# Police response during mass shooting event {Not Gun Control, 2nd Amendment or Politics} **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 26, 2022, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165 "2022-05-26T18:28:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 37
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2022, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/721 "2022-06-10T13:56:36Z")
I don’t believe for one second that he ditched the radios for the reasons he gave. He wanted both hands free in case he needed to fire quickly - , why would he be carrying a radio in his hand to begin with in a world where shoulder microphones exist? Why couldn’t he simply drop it if he had to shoot- surely at some point in his firearms training there was some sort of simulation where you have a ticket book in one hand and a pen in the other when a threat materializes. ( even my employer included that sort of thing in training - and we didn’t have the best firearms training I ever heard of ) Until someone else says he left the radios outside the campus when he arrived , I will believe that he arrived without the radios ( although I don’t understand why he thinks the optics are better if he deliberately left the radios in the car or wherever rather than simply neglecting to take them) > One had a whiplike antenna that would hit him as he ran. The other had a clip that Arredondo knew would cause it to fall off his tactical belt during a long run. Why would he use a clip that would cause the radio to fall off as he ran? And who cares if the antenna is going to hit you as you run? > Arredondo assumed that some other officer or official had taken control of the larger response. He took on the role of a front-line responder. Why would he assume such a thing? He was the chief of the police force responsible for the school. [Texas tribune](https://www.texastribune.org/2022/06/09/uvalde-chief-pete-arredondo-interview/) ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2022, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/722 "2022-06-10T14:42:55Z")
> [@doreen](#): > > Why would he assume such a thing This could be more for the political thread, but maybe because he had been working from the premise that the “School District Police” was just a School Board patronage boondoggle enabled by grants proposals and if some real shit went down some Real Police would take over. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2022, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/723 "2022-06-10T14:51:55Z")
And is there any evidence whatsoever that he did take on the role of a “front-line responder”? One would think that that would involve, you know, responding. ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2022, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/724 "2022-06-10T15:02:32Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > “School District Police” was just a School Board patronage boondoggle Sounds likely ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2022, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/725 "2022-06-10T15:41:01Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > And is there any evidence whatsoever that he did take on the role of a “front-line responder”? One would think that that would involve, you know, responding. - Looking out for your own ass is responding. /s ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2022, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/726 "2022-06-10T15:55:46Z")
The ‘active shooter’ vs ‘barricaded gunman’ debate seems to have disappeared. ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2022, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/727 "2022-06-10T16:22:08Z")
> [@doreen](#): > > Until someone else says he left the radios outside the campus when he arrived , I will believe that he arrived without the radios Me too. He’s given three excuses so far, hit with antenna, fall off his belt, and he knew they didn’t work well in the building. You already did a good job on the first two, but I’m wondering how long he’s known the school police radios didn’t work in the schools? Seems to me that should be right at the top of the list. > [@JRDelirious](#): > > This could be more for the political thread, but maybe because he had been working from the premise that the “School District Police” was just a School Board patronage boondoggle enabled by grants proposals and if some real shit went down some Real Police would take over. I think this is a good possibility because his whole career seems to be about acquiring rank rather than police work. I also note they had to hold a secret swearing in ceremony for his city commission job. Also that he didn’t bother to show up for his first meeting. I wonder if he’s getting paid for not showing up to a job he pursued thru a political campaign. I don’t think he’s under suspension for the shooting, I wonder if he’s not bothering to show for that job while still getting paid too. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2022, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/728 "2022-06-10T17:05:26Z")
Weren’t the swearing in and first city council meeting _after_ the mass shooting? If so, I can understand why he’d want to avoid public events. ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2022, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/729 "2022-06-10T17:16:01Z")
Yes, both of them were after. But both are public facing jobs, and paid by the public. His whole career, like insisting on being called Office Pete, is one pig popularity contest. I’d be a bit pissed if I’d been backing/voting for this guy for a couple of decades and now suddenly he’s not available for anyone, except his lawyer. It’s still not clear if he’s even talked to investigators again after the first interview. A total turnaround from his public appearances before. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2022, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/730 "2022-06-10T17:17:22Z")
Personally I think it’s understandable. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2022, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/731 "2022-06-10T17:24:48Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > is one pig popularity contest. Don’t know if this was a typo, a County Fair reference or a slam on certain cops. It works in all cases. Good job! ---
