# Political Correctness ruining the US (or at least the holidays?) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 20, 2013, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371 "2013-11-20T19:14:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Blackberry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecd19e/32.png) [@Blackberry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blackberry)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/41 "2013-11-21T04:12:58Z")
Sarah Palin just came out with a book called[Good Tidings and Great Joy: Protecting the Heart of Christmas](http://smile.amazon.com/Good-Tidings-Great-Joy-Protecting-ebook/dp/B00BW3AY5K/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1385006937&sr=1-1&keywords=sarah+palin) about this subject only ridiculous bullshit. Even if, in some bizarre world, it wasn’t ridiculous bullshit, who the hell would want to read a whole book about that? ---
**Author:** ![crypto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@crypto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crypto)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/42 "2013-11-21T04:14:41Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > 😕 Why would you think the two words were mutually exclusive? I thought (quite wrongly, I see) that being Jewish meant that you believed in the O.T., and all that goes with it. Moses, being lost in the desert for 40 years, all that. > [@Green\_Bean](#): > > Really? I’m not sure I know any Jews that _aren’t_ atheists, or at least non-theistic. Remember that Jewish isn’t just a religion but a culture. Plenty of folks are culturally Jewish, including observing holidays, but don’t actually believe in the supernatural stuff. > > FWIW, I’d throw myself into the non-theistic Jew category. I don’t care enough to be an actual atheist. Aren’t the holidays tied to religious events? > [@Terr](#): > > You know, truthfully, I don’t remember any Happy Hanukkah signs in offices (and Hanukkah is really a minor holiday) or signs for any other holidays. But if there were one, I am pretty sure there would be no complaints from anyone. > Jewish identity is tribal, not religious. You’re born a Jew, you’re a Jew, whatever your religion is. Wait. If you are born a Jew, you are a Jew, whatever your religion is? So you could be a jew that is catholic? How does that work? And if you denounce judaism, you are still a jew? So it’s more like a nationality than anything? (I.e. You were born in Poland to Polish parents, so you are polish. If your mother happens to be jewish, you are a polish jew, but you don’t have to believe or follow anything regarding the religious part of being jewish? ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/43 "2013-11-21T04:24:53Z")
> [@Blackberry](#): > > Sarah Palin just came out with a book called[Good Tidings and Great Joy: Protecting the Heart of Christmas](http://smile.amazon.com/Good-Tidings-Great-Joy-Protecting-ebook/dp/B00BW3AY5K/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1385006937&sr=1-1&keywords=sarah+palin) about this subject only ridiculous bullshit. Even if, in some bizarre world, it wasn’t ridiculous bullshit, who the hell would want to read a whole book about that? Bless her heart, she knows that the people who will buy this book won’t ever _read_ it; it’s just a status thing they can show other oppressed Christians. I loved reading the reviews! ---
**Author:** ![Blackberry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecd19e/32.png) [@Blackberry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blackberry)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/44 "2013-11-21T04:32:13Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Bless her heart, she knows that the people who will buy this book won’t ever _read_ it; it’s just a status thing they can show other oppressed Christians. Silly you. It includes more than a dozen family photos, obviously people are going to want to read it. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/45 "2013-11-21T04:47:32Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I fixed your OP, but I now think you’re worse than three Hitlers. Side by side, or atop one another (and possibly wearing an oversized Gestapo trench coat) ? This is important. ---
**Author:** ![Green\_Bean](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_bean/32/1760_2.png) [@Green\_Bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Bean)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/46 "2013-11-21T04:48:18Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > Aren’t the holidays tied to religious events? Well, yeah, but that doesn’t mean that there’s anything that would be offensive about the word “holiday” to a non-insane Jew. > [@](#): > > Wait. If you are born a Jew, you are a Jew, whatever your religion is? So you could be a jew that is catholic? How does that work? And if you denounce judaism, you are still a jew? So it’s more like a nationality than anything? (I.e. You were born in Poland to Polish parents, so you are polish. If your mother happens to be jewish, you are a polish jew, but you don’t have to believe or follow anything regarding the religious part of being jewish? Your questions can not be answered. Jews are an incredibly diverse group. There is no central authority stating who is and is not a Jew. There are many groups within the larger Jewish community who have particular standards, however. The religion vs. tribe thing is a really common and complex debate, and someone can probably point you to some previous threads on the topic. I personally tend to favor the cultural/tribal side, but legitimate religious conversion