# Police kill suspect in PS3 robbery **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 5, 2006, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946 "2006-12-05T15:51:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 6:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/41 "2006-12-07T06:44:04Z")
I think it’s a bit too early to condemn the cops as being trigger-happy psychopaths; while I understand **Diogenes’** cynicism, let’s remember that Strickland wasn’t entirely a doe-eyed innocent either – as **MagicEyes** pointed out, he was charged with assault a few months prior, and he was reknown to neighbors for having excessively [loud and rowdy](http://www.wilmingtonstar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20061203/NEWS/612030440/-1/State) parties in the past. Throw in the fact that Strickland was already known to own several firearms, and the possibility that his dog might have attack the officers (and was shot in the process), and it’s not a big stretch that maybe – _maybe,_ mind you – the cops genuinely believed they were in danger. Insufficient data; try again later. ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/42 "2006-12-07T16:38:51Z")
Cop goes into a guys house who is under suspicion of producing pirated DVD’s, see a shiny object in his hand, knowing nothing else about the guy, and with no other reason for shooting, would be in the wrong. Cop goes into the house of a known violent person regarding an alleged ARMED ROBBERY by the suspect have suspect turn towards them with an object that could be mistaken for the same weapon used in the armed robbery, unless proven otherwise, are probably in the right. If you just comitted an armed robbery chances are yopu still have that gun at least in your house, right? And quite possbily on your person. In general, once a cop 100% determines the item in a guys hand is in fact a gun, its probably too late. If the reports of the dead guy beating the shit out of someone for something as minor as a video game console, I say it doesn’t matter if he was holding his dick in his hand, one less piece of shit thug in the world. Another example of someone, who had they not committed an (alleged) VIOLENT CRIME would be alive and well. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/43 "2006-12-07T16:46:18Z")
[QUOTE=Wee Bairn] If the reports of the dead guy beating the shit out of someone for something as minor as a video game console, I say it doesn’t matter if he was holding his dick in his hand, one less piece of shit thug in the world. [/QUOTE] I guess it was only a matter of time before the Moron Nation sent a representative to this thread. ---
**Author:** ![grayhairedmomma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/47e85d/32.png) [@grayhairedmomma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grayhairedmomma)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/44 "2006-12-07T16:52:38Z")
[QUOTE=Mince] This is very suspect to me. Did the officers ring the doorbell first? “Please come outside Mr. alleged viloent criminal.” Their protocol for apprehending a viloent suspect includes prior notification? Why “bash the door in” if you’re going to knock first? Why was the suspect/victim going to the door if the officers didn’t knock? Of course much is still unknown and unanswered; and I soundly reserve my judgement. But for the reason laid out above, I at least am willing to consider the officers may have been justified in shooting the suspect.\*\*emphasis added [/QUOTE] In the other thread it was said that the police yell something to the effect of “this is the police open up!” before bashing down the door. Perhaps the guy was doing what they said and they burst in before he could open the door. Maybe he heard some commotion on the steps outside the door and went to see who was out there because he wasn’t expecting anyone? Maybe he was opening the door to get some fresh air? ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/45 "2006-12-07T16:55:22Z")
From **rjung** ’s link: > [@](#): > > That’s the Friday when UNCW student Justin Raines was among the first at the Market Street Wal-Mart to buy two coveted PlayStation 3 consoles, released that day. > > When Raines came home to the on-campus Seahawk Village apartments after midnight with the games he bought for $641 apiece, two white men in a gold Pontiac pulled up to Raines’ car, struck him with a six-inch blunt object and stole his purchases, leaving him with bumps and bruises, UNCW police said. > > Because of safety concerns, UNCW Police Chief David Donaldson requested the help of sheriff’s deputies to serve the warrants on Strickland, according to a university news release. From an article linked to that page: > [@](#): > > An Internet image of three smiling young men hoisting a shotgun, an assault rifle and handguns might have given New Hanover County sheriff’s deputies cause to believe a suspect in a Nov. 17 robbery of two Sony PlayStation3 game systems from a college student was armed and dangerous. > > Information contained in a search warrant carried out Friday night that culminated in the shooting death of 18-year-old Peyton Strickland shows authorities knew about the presence of weapons inside the house at 533 Long Leaf Acres Drive. It seems that the officers had cause for concern of facing an armed situation. I don’t feel this alone absolves them - it is only one point in their favor. ---
**Author:** ![Ghanima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Ghanima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ghanima)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/46 "2006-12-07T18:24:08Z")
I’m giving the cops the benefit of the doubt on this one. If it was my husband or dad knocking on the door of a violent criminal known to be armed, I’d sure as hell want him to shoot the guy if there was even a hint of him holding a weapon. I’d much prefer the good guys survive at the end of the day. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/47 "2006-12-07T19:39:20Z")
[QUOTE=Ghanima] I’m giving the cops the benefit of the doubt on this one. If it was my husband or dad knocking on the door of a violent criminal known to be armed, I’d sure as hell want him to shoot the guy if there was even a hint of him holding a weapon. I’d much prefer the good guys survive at the end of the day. [/QUOTE] I think everyone wants the good guys to survive at the end of the day. However, not all police are the good guys, and not all those on the receiving end of a bullet are the bad guys. When good guys make catastophic mistakes, no one wins. ---