**Author:** ![BippityBoppityBoo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bippityboppityboo/32/5745_2.png) [@BippityBoppityBoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BippityBoppityBoo)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2022, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/732 "2022-06-10T17:24:57Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > is one pig popularity Did you intend ‘pig’ or ‘big’? ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2022, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/733 "2022-06-10T17:31:02Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Don’t know if this was a typo, a County Fair reference or a slam on certain cops. It works in all cases. Good job! I should claim credit, but it was a typo. 🙁 ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2022, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/734 "2022-06-11T11:13:18Z")
Brilliant typo. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2022, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/735 "2022-06-11T12:50:36Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > You already did a good job on the first two, but I’m wondering how long he’s known the school police radios didn’t work in the schools? Seems to me that should be right at the top of the list Yeah. If the radios are so useless that you know to drop them when there is a crisis, why aren’t you spending every second of non-crisis time demanding working radios? ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2022, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/736 "2022-06-14T19:32:28Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > Yeah. If the radios are so useless that you know to drop them when there is a crisis, why aren’t you spending every second of non-crisis time demanding working radios? Heck, for two hundred bucks he could have bought all officers on his little force TracFones for commo in schools. It’s not like they had to worry about a shooter having the ability to track cellphone conversations. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2022, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/737 "2022-06-14T22:03:22Z")
I know you shouldn’t judge a book by its color, but MAN, those photos of his shaven bullethead w/ wraparound shades above a broad waist just scream “dickish cop.” ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2022, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/738 "2022-06-18T05:59:07Z")
A little bit of an update, [NY Times](https://www.nytimes.com/2022/06/17/us/uvalde-shooting-gunman-police.html). For those that are paywalled: > A city police officer armed with an AR-15-style rifle hesitated when he had a brief chance to shoot the gunman approaching a school in Uvalde, Texas, because he did not want to hit children, according to a senior sheriff’s deputy who spoke to the officer. Not really sure what to think about this, no distance is mentioned. If he was 300 meters, probably best he didn’t shoot. Something under 100 meters, kneeling behind a car that you can use for a rest? Different story. I’m hard pressed to second guess him, he would know best his shooting skills. > Officials have said he was firing at the building and toward a nearby funeral home, but arriving officers believed in the moment that the gunfire was directed at them, said Chief Deputy Sheriff Ricardo Rios of Zavala County, who also responded to the shooting in the neighboring county. It’s confirmed in the story that the third member of the breaching team was an off duty deputy from neighboring Zavala county, Jose Luis Vasquez. He was one shooters along with 2 Border Patrol officers. One carried the shield, the other was the second shooter. > By 12:46 p.m. Chief Arredondo told officers in the hall, way outside the classrooms, who included Deputy Vasquez, who was armed with an AR-15-style rifle and protected by a bulletproof vest, that they could go in. “If y’all are ready to do it, you do it,” Chief Arredondo said, according to a transcript of body camera footage reviewed by The Times. Once again, inspiring speech by Chief Pete. Who still claims he didn’t know he was in charge. It’s pointed out that the ballistic shields were there 45 minutes before breaching the room. So they were waiting on a key that they didn’t even know if they needed. And I still can’t believe nobody on the School District police had a master key. If they don’t have keys for the schools, what difference are they from any other police officers? Of course, it’s possible Chief Pete threw away his keys because they were in his way, like his radios. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2022, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/739 "2022-06-18T19:03:52Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > [Forgot to link to this earlier.](https://www.kxan.com/investigations/dead-suspect-loophole-could-be-used-to-block-release-of-uvalde-records/) Hopefully this won’t be applied here, but I can see why many people involved may want to invoke it. > > > For years, [KXAN investigators have explored Texas law enforcement’s widespread use of an open records measure known as the “Dead Suspect Loophole](https://www.kxan.com/denied/).” Lawmakers have repeatedly sought to close the loophole, which allows police to withhold information in closed criminal cases that don’t go through the court process — even when a suspect dies in police custody. > > > > After the Uvalde school shooting and the gunman’s death, some transparency advocates — even Texas House Speaker Dade Phelan — worry police may try to use the loophole to keep important details about what really happened from the public and even victims’ families. [NPR is reporting](https://www.npr.org/2022/06/18/1106017340/uvalde-legal-loophole-mass-shooting-records) that Uvalde officials _are_ trying to use the dead suspect loophole to prevent the release of information. ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2022, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165/740 "2022-06-18T19:52:30Z")
And they have quite a list of objections: > The city and its police department are arguing against the release of the requested records, citing the following reasons: the city is being sued, some individuals’ criminal history records could include “highly embarrassing information”; some of the information could reveal police “methods, techniques, and strategies for preventing and predicting crime,” could cause “emotional/mental distress,” “is not of legitimate concern to the public,” could subject city employees or officers to “a substantial threat of physical harm,” and violates individuals’ common-law right to privacy. City officials have also refused to release more details, reasoning that it would interfere with the ongoing investigation by the Texas Department of Public Safety, Uvalde County’s district attorney and the FBI. The “protection of police methods … for preventing and predicting crime” is a real LOL. Right now it appears they have none, I wonder what the truth would show? I wonder if federal law automatically trumps state law in this case or if there will be a bunch of court battles. Who knows how long that could drag out. Pardon me for being cynical, but the longer the locals hold out, the more time to manipulate stories and evidence. I think the whole of the Uvalde police force was forbidden from talking to anyone until just a couple days ago. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165.md?page=36) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/police-response-during-mass-shooting-event-not-gun-control-2nd-amendment-or-politics/965165.md?page=38)