# Political "gaffes" that were not actually gaffes **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [August 6, 2018, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156 "2018-08-06T04:02:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Anny\_Middon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bc79bd/32.png) [@Anny\_Middon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anny_Middon)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2018, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/41 "2018-08-07T20:41:31Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > If you read his full quote, the story is very clear. It’s not that he didn’t know any women to fill the cabinet, it’s that he didn’t have any personal list of people at all to fill the cabinet. So, he asked his people to provide him with good options, and they came back with a bunch of men. He asked for more qualified women, and reached out to women’s groups. And qualified women were so easy to find that he was provided binders full of them. I find his reaction and his statement are entirely admirable, and no, I did not vote for him. You’re right – if you read the full story, it’s very clear: He asked his people to provide him with good options **and they came back with a bunch of men**. Why didn’t they – presumably knowing what was important to him – come back with a list that included a significant number of women? Who were these people of his? Because I suspect that if that group included a number of women, so would the lists they came back with. You seem to think it’s admirable that after he asked (and only after he asked) he was presented with a list of women. I think it’s telling (and somewhat deplorable) that he had to ask for women to be included as candidates. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2018, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/42 "2018-08-08T00:29:59Z")
> [@Anny\_Middon](#): > > You seem to think it’s admirable that after he asked (and only after he asked) he was presented with a list of women. I think it’s telling (and somewhat deplorable) that he had to ask for women to be included as candidates. How does that reflect on Romney though? If I ask people to provide a list of candidates for a job, and they bring me a list of mostly men, and I subsequently ask for women to consider, how is that my fault? ---
**Author:** ![jaycat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jaycat/32/3015_2.png) [@jaycat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jaycat)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2018, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/43 "2018-08-08T02:40:40Z")
> [@E-DUB](#): > > What Dukakiss should have said: > > “First of all, personally, I’d want to kill the son of a bitch. But the law doesn’t exist as an instrument of personal vengeance, for me or for anybody else. And I recognize that even if others don’t. Secondly, asking a presidential candidate to speculate on how he’d feel if his wife were raped and murdered is an appalling question and you should be ashamed of yourself for asking it.” That would have worked. But displaying that much balls is not what Democrats do. ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2018, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/44 "2018-08-08T03:17:24Z")
> [@Anny\_Middon](#): > > You’re right – if you read the full story, it’s very clear: He asked his people to provide him with good options **and they came back with a bunch of men**. > > Why didn’t they – presumably knowing what was important to him – come back with a list that included a significant number of women? Who were these people of his? Because I suspect that if that group included a number of women, so would the lists they came back with. > > You seem to think it’s admirable that after he asked (and only after he asked) he was presented with a list of women. I think it’s telling (and somewhat deplorable) that he had to ask for women to be included as candidates. This kind of hair splitting is beyond absurd; Romney’s quote blew up because of the weird word “binders”, not the actual message behind it. The idea of Romney literally rummaging through binders, plus the awkward phrasing of “full of women”, is what made people think it was a ridiculous quote. That’s all. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2018, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/45 "2018-08-08T03:41:14Z")
> [@BrotherCadfael](#): > > Both of these would have been excellent responses. A natural politician like Bill Clinton would have responded in that vein without a moment’s hesitation. Bill Clinton would have avoided the question entirely by having some prisoners killed to prove how tough he was. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2018, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/46 "2018-08-08T03:47:13Z")
> [@Mr.Bill](#): > > Example 1: Except that Romney was not talking about the ordinary people who make up corporations. He was talking about Citizens United, which was about allowing corporations to spend money to influence elections. Do you think the assembly line worker and the janitor are involved in that? He was being heckled at the Iowa State Fair. He had made a pledge not to raise taxes not too long before it, and people were criticizing him for that, saying that we needed more money to pay for Social Security and Medicare. He said something like, “There are various ways [of securing Social Security and Medicare]. One way is to raise taxes on people.” At which point, he was interrupted by somebody saying “Corporations”, and that’s when he said the “Corporations are people, my friend” and went on to answer that all the money corporations make goes to people. Here’s the bit: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/St1wSWtm_BI/maxresdefault.jpg "Mitt Romney: "Corporations are people, my friend"") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=St1wSWtm_BI) ---