**Author:** ![Mince](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecd19e/32.png) [@Mince](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mince)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/48 "2006-12-07T21:35:00Z")
[QUOTE=grayhairedmomma] In the other thread it was said that the police yell something to the effect of “this is the police open up!” before bashing down the door. Perhaps the guy was doing what they said and they burst in before he could open the door. [/QUOTE] That’s the thing. Why announce yourself when you are going to make a potentially dangerous arrest? I don’t believe it’s required by law in this circumstance. Why command a suspect to “open up” microseconds before “opening up” for him. Of course the suspect would head for the door in that instance, and just might have something innocuous in his hand that looks like a weapon. > [@](#): > > Maybe he heard some commotion on the steps outside the door and went to see who was out there because he wasn’t expecting anyone? Maybe he was opening the door to get some fresh air? Certainly all possibilities. Of course we’ll never know. But I can’t wait for the officers’ testimony. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/49 "2006-12-07T22:07:11Z")
Well, whaddya know… video games _do_ lead to violent behaviour. ---
**Author:** ![Earthworm\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f07891/32.png) [@Earthworm\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earthworm_Jim)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2006, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/50 "2006-12-08T15:28:32Z")
[QUOTE=Ghanima] I’m giving the cops the benefit of the doubt on this one. If it was my husband or dad knocking on the door of a violent criminal known to be armed, I’d sure as hell want him to shoot the guy if there was even a hint of him holding a weapon. I’d much prefer the good guys survive at the end of the day. [/QUOTE] And if my son or brother was answering the door holding a PS3 controller with his dog at his side, I’d sure as hell want them to excersize some restraint and good judgement. If it turns out the cops did something stupid, like bashing down the door even though they heard the dog barking & the kid saying “Give me a second to get the dog under control!” (ie - making a reasonable attempt to cooperate) then I’m going to say they deserve murder charges. If they go around bashing doors down when they have a reasonable expectation that action will **put them** in danger, and **then** shooting whatever happens to be on the other side of that door, they are **not** the good guys. They’re gun-happy buffoons and/or gun-totin idiots, and deserve to be treated as such. Now, if the kid was defiant & yelling things like “You’ll never take me alive!!” that’s a different story. That’s why I wait for more evidence before assigning labels like “good guys” and “bad guys”. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2006, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/51 "2006-12-08T16:00:40Z")
[QUOTE=Ghanima] I’m giving the cops the benefit of the doubt on this one. If it was my husband or dad knocking on the door of a violent criminal known to be armed, I’d sure as hell want him to shoot the guy if there was even a hint of him holding a weapon. I’d much prefer the good guys survive at the end of the day. [/QUOTE] What if your husband or son got shot by the cops for holding a video game controller in his hand as he went to the door? Would you still be so willing to give the cops the benefit of the doubt? ---
**Author:** ![Thalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f475e1/32.png) [@Thalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thalion)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2006, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/52 "2006-12-10T05:39:18Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] Cops must have the worst vision of any occupation. The number of objects which seem to get mistaken for guns (including wallets, game controllers and nothing at all) is staggering. [/QUOTE] I was just rereading this thread and I think we need a cite or definition for this statement. “Staggering”? How many such incidents are there? Can you name more than two or three? While I agree that a single mistake that leads to someone being shot is a tragedy, it is actually incredibly rare. In the US, law enforcement makes hundreds of thousands of citizen contacts every day. Tens of thousands of these contacts could be considered high-risk or high-stress. Yet I can think of only a few well-known incidents where the police shot someone who was actually not armed. It seems obvious to me that these incidents are staggeringly rare, not staggeringly common. When such an incident occurs, it becomes national news instantly. That should tell you how rare they really are. ---
**Author:** ![intention](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e95f7d/32.png) [@intention](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/intention)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2006, 10:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/53 "2006-12-10T10:25:29Z")
Further news [here.](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/08/AR2006120801563.html) The deputy who shot has been fired, the autopsy suggests the victim was shot throught the door, the internet photos were a “prank”, the beat(down) goes on … w. ---
**Author:** ![intention](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e95f7d/32.png) [@intention](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/intention)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2006, 10:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/54 "2006-12-10T10:40:01Z")
Actually, further research shows that three cops fired their weapons … to me the problem is the increasing use of “no-knock” warrants. While they were were looking to arrest the guy for a robbery, no gun was used in the robbery, it was a “6 inch blunt object”. What they also had was a photo of the guy holding a gun. As someone who has held guns many times, this seems awful thin … oh, they also say they had “information” he was was known to carry a gun. We’ll have to wait and see on that one. w. ---
