# "Polite" things that are actually impolite **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 15, 2016, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951 "2016-08-15T20:23:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/201 "2016-08-18T17:09:17Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > The delicious part is that the bride would have no idea she’s being insulted. Nor would anyone else, in all likelihood. How dare we not read the WASP etiquette guides so that someone can insult us by offering us congratulations and trying to shake our hands? HOW DARE WE? ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/202 "2016-08-18T17:15:20Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > The delicious part is that the bride would have no idea she’s being insulted. Nor would anyone else, in all likelihood. If she didn’t already know, she would soon be told by the groom’s family. If she was lucky. Otherwise the round of social shunning afterward would make the point. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/203 "2016-08-18T17:18:05Z")
> [@Martian Bigfoot](#): > > So… you observed them say “congratulations”. But where did you get the information about their intent? Did you ask them? Read their minds? Or are you just making up things in your head? One can tell by the way they trashed the bride in more private settings and otherwise shunned her socially there after. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/204 "2016-08-18T17:18:22Z")
**ZPG Zealot** , \*why \*are handshakes and bridal congratulations the hill you want to die on? ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/205 "2016-08-18T17:25:15Z")
> [@Martian Bigfoot](#): > > So… you observed them say “congratulations”. But where did you get the information about their intent? Did you ask them? Read their minds? Or are you just making up things in your head? I once saw a Gamma Mu Mu reorient someone’s shrimp fork, which of course meant that the shrimp forker was calling the shrimp forkee an itinerant cobbler whose mother was an unwed muleteer with less than perfect dentition whose favorite color was purple! CAN YOU IMAGINE? And the forkee’s daughter was there, so the mother forker was sure there would be fisticuffs aplenty! But then I saved the day by pretending to stumble and disrupting the forkee’s entire placement by knocking the fork off! And then the servers put it all back where it was supposed to be and two hundred three people came up to me later and said that I had saved the day through etiquette, but the forkee told me she hadn’t noticed the shrimp fork and wouldn’t have cared. Which is how I know that her mother really was a muleteer. The NERVE of people who can’t be insulted through petty backbiting nonsense! ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Panic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/don_t_panic/32/398_2.png) [@Don\_t\_Panic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Panic)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/206 "2016-08-18T17:25:55Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > If she didn’t already know, she would soon be told by the groom’s family. If she was lucky. Otherwise the round of social shunning afterward would make the point. > [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > One can tell by the way they trashed the bride in more private settings and otherwise shunned her socially there after. Did you observe any of the later interactions between the bride and the groom’s family? Did you observe any of the social shunning, or are you making inferences? Did you observe any of the trashing in private settings? Were you present for any of that? How are you getting your information? ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/207 "2016-08-18T17:28:07Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > **ZPG Zealot** , \*why \*are handshakes and bridal congratulations the hill you want to die on? Because the right of a woman to have a job, have a career, and just interact with the world, should not require she sacrifice her sexual morality. Because no one, absolutely no one, has the right to touch a woman without her express, explicit permission. Congratulating the bride irritates me because of the marriage is legal prostitution implications. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/208 "2016-08-18T17:29:29Z")
If all that’s true, you hang out with a pretty shameful group of people. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/209 "2016-08-18T17:34:42Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > Because the right of a woman to have a job, have a career, and just interact with the world, should not require she sacrifice her sexual morality. Because no one, absolutely no one, has the right to touch a woman without her express, explicit permission. Congratulating the bride irritates me because of the marriage is legal prostitution implications. Gotta create those implications and spread them around lest some women go through life unaware they are thought of as whores. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/210 "2016-08-18T17:37:12Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > Because the right of a woman to have a job, have a career, and just interact with the world, should not require she sacrifice her sexual morality. Because no one, absolutely no one, has the right to touch a woman without her express, explicit permission. Congratulating the bride irritates me because of the marriage is legal prostitution implications. Are you saying that a woman is forced to take a man’s hand if he offers it, or are you saying that there are men going around in society grabbing women’s hands and forcing them to shake? ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/211 "2016-08-18T17:37:49Z")