**Author:** ![Anny\_Middon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bc79bd/32.png) [@Anny\_Middon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anny_Middon)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2018, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/47 "2018-08-08T15:29:28Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > How does that reflect on Romney though? If I ask people to provide a list of candidates for a job, and they bring me a list of mostly men, and I subsequently ask for women to consider, how is that my fault? When you asked for a list of candidates, what criteria did you give? Was diversity one of those criteria? If not, why not? ---
**Author:** ![Brayne\_Ded](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Brayne\_Ded](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brayne_Ded)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2018, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/48 "2018-08-08T15:36:22Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Regardless of whether Kennedy called himself a jelly donut or not, it certainly wasn’t a gaffe, since it went over very well with his audience. They knew that he wasn’t speaking his native language (and heck, the fact that he was speaking their language at all was already a point in his favor), and so were willing to forgive him for a grammatical slip. The people who live in Berlin call themselves Berliner (no ‘s’ for the plural in German). Obviously, there is the potential for a somewhat adolescent pun, but that would apply just as much as if a German had said it. I don’t see it as a gaffe, and nor did his audience. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2018, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/49 "2018-08-08T16:32:21Z")
> [@Anny\_Middon](#): > > When you asked for a list of candidates, what criteria did you give? Was diversity one of those criteria? If not, why not? This is really, really nitpicky, and about three steps removed from what the “gaffe” actually was, which was the term “binders full of women” and had nothing to do with criteria for candidates. But, no, my first instinct in asking for candidates would not be (and I’ve hired multiple people in the past and can say that it was not) to specifically ask for female candidates. Again, I have zero problem with how Romney comported himself for this supposed gaffe, and feel it reflected more poorly on those that made a big deal about it than it did on Romney. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2018, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/50 "2018-08-08T16:49:51Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > OK, in 2012, anyone who is literally using either binders or rolodexes to keep track of peoples’ contact information, is fucked up. I think we can agree on that. Was Romney listening to cassette tapes of Hootie and the Blowfish while he was going through the binders? I sometimes call my LinkedIn my “rolodex”. Just like we still dial phones. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Greenjeans](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.greenjeans/32/551_2.png) [@Mr.Greenjeans](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Greenjeans)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2018, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/51 "2018-08-08T17:08:03Z")
I always thought that Obama’s “[57 states](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/57-states/)” comment was a joke about having been to so many states he couldn’t count them. His joke was in the same vein as Steve Martin’s “Vegas” bit from the \*Let’s Get Small \*album: > [@Steve Martin](#): > > In Las Vegas it’s fifteen dollars to get in. You know, it’s worth it because there’s a million people on stage and every thing’s moving real fast and you can’t understand a word they say but it doesn’t matter and you just sit there and you go, “Wow. Look at the tits. I’ll bet there’s…57 tits up there.” ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2018, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/52 "2018-08-08T18:40:32Z")
> [@Mr.Greenjeans](#): > > I always thought that Obama’s “[57 states](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/57-states/)” comment was a joke about having been to so many states he couldn’t count them. His joke was in the same vein as Steve Martin’s “Vegas” bit from the \*Let’s Get Small \*album: If you listen to the actual quote, it looks like he means to say 47, but the 50 slips out, and he tries to correct himself awkwardly. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2018, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/53 "2018-08-08T22:00:34Z")