**Author:** ![Earthworm\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f07891/32.png) [@Earthworm\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earthworm_Jim)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2006, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/55 "2006-12-10T16:24:27Z")
From the Washington Post article linked above: > [@](#): > > [Cpl. Christopher Long] was fired Friday following the fatal shooting of a teen suspected of stealing two Sony PlayStation 3 video game consoles…The New Hanover County Sheriff’s Office said the state Bureau of Investigation and the attorney general’s office were conducting a criminal probe into the incident. So, now I’m leaning toward ‘it was murder’. If this incident justifies firing the deputy, surely it justifies criminal charges. I really hope the state doesn’t hold back due to “previous service” or some crap like that. Breaches of trust like this deserve the harshest penalties possible, not coddling. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2006, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/56 "2006-12-10T17:26:15Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] Cops must have the worst vision of any occupation. The number of objects which seem to get mistaken for guns (including wallets, game controllers and nothing at all) is staggering. The sad thing is that all any cop ever has to say is “I thought he had a gun” and it’s an automatic get-out-of-jail card. Like I said, it imposes an impossible negative burden. How can it ever be proven that the shooter didn’t think the victim had a gun? It allows the cops to kill with impunity. As long as they say the magic words, “I thought he had a gun,” nothing will ever happen to them. [/QUOTE] Oh, get off it, **Diogenes**. Kill with impunity, my ass. In your utopian world, all cops would wait until they knew with 100% accuracy whether or not someone had a gun. Of course, by then at least one of them would have been shot. Until someone is secured and handcuffed, ANYTHING in their hands is a weapon. As a cop, you cannot think otherwise. Unless, of course, you want to be referred to as the late Officer Whoever. And if I had come through that door and someone turned toward me with something in their hand like that, I’d have dropped him, too. ---
**Author:** ![Ignatz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/3be4f8/32.png) [@Ignatz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ignatz)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2006, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/57 "2006-12-10T23:49:23Z")
The county sheriff’s deputy, Cpl Chris Long, who shot the fatal bullets, has been fired. According to the autopsy report, bullets passed through the (apparently) closed door before hitting Strickland. The German Shepherd dog was killed outside on the front stoop. No details yet released on whether it had been let out of door or not or if the boy was ever seen by the deputies before the shooting. The boy’s lawyer father is going to “let the system work”. Recent update: [http://www.starnewsonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?ID=/20061210/NEWS/612100434](http://www.starnewsonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?ID=/20061210/NEWS/612100434) ---
**Author:** ![Ignatz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/3be4f8/32.png) [@Ignatz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ignatz)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2006, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/58 "2006-12-10T23:53:28Z")
That cite should have read (without the \< \>) \<[http://www.starnewsonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?ID=/20061210/NEWS/612100434>](http://www.starnewsonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?ID=/20061210/NEWS/612100434>); ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2006, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/59 "2006-12-11T20:07:04Z")
[QUOTE=Mince] In a profession where it is possible to get shot from someone attempting to avoid, say, a _mere_ drunk driving arrest, and given the rapid death-causing nature of firearms, it’s not very surprising some officers don’t hesitate to use their firearm. But I’d also wager that many more law enforcement officers than not, at their own peril, use much more caution than is due. [/QUOTE] Please. This rests on the complete bullshit perception that being a cop is exceptionally dangerous. Police officer doesn’t even make [this](http://money.cnn.com/2005/08/26/pf/jobs_jeopardy/) list of dangerous occupations (or [this](http://money.cnn.com/2006/08/16/pf/2005_most_dangerous_jobs/) one, or [this](http://moneycentral.msn.com/content/invest/extra/P63405.asp) one). It is the perception of their line of work that escalates many of these situations, not reality. About [150](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6762180/) cops are killed on duty every year. Only about a 1/3 of those are from shootings. The likelyhood that a cop will be killed on duty is pretty slim. About [400](http://64.233.187.104/search?q=cache:qgptY9TsVeEJ:www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/pdf/fidc9397.pdf+police+gun+injury&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=1&client=firefox-a) cops are injured by firearms every year. That means that 450 are injured or killed by guns every year (out of about [850k](http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos160.htm)). About the same amount will get colorectal cancer. The number is not insignificant, but not common enough to assume every person you investigate or confront with something shiny in their hands in gonna shoot you. Especially when the suspect is not known to have a gun, and has only committted assault. [QUOTE=Mince] I’m just curious: how many officers, do you think, shoot to kill a suspect _without_ believing the suspect had a dangerous weapon which represented an immediate threat of bodily harm? [/QUOTE] Probably not many, but I would bet most that have shot have also been brainwashed by this notion that their lives are in mortal danger at all times. Which makes it all the more reasonable in thier mind to shoot first before pausing to discern all the facts. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2006, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946/60 "2006-12-11T20:52:42Z")
I should point out that Brickbacon’s list is not adjusted for location. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-kill-suspect-in-ps3-robbery/382946.md?page=4)