. The company went belly-up a year or so later. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plural-of-mouse-computer/957101.md?page=6)