> [@Martian Bigfoot](#): > > Did you observe any of the later interactions between the bride and the groom’s family? Did you observe any of the social shunning, or are you making inferences? Did you observe any of the trashing in private settings? Were you present for any of that? How are you getting your information? Oh hell, yes. I shared my (TA) office with a Kappa Delta. More than once I overheard how they plan to humiliate someone. Also, my work as an advisor (non-academic) frequently gave me a window into what was happening in people’s lives. I’ve listened to mother-in-laws plot ways to get rid of daughter-in-laws they don’t want. I’ve listened to the outcast women cry about their social isolation, their in-laws hatred, and sometimes worse, about the husbands who divorced them because they decided they were eventually too great of liabilities to their careers or social status. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/212 "2016-08-18T17:39:29Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > I’m amused when people think WASP etiquette guides are holy writ. > . What WASP? It’s really some made up minor rule that nobody really gives a shit about. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/213 "2016-08-18T17:40:19Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Are you saying that a woman is forced to take a man’s hand if he offers it, or are you saying that there are men going around in society grabbing women’s hands and forcing them to shake? I have been fired from jobs because I refused to shake a man’s hand. That should be illegal. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/214 "2016-08-18T17:40:50Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > Oh hell, yes. I shared my (TA) office with a Kappa Delta. More than once I overheard how they plan to humiliate someone. Also, my work as an advisor (non-academic) frequently gave me a window into what was happening in people’s lives. I’ve listened to mother-in-laws plot ways to get rid of daughter-in-laws they don’t want. I’ve listened to the outcast women cry about their social isolation, their in-laws hatred, and sometimes worse, about the husbands who divorced them because they decided they were eventually too great of liabilities to their careers or social status. I see why you have decided these WASPs should be the arbiters of all things etiquette-related. They sound lovely! ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Panic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/don_t_panic/32/398_2.png) [@Don\_t\_Panic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Panic)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/215 "2016-08-18T17:41:08Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > Also, my work as an advisor (non-academic) […] What do you mean by “advisor (non-academic)”? Could you give us more details about this position? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/216 "2016-08-18T17:46:05Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > How dare we not read the WASP … Maybe you could tone down the bigotry a bit? Please? ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Panic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/don_t_panic/32/398_2.png) [@Don\_t\_Panic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Panic)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/217 "2016-08-18T17:46:51Z")
Also, **ZPG Zealot** , I’m puzzled by the idea that the only possible roles for a women in a relationship is prostitute or rape victim. If you say “congratulations” to a man, you are presumably not calling him a male prostitute. So why the double standard? Are you saying that it’s impossible for women to want to actively seek out a partner, for non-prostitution related purposes? (Yeah, I know that such an idea might seem crazy, but…) ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/218 "2016-08-18T17:52:41Z")
By advisor, you mean card reader or fortune teller, right? ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/219 "2016-08-18T17:53:24Z")
> [@Martian Bigfoot](#): > > What do you mean by “advisor (non-academic)”? Could you give us more details about this position? Search the Dope for my “Ask the fortune teller thread.” I have had clients that ranged from millionaires to the people who cleaned the millionaire’s houses (and sometimes the people the wealthy wouldn’t even hire to work for them). It has provided an interesting window in to humanity because people tell me what they really feel and believe, not what they admit to others. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2016, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951/220 "2016-08-18T17:59:52Z")
> [@Martian Bigfoot](#): > > Also, **ZPG Zealot** , I’m puzzled by the idea that the only possible roles for a women in a relationship is prostitute or rape victim. > > If you say “congratulations” to a man, you are presumably not calling him a male prostitute. So why the double standard? Are you saying that it’s impossible for women to want to actively seek out a partner, for non-prostitution related purposes? > > (Yeah, I know that such an idea might seem crazy, but…) One should not imply that the bride was so crass as to choose her partner for such reasons as salary expectations, social standing, etc. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/polite-things-that-are-actually-impolite/762951.md?page=12)