to Judaism gets you into the club without reservation, IMHO. So in my world: Drake = Jewish (Jewish mother and upbringing).Sammy Davis, Jr. = Jewish (by conversion). Rashida Jones = Jewish (Jewish mother and upbringing). Lenny Kravitz = Jewish (Jewish father, Christian upbringing, but he embraces his Jewish heritage and c’mon–his name is Lenny Kravitz) Slash = Not Jewish. (That’s just a rumor. His first name may be Saul, but he’s Jewish in neither religion nor background. I wish it was true, though, because Slash is awesome.) A black-hat orthodox Jew might have a very different interpretation of these things. ---
**Author:** ![Cinnamon\_Imp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/58956e/32.png) [@Cinnamon\_Imp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cinnamon_Imp)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/47 "2013-11-21T07:30:14Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Isn’t holiday a _completely_ secular term? I’m hoping that t his is a whoosh, and that the etymology of “holy day”/holiday hasn’t completely escaped you. From wiki - “The word originally referred only to special religious days” ---
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 8:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/48 "2013-11-21T08:34:22Z")
OP, can’t you just tell people it’s their problem and not yours? ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 9:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/49 "2013-11-21T09:18:42Z")
Well, it’s NEVER been the OP’s problem. He’s telling us about something that happened to his wife. ---
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 9:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/50 "2013-11-21T09:31:37Z")
Editorially “his” problem. Now that we’re past that, what? ---
**Author:** ![Ranger\_Jeff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranger_jeff/32/2065_2.png) [@Ranger\_Jeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranger_Jeff)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/51 "2013-11-21T12:47:30Z")
I think of myself as a “Non-observant Jew”. My brother once asked me if I was still circumcised. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/52 "2013-11-21T13:05:06Z")
> [@Cinnamon\_Imp](#): > > I’m hoping that t his is a whoosh, and that the etymology of “holy day”/holiday hasn’t completely escaped you. > > From wiki - “The word originally referred only to special religious days” I’m well aware of the etymology but the term is used in the US and elsewhere to refer to secular, civic days. Note that wiki said “_originally_.” ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/53 "2013-11-21T14:54:04Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > Well how about Barney? To each a happy Barney! Yeah, why not? Who could be offended by that? If you’ve ever been discriminated against by a large purple dinosaur, then you wouldn’t’ve\* even thought to issue such a hurtful and hateful screed. Merry Melkor to you! - what? It’s a real contraction.\*\* Or are you a racist? \*\*no it isn’t, Data ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/54 "2013-11-21T14:55:33Z")
> [@Ranger\_Jeff](#): > > I think of myself as a “Non-observant Jew”… Does that mean you’re invisible? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/55 "2013-11-21T14:56:39Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > Yes indeedy. At the Bronx Zoo, they have had an annual event for as long as I can remember called “Holiday Lights”. I’d respect them a little more if they just broke down and called it “Christmas Lights.” There’s never a single Hanukkah or Kwanzaa or any non-Christmas holiday decoration. The music that’s constantly playing is all Christmas. (and worse, it’s the same half-dozen or so songs, over and over. By the time we leave the zoo, I have usually wished about ninety different and imaginative tortures on the composers of “Jingle Bell Rock.”) This. I am an atheist. While I am not offended if someone says “Merry Christmas”, I can of understand people who are. But this blanket replacement of “Christmas” with “Holiday” is really, really dumb. Like renaming French things “Freedom” dumb. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/56 "2013-11-21T15:07:06Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > This. I am an atheist. While I am not offended if someone says “Merry Christmas”, … Merry Christmas Fuckwad! ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/57 "2013-11-21T15:09:47Z")
Awww, shucks. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/58 "2013-11-21T15:13:48Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Awww, shucks. 🙂 I’m offended by that smilie. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/59 "2013-11-21T15:18:26Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > I’m offended by that smilie. If only we had a more inclusive smiley, maybe a happy orthodox jewish guy… ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2013, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371/60 "2013-11-21T15:35:32Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Jewish identity is tribal, not religious. You’re born a Jew, you’re a Jew, whatever your religion is. This is the correct halakhahic statement in the Conservative and Orthodox traditions, but I don’t believe it’s an accurate statement of Reform practice. See, e.g., Contemporary American Reform Responsa, number 68: > [@](#): > > For us in the Jewish community anyone who claims that Jesus is their savior is no longer a Jew and is an apostate. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-correctness-ruining-the-us-or-at-least-the-holidays/674371.md?page=4)