# Plurals in English Are Weird **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [February 24, 2021, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657 "2021-02-24T17:36:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/41 "2021-02-24T20:11:02Z")
> [@FastDan1](#): > > bras + s = brass? Interesting. Is “brass” a singular noun? I think of it as an uncountable noun (“My brassiere is made of three pounds of brass”) and as a collective noun (“I tried to wear my brassiere at the press conference, but the brass objected”). In the latter sense, I suppose it’s singular. ---
**Author:** ![furryman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/furryman/32/99_2.png) [@furryman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furryman)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/42 "2021-02-24T20:12:13Z")
I personally like the idea of using Latin plurals at the end of English words. But grammar purists will insist Hippopotimi and octopi are wrong. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/43 "2021-02-24T20:17:52Z")
> [@furryman](#): > > But grammar purists will insist Hippopotimi and octopi are wrong. If it were it to be it would be Hippopotami. ---
**Author:** ![FastDan1](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fastdan1/32/427_2.png) [@FastDan1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FastDan1)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/44 "2021-02-24T20:20:25Z")
From [Google Dictionary](https://googledictionary.freecollocation.com/meaning?word=brass) > brass 中文解釋 wordnet sense Collocation Usage Collins Definition > Noun /bras/,Font size: > brasses, plural; > > A yellow alloy of copper and zinc > > - a brass plate on the door > A decorative object made of such an alloy > - shining brasses stood on the mantelpiece ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/45 "2021-02-24T20:20:54Z")
> [@furryman](#): > > I personally like the idea of using Latin plurals at the end of English words. But grammar purists will insist Hippopotimi and octopi are wrong. This complaint commonly stems from the observation that many such words are actually of Greek rather than Latin origin, and thus the Latin style plurals are non-sequiters. If the original plurals are to be retained at all, they should be the Greek plurals. It’s [not entirely clear if “octopus” was ever a Greek word](https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/the-many-plurals-of-octopus-octopi-octopuses-octopodes) but it does appear, at least, to be constructed from Greek roots (octo- and -pus), thus the plural should be “octopodes” – a particularly unfamiliar form of plural in English. The correct pronunciation would put the accent on the second syllable: oc-TOP-a-deez. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/46 "2021-02-24T20:24:26Z")
> [@furryman](#): > > Some comedian suggested that since the plural of ox is oxen, the plural of box should be boxen. That was probably Brian Regan: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/QWzYaZDK6Is/hqdefault.jpg "Brian Regan-Stupid In School") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWzYaZDK6Is&t=112) ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/47 "2021-02-24T20:58:03Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > This complaint commonly stems from the observation that many such words are actually of Greek rather than Latin origin, and thus the Latin style plurals are non-sequiters. If the original plurals are to be retained at all, they should be the Greek plurals. However, apparently both hippopotamus and octopus, although originally Greek, came into English through Latin, rather than directly from Greek. So there would be some justification for using the Latin plural. I personally prefer the English plurals. The plural octopods is used in the scientific literature, as well as the singular form octopod. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/48 "2021-02-24T21:01:57Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > The plural octopods is used in the scientific literature, as well as the singular form octopod. If I saw “octopods” in scientific usage, I’d be inclined to think it means “the class of octopus-like critters”, analogous to “canid(s)” or “felid(s)”. I was hoping (hint, hint) you would chime in with a discussion of the use, or absence, of adjunct nouns in Spanish. Am I correct in understanding that the construct doesn’t exist? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/49 "2021-02-24T21:02:08Z")
Of course, you have the ambiguity of “mile”, or really any other unit, when used in partial format. If something is about 2500 feet away, you could either say that it is a half mile, or that it is point five miles away. Then there’s a pretty unique word, one that can be made singular to plural with the addition of the letter “c”. die dice ---