I thought that that was actually meant to refer to 57 primaries, since the Democratic Party holds primaries in some non-state territories like Guam and Puerto Rico. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2018, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/54 "2018-08-08T22:45:56Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I thought that that was actually meant to refer to 57 primaries, since the Democratic Party holds primaries in some non-state territories like Guam and Puerto Rico. The quote was: > [@](#): > > It is just wonderful to be back in Oregon, and over the last fifteen months, we’ve traveled to every corner of the United States. I’ve now been in, uh, fifty…seven states? I think one left to go…one left to go, Alaska and Hawaii, I was not allowed to go to even though I really wanted to visit, but my staff would not, uh, justify it. He was overtired, meant to say forty-seven, and just slipped up. It happens. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2018, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/55 "2018-08-08T23:17:09Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > This kind of hair splitting is beyond absurd; Romney’s quote blew up because of the weird word “binders”, not the actual message behind it. The idea of Romney literally rummaging through binders, plus the awkward phrasing of “full of women”, is what made people think it was a ridiculous quote. That’s all. This exactly. It took off because it was a weird, awkward statement, and people made [Stupid Statement Dance Mixes](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/StupidStatementDanceMix) out of it. It hit just like any other Internet meme: Somewhat odd thing which is a bit funny gets remixed and repeated until it’s weird and stupid by definition, regardless of how defensible the original statement was or wasn’t, and thus is _made into_ a stupid thing to have said. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2018, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/56 "2018-08-08T23:25:56Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > Howard Dean’s “Yeee-Haaaw!” moment from the 2004 campaign. It was awkward, it made for a bad sound bite when taken out of context but it was just him getting fired up. Hardly an unwanted quality in a candidate, much less a gaffe. Such a shame it got blown up somehow, I think Dean would have done far better than Kerry. He was actually engaging and seemed to have some newish ideas. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2018, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/57 "2018-08-09T00:15:56Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > Furthermore, AIUI, it was the ship crew that decided to put that banner there. Bush didn’t ask for it. Cite? I know the White House later made that unsubstantiated claim after receiving criticism, but I’m not aware of any evidence to that effect. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2018, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/58 "2018-08-09T02:59:33Z")
> [@Brayne\_Ded](#): > > The people who live in Berlin call themselves Berliner (no ‘s’ for the plural in German). Obviously, there is the potential for a somewhat adolescent pun, but that would apply just as much as if a German had said it. I don’t see it as a gaffe, and nor did his audience. Agreed. It’s the equivalent of a foreign speaker giving a speech in Manhattan and saying something like “in this day, the most ambitious people are New Yorkers. If that be true, then I’m a New Yorker” and having people later laugh at him for calling himself a magazine. “He should have said I’m from New York.” Yeah, it was a rhetorical flourish. You are really reaching here. … I think that’s probably true of many gaffes. They are taken out of context, or spun, by opponents to make somebody look bad. Take Dean’s scream. As I understand it, he yelled in a loud room, but media outlets isolated his microphone to exaggerate the sound and make him sound “crazy”. Now, Dukakis with the helmet. That’s a legit unforced error. Anybody who saw Dukakis in that helmet should have realized that it wasn’t a good look. Didn’t they do a dry run? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2018, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/59 "2018-08-09T13:51:28Z")
I think the analogous statement would have to be “… then I’m the New Yorker”. But yeah, a grammatical error, but not a big one. Kennedy’s “Berliner” comment might be good for a few jokes, but like I said, it wasn’t a gaffe. ---
**Author:** ![Atomic\_Alex](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atomic_alex/32/175_2.png) [@Atomic\_Alex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atomic_Alex)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2018, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156/60 "2018-08-10T19:25:21Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > Remember [Dukakis wearing the tank helmet?](https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2013/11/dukakis-and-the-tank-099119) > I thought it was a bit silly, and totally unnecessary, but I don’t see why it had to be a career-killer. I was going to mention that one, another is Jimmy Carter and the rabbit. Now granted I only became aware of these incidents after the fact _(not having been born for the second example and nought but little sprout for the first)_ so there may have been a context I’m missing but it does seem to be mountain out of mole-hill time. I also think a lot of the critical commentary on George W. Bush and the children’s book he was reading at the time of being informed of the 9/11 attacks is also somewhat unfair, and I’m no particular fan of his. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/political-gaffes-that-were-not-actually-gaffes/819156.md?page=4)