**Author:** ![WildaBeast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wildabeast/32/6_2.png) [@WildaBeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WildaBeast)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/50 "2021-02-24T21:09:12Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I’ve always enjoyed it when [McMansionHell.com](http://McMansionHell.com)… Woah! The most recent post on that site (the one titled [The McMansion Hell Yearbook: 1978](https://mcmansionhell.com/post/642041488001335296/the-mcmansion-hell-yearbook-1978)) is from the area where I grew up! And that house almost kinda sorta looks familiar, although I’m sure there were many houses with that same general style built in that era. [End of hijack] > [@](#): > > …refers to “an art” in reference to some random wall hanging in a picture from a real estate listing. Now I’m reminded of the _Futurama_ episode where Zoidberg thinks he’s rich because he got a $300 stimulus check, so he decides to buy some art because that’s what rich people do. He does this by going to a snooty gallery and asking for “one art, please”. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/51 "2021-02-24T21:16:20Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > I was hoping (hint, hint) you would chime in with a discussion of the use, or absence, of adjunct nouns in Spanish. Am I correct in understanding that the construct doesn’t exist? The normal construction would be to use a construction with “de”. Baby food would be comida de bebe. Informally, it would be possible to omit the de, but this is sloppy. You can also use para instead of de. Cuchillo de carne and cuchillo para carne both mean “steak knife.” ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/52 "2021-02-24T21:18:24Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Informally, it would be possible to omit the de, but this is sloppy. As I noted above, phrases like “pollo burrito” are commonly heard, but I interpret this as being distinctly Spanglish. ---
**Author:** ![jnglmassiv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f07891/32.png) [@jnglmassiv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jnglmassiv)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/53 "2021-02-24T22:01:27Z")
> [@WildaBeast](#): > > And inversely, why is “pants” always plural in English? When I was a kid, we’d get our school uniforms from an independent men’s clothing store. I always hated it but the owner guy called that garment a pant. “Let’s see how this pant fits.” ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/54 "2021-02-24T22:11:53Z")
> [@CairoCarol](#): > > Peculiar sounding plurals like the milk example from @Left_Hand_of_Dorkness can be solved by use of a classifier - probably what you’d say is “a couple of cartons of milk” rather than “a couple of milks.” Would you feel a similar need to “solve” someone saying “a couple of beers”? ---
**Author:** ![WildaBeast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wildabeast/32/6_2.png) [@WildaBeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WildaBeast)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/55 "2021-02-24T22:28:18Z")
> [@jnglmassiv](#): > > When I was a kid, we’d get our school uniforms from an independent men’s clothing store. I always hated it but the owner guy called that garment a pant. “Let’s see how this pant fits.” I assume he wasn’t a native English speaker? IIRC in some (most?) languages the word for that garment is singular. Learning that was what made me realize how weird it is that it’s plural in English. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/56 "2021-02-24T22:29:23Z")
“One Hippotimi can not get on a bus - because one Hippotimi is two hippopotamus” (Allen Sherman) [One Hippopotami (Allan Sherman) - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umlBrQoG6xk) ---
**Author:** ![CairoCarol](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cairocarol/32/3825_2.png) [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/57 "2021-02-24T22:35:18Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > Would you feel a similar need to “solve” someone saying “a couple of beers”? Lots of foods and beverages work fine without a classifier, other foods don’t. Sometimes it’s obvious why (you could say “a couple of potato salads” but you wouldn’t say “a couple of potato chips” if you meant two servings) and other times it’s just strange. Two juices is fine, but I’d never say two fudges, it would have to be two pieces of fudge. Judging from this thread, pluralizing “milk” to mean “servings of milk” falls just fine on some ears and is strange to others. Maybe it’s regional, I dunno. ---
**Author:** ![jnglmassiv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f07891/32.png) [@jnglmassiv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jnglmassiv)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/58 "2021-02-24T22:39:58Z")
> [@WildaBeast](#): > > I assume he wasn’t a native English speaker? I don’t think so and, if so, he spoke otherwise unaccented English. I remember joking with my siblings about it. “I can’t find a clean pant.” ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2021, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/59 "2021-02-24T22:48:20Z")
> [@CairoCarol](#): > > other times it’s just strange Yes, I think in my dialect “a couple of juices” or “a couple of milks” would usually mean single-serving cartons; when milk or juice is served in glasses I’d tend use the classifier, and if buying two large cartons at a supermarket I’d use a classifier. “A couple of beers” is fine when it’s served in any single-serving container including a glass. There really doesn’t seem to be much logical consistency to colloquial usage. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2021, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657/60 "2021-02-25T00:15:18Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > Yes, I think in my dialect “a couple of juices” or “a couple of milks” would usually mean single-serving cartons; when milk or juice is served in glasses I’d tend use the classifier I think I’d use it to refer to glasses if it were used alongside others in a similar pattern. For instance, “two coffees, an orange juice, and two milks” used when ordering breakfast. But if _just_ ordering milk, I think I’d add the “glasses”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/plurals-in-english-are-weird/933657.md?page